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Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow

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Robert Ober
Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 7:37:12 pm

Hello Folks,

I have a 2.66 8 Core Mac Pro with the standard 640GB hard disk & video coming soon. My G5 has a LH, scary raid (RAID 0) and FCS2. I cannot afford to upgrade the LH to LHE or the RAID at this point or anytime soon. So once I verify the Mac Pro is OK with FCS2 and uninstall FCS2 from the G5, what is my workflow? The SD stuff I do is not an issue of course, but occasionally I capture analog HD. I have never understood the procedure for offline using files. Is there a doc somewhere that will explain capturing HD from an analog playback source that is non-controllable and editing with a downrezed version?

I am assuming that when I uninstall FCS2 on the G5 that the codecs remain and I will use AJA VTR for capture. Thinking ProRes. Will ProRes422 playback on the 2.66 8 core with the standard drive and video? I believe I have only played it back from my scary raid.

Thanks,
Robert A. Ober


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Michael Sacci
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 8:03:07 pm

If you are planning to use the single internal system drive as your capture and editing drive you are headed for trouble.

HD can be anything from HDV, DVCProHD or ProRes (to name a few) ProRes needs a faster drive. Some HD decks have FW connections so no card is needed but they are HDV and DVCProHD decks. Without telling what you are using it is hard to give a workflow. But you will have to buy more stuff, may not need to be super expensive but there is more to buy.



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Robert Ober
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 9:11:45 pm

[Michael Sacci] "If you are planning to use the single internal system drive as your capture and editing drive you are headed for trouble. "

Nope, sorry if I was not clear. I will still capture using the G5/scary raid/LH and AJA VTR.

[Michael Sacci] "HD can be anything from HDV, DVCProHD or ProRes (to name a few) ProRes needs a faster drive. Some HD decks have FW connections so no card is needed but they are HDV and DVCProHD decks. Without telling what you are using it is hard to give a workflow. But you will have to buy more stuff, may not need to be super expensive but there is more to buy. "

Yep, know all that. Did say what I have. Gets worse all the time with the different codecs, eh? Wish Sony and Panasonic and JVC could get together on codecs.

Take it EZ,
Robert



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Bob Zelin
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 8:36:47 pm

Robert -
as you know, you have a PCI-X machine, so you can't use your scary raid or your Kona LH card.

I have a friend that just found new Hitachi 1TB SATA drives that go into the new MAC Pros for $88 (no typo) on Amazon.com. Two of these drives will give you over 120Mb/sec stripped RAID 0, which is fast enough for ProRes422HQ. If you say "but I don't have $176 for 2 terabytes of storage, and won't have $176 anytime soon", then please get out of our industry. There are many wonderful VERY inexpensive solutions available to all of us today. You can afford these solutions. Don't be foolish.

Bob Zelin




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Robert Ober
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 9:06:53 pm

[Bob Zelin] "two of these drives will give you over 120Mb/sec stripped RAID 0, which is fast enough for ProRes422HQ. "

I thought of something like that. Can I get 120Mb/sec using OS X's software RAID? I have always warned against software raid but in this case it might fit the need. I thought I was clear that I will capture on the G5/scary raid/LH and edit on the Mac Pro, but maybe it was clear only to me

[Bob Zelin] "If you say "but I don't have $176 for 2 terabytes of storage, and won't have $176 anytime soon", then please get out of our industry."

We've had this conversation before, some years ago. I wanted the LH for analog HD capture along with it's monitoring and acceleration capabilities. I am an IT person that does some audio/video stuff on the side. Currently I am doing mostly SD home movies to DVD, but I like to capture the old analog ones at 422 instead of DV.

I still am curious about offline workflows that involve HD to offline. Such as captuing ProRes and working in DVCPRO HD or similar.

Thanks for the reply,
Robert:-)



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Michael Sacci
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 10:15:17 pm

How do you plan on getting the captured files from the G5 to the MacPro?


[Robert Ober] "I still am curious about offline workflows that involve HD to offline. Such as captuing ProRes and working in DVCPRO HD or similar. " That is not how offline/online works. You edit in the codec you capture in. If you need to same space or are doing a multicam project on a slower system or drives you might capture offline as DV25, do your edit and then you recapture as HD ProRes your final timeline. With the speed of the systems and drives these days and working with DVCProHD or ProRes we don't think in offline/online editing, the original captured codec is used throughout the entire process.

I have used software RAID for years, I get over 400Mbps from 10 drives striped together. I have a manual backup scheme still have a safety net back not a keep on going if you lose a drive but I can build a 10GB system for under $2500. If you are doing only a couple of streams of DVCProHD or ProRes you should be fine with 2 or 3 internal striped drives.

Maybe I have overlooked this but I cannot find what HD decks/format you are using.





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Robert Ober
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 10:25:49 pm

[Michael Sacci] "That is not how offline/online works. "

Ok, I thought there was a way to do it with files as opposed to recapturing from tape.

[Michael Sacci] "Maybe I have overlooked this but I cannot find what HD decks/format you are using.
"


I did say non-controllable and ProRes? I also have the Sheer HD and SD codecs. I do SD capture from consumer decks like VHS to edit and transfer to DVD. HD captures are for my own use from a DVR's component output. I put stuff on Blu-Ray for playback in my PS3.

Thanks,
Robert


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Bob Zelin
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 11:23:12 pm

Robert -
no offense, but this is the AJA Kona forum. If you have Final Cut Pro questions that do not involve AJA hardware, please post these on the Final Cut Pro forum. The Sheer HD codecs are not property of AJA, and they don't want to see this discussion on this forum. There are LOTS of Cow forums that can address these issues.

BobZelin




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Robert Ober
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 11:59:25 pm

[Bob Zelin] "The Sheer HD codecs are not property of AJA, and they don't want to see this discussion on this forum. "

I need mention I was thinking of working in ProRes on the new machine. Y'all speak of ProRes and it is not property of AJA either. And when I capture in Sheer it is through the LH.

Also, y'all better than the other guys, right? Not so much traffic in here for it to be an issue I would think. I do understand the gist of your point.

Am I to understand you do not think I can edit with ProRes unless I do the RAID 0 on the new machine?

Thanks,
Robert
PS: AJA does not own this forum, right? Property of the Cow, eh?


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Bob Zelin
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 8, 2009 at 12:21:45 am

Robert writes -
Am I to understand you do not think I can edit with ProRes unless I do the RAID 0 on the new machine?

REPLY -
Robert, in my opinion, no one should use the internal boot drive of their computer to store video media, even if they are working in DV25. On my business computer, which basically only runs EXCEL and WORD, I keep a seperate data drive for my business records. This way, in case the boot drive fails, or gets corrupted, I can still retrieve my data. This applies even more for large video media files, which will ultimately cause havoc on the boot drive of your MAC.

AJA does not own this forum - Creative Cow does. But to keep things straight and focused, you should post on the appropriate forum. Just like you should keep your internal hard drive of your Macintosh - ORGANIZED. Without orgainization, there is chaos, and keeping your equipment working properly is the # 1 concern of these forums.

Bob Zelin





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Michael Sacci
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 7, 2009 at 11:48:32 pm

Well sounds like you know what you are doing, sorry for asking for clarification.



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Robert Ober
Re: Early 2009 Mac Pro Workflow
on Apr 8, 2009 at 12:00:05 am

I do appreciate your input.

Thanks,
Robert


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