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Capture 23.976 NTSC with Sony HDW-1800 (including HKDW-104 Board)

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Ryan Krumm
Capture 23.976 NTSC with Sony HDW-1800 (including HKDW-104 Board)
on Feb 9, 2012 at 10:11:04 pm

Hi Everyone,

This is an issue I've been researching for awhile and although I've found posts related to this, I haven't found one that has my specific variables.

I am trying to capture 1080 23.976p at a low resolution to save hard drive space. We have the Sony HDW1800 tape deck with the additional HKDW-104 board, which allows for pull-down to be added to HD and SD SDI outputs. The board offers three output modes:

24PD mode: The signals output from the HDSDI output
connectors are post-pulldown 1080/60i signals. SD
signals (SDI, composite) are not output.

23.98PD1 mode: The signals output from the HDSDI
output connectors are post-pulldown 1080/59.94i
signals. The signals output from the SD output
connectors (SDI, composite) are 480/59.94i signals
which have been down converted after pulldown.

23.98PD2 mode: The signals output from the HDSDI
output connectors are pre-pulldown 1080/23.98PsF
signals. The signals output from the SD output
connectors (SDI, composite) are 480/59.94i signals
which have been down converted after pulldown.

I've test both 23.98PD1 and 23.98PD2 modes and compared it to the full HD footage. I digitized a countdown, given the ability to easily sync the footage, as well as 3 minutes of raw footage. Unfortunately, I ran into some problems.

With the 23.98PD1, it was in sync with the HD until a point and then it was a field or frame off -- it's hard to tell. Coincidently (or maybe not so coincidently), the point at which the footage goes out of sync is right when it cuts to another take. At the point of that cut, a field from the next take is merged with the last field of the previous take. If it helps, this frame is listed as D2 frame in Avid.

With the 23.98PD2, it was never quite in sync and when I tested the countdown, the pull-down actually omitted the last :02 beep frame from the countdown.

My Film Setting in Avid set to Standard 2:3:2:3 pulldown and the phase is to A.

Does anyone have any experience with this situation or any information that may help?

Tech Specs
MC 5.5.2.1
Avid Nitris DX
HDW-1800 (with HKDW-104 Board)


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Michael Phillips
Re: Capture 23.976 NTSC with Sony HDW-1800 (including HKDW-104 Board)
on Feb 10, 2012 at 12:05:03 am

Are you set up correctly with blackburst? May require tri-level sync. Especially if it starts off correctly then loses it.

Try a batch capture where you log 5 clips the following way. I am using 01:00:00:00 as an example, but as long as the frame count is the same, the HH:MM:SS can be whatever you have on the tape:

01:00:00:00 A
01:00:00:00 B
01:00:00:00 C
01:00:00:00 D
00:59:59:29 B

And see if any of the captures are correct.

Michael

Michael Phillips


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Ryan Krumm
Re: Capture 23.976 NTSC with Sony HDW-1800 (including HKDW-104 Board)
on Mar 2, 2012 at 5:25:31 pm

Thanks Michael!

Sorry it took so long to get back to you. I was testing this in our down time and then we got REALLY busy. I was able to get a 23.976p NTSC to sync with the 1080p/23.976 clip. I achieved this using the Pulldown Out option on the HDW-1800 and Standard Pulldown in Avid's Film Settings.

The only problem now is that when I just to online the 23.976p NTSC clip to 1080p/23.976, I get the following error:

Error on clip
This clip cannot be batch captured because you are in a 1080p/23.976 project and this is not a 1080p/23.976 clip.


I'm starting to you think that you cannot do online offline with 23.976 like you can with NTSC.

Any ideas?

Thanks again.


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Michael Phillips
Re: Capture 23.976 NTSC with Sony HDW-1800 (including HKDW-104 Board)
on Mar 2, 2012 at 6:31:38 pm

Open the bin with the sequence in a 1080p/23.976 project. Right click the sequence and select "modify". Then select format and 1980p/23.976. This will properly convert all the 30fpsNDF timecode to 24 and make it a native HD for batch capture.

Michael

Michael Phillips


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Ryan Krumm
Re: Capture 23.976 NTSC with Sony HDW-1800 (including HKDW-104 Board)
on Apr 18, 2012 at 7:31:53 pm

Thanks again, Mike.

And sorry, again -- I got swamped.

So modifying the sequence before decomposing it worked!

However, I've run a test with a longer clip (2:30) and the 23.976 NTSC is still not completely in sync with the 1080p/23.976. It is the occasional field or frame. I've tested with with both of the HDW-1800's pulldown modes, with both standard pulldown and advanced as well as with phases A,B,C, and D.

At this point, I'm not sure if it will ever be completely in sync. But more importantly, after the online, it was in sync with the original so I guess it doesn't matter.

Thanks again for all your help!


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