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aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?

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Martijn Scholte
aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 22, 2008 at 1:12:50 pm

hi there
strange thing i noticed when capturing EE from our EX1
i use on cam the 1080 25p setup and aja sees this as i singal so far so good (the i is i think because the output on the EX1 is 25psf)
but what i dontlike is the mesage from the io control panel that states the signal is 8b(i made sure directly via email from sony that the hdsdi out is 10 bit 422.)

i did test
captured 3 x same footage and yes
10bit 8 bit and from card
and noticed the substancial difference in the colour channels yust like expected happy happy

first i was wondering about that the 8b might not mean 8bit but was som other sort of sign

when i had the io control panel open and also fcp in a 10 bit setup
i noticed when i hide fcp the io control panel is changed from YUV 10b tu YUV 8b

is the aja box not capabel of 10bit input in 1080i25 or did sony lied about this or might there be something else?

what i really dont understand is that when capturing the 3 test files i could see difference between 8 and 10 bit in the colour channels
i wonder if this difference could be from only capturing a 8 bit signal in a 10bit space?


on fresh hdv i also saw the video where the ex3 was introduced and where sony' vp of cameras told us the hdsdi out is 10bit 422
i guess he wont be lying

only thing i dont know fore sure is if im always in EE if not in record mode but from my test it looks like that


thanks for your feedback


Martijn

one more thing i can als capture 1080i25 10bit uncompressed is this only a proress signal put into 10bit space or has it real advantage?
(and lot more space needed :)










The box said 'Requires Windows 95, or better.' So I bought a Macintosh.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 22, 2008 at 2:20:06 pm

You can only capture ProRes in HD with the ioHD as an uncompressed video stream will not fit down a fw800 pipe.

Now, as far as 10bit vs 8bit, hwat are you using to capture your media with? FCP? VTR Exchange?

Jeremy


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Martijn Scholte
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 22, 2008 at 8:02:15 pm

hi Jeremy

thanks for answering
I use a Sony EX1 camera in EE mode as input for the IO HD

cheers
Martijn


1 direct received direct email answer from sony guy here in europe
"It's 4:2:2 and 10bit quality when the signal is output as E/E & 4:2:0/8bit when played back from SxS because of the compression process."

The box said 'Requires Windows 95, or better.' So I bought a Macintosh.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 22, 2008 at 8:18:12 pm

Hey Martin, I understand what you are trying to do. I do it a lot and the quality is great.

The ioHD will not capture 10 bit uncompressed in HD, but it will capture ProRes or HQ (that is also 10bit).

So, I ask again, what program are you using to do the captures. Final Cut Pro? VTR Exchange? I want to make sure you are set up properly.

Thanks,

Jeremy


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Carsten Orlt
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 2:21:42 am

Doesn't E/E mean: electronic to electronic, old term from tape time meaning the output signal of a device is directly taken from the input of the device, not from tape.

In your case this would mean: when playing back your SxS footage the output is 8 bit. When you connect an input signal to the camera the signal is passed through the camera to the output in full 10 bit.

So when playing back the footage the ioHD control panel is correct saying its 8bit. Not sure if the colour problems you see are because you have an 8bit signal connected to an 10 bit input. But you can switch the ioHD to 8 bit input via the advanced video setting dialogue in the capture settings in FCP.

Carsten


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 3:47:17 am

Good point, Carsten. I figured he was capturing live out of the camera (E-E from the chip), not off of the SxS.

Jeremy


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Martijn Scholte
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 6:26:55 am

im sorry

misread the question :)
i used fcp and the quictime player app to record
and i am am capturing live from camera :)
not recording to card no picture profile on and still waititng from on answer fro sony if thats EE al the time then :)

when hidding fcp the aja control app jumps from YUV 10b to YUV8b (in the big middle section) and that i dont understand

its like
my ex1 only outputs 8 b(stil asumming this stands for bit?)
or
aja io input @1080i25 only works in 8 bit?

thanks for your help


martijn

The box said 'Requires Windows 95, or better.' So I bought a Macintosh.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 7:05:50 am

[Martijn Scholte] "the quictime player app to record "


That's your problem.

Please download AJA VTR Exchange (it's totally free) and use that to record, you can setup 10 bit ProRes or ProRes HQ and also get multichannel audio and timecode to boot.

Jeremy



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Martijn Scholte
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 2:18:01 pm

Hi Jeremy thanks

didt know AJAVTR :)
it is differnt quality wise from quicktime player because i can choose i think the same presets.?

i noticed that the aja control app is stating Proress YUV when in the aja vtr app :) gues this means 10bit then


thanks for all the help and tips

cheers

Martijn

The box said 'Requires Windows 95, or better.' So I bought a Macintosh.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 2:31:01 pm

Yes it is different quality. It is a 'front end' of sorts to your ioHD. Use it, don't use QT Player as I have no idea what that does and it sounds like it might only record 8bit from your tests.

Also, when you hide FCP or anything that is not controlling the ioHD and you go to your desktop, it is possible that the frame buffer might chnage to 8 bit as nothing is really 'controlling' the ioHD. Once you open an application that takes control of the ioHD you should notice the proper bit dpeth. When you see ProRes YUV, that means 10bit, yes.

Does that make sense?

Jeremy


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Martijn Scholte
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 3:07:18 pm

it does

thanks a bunch

cheers
Martijn

i do love the cow :)


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: aja io hd 1080i25 also 10bit?
on Sep 23, 2008 at 4:12:18 pm

Glad to help, let me know if you have more questions. I use the ioHD in the same manner as this quite often. It's great for green screen and matte work in a highly portable situation.

Jeremy


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