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problem laying off to HDCAM

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Miska Draskoczy
problem laying off to HDCAM
on Apr 30, 2008 at 2:51:00 pm

Hi, I'm trying to layoff a 1080i 29.97 sequence to HDCAM on an m2000 deck via HDSI from a kona lhe in Final Cut Pro 6.0.3. This is my first time doing a tape layoff to HD, coming from the world of beta/digibeta so I'm not too familiar with this deck yet. I have HDSDI apparently working properly laying off video and audio. when I edit to tape and drag my sequence to 'assemble edit' everything appears to go smoothly, video/audio go on to tape cleanly with no glitches. only problem is that its not following my timecode inserts properly or perhaps ignoring them altogether.

First I striped the tape with timecode starting at 59:00:02 using the decks TCGSET function with TCG set to INT. I set the in point in my sequence at 59:10:02, copy this timecode to the in point in the edit-to-tape window and drag my sequence over. The deck queues up and starts laying down the sequence at the right time. but when it gets to 59:50:00, instead of playing my slate, its still playing the bars - everything is delayed and it ends up laying down the program starting at 01:00:07 something.... well delayed past where it should be. When I play back the tape, the timecode jumps from 00:59:10 to 00:59:16, so that would appear to be the source of the gap, but not sure why its doing that.

I tried setting TCG to EXT and SDI with no difference. I fooled with it some more setting PR/RGN to LTC instead of PRESET and TCR to LTC. That got it down to an approx 2 sec offset/delay between my sequence timecode and timecode on the tape, but still not fixed. This seems to be a timecode problem, like when it shuttles to 00:59:10 it then proceeds to read timecode from somewhere else besides the tape and starts laying down a new track with some indeterminate offset. Can someone tell me what the proper procedure is for setting this up? Or where I'm otherwise going wrong?

Thanks very much.




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Aaron Neitz
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on Apr 30, 2008 at 5:53:53 pm

Sounds like you've got Preset code going down on a striped tape.

Re black the entire tape. Set deck to INT timecode / Preset / LTC and VITC.

Then when it's finish set deck to INT timecode / Regen / LTC and VITC

Also what is your reference setup? Try setting deck to Input Video and make sure there's not a signal loop going back to Kona. So Kona is plugged into deck and deck in NOT plugged into Kona.



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Miska Draskoczy
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on Apr 30, 2008 at 6:35:48 pm

actually, i just figured it out. deep in the menus is a setting for REGEN MODE, which needs to be on 'as&in' (assemble and insert) which means it reads from the tape when looking for timecode while recording. it was on MANU (manual) which means it keeps reading from the int generator. each time I striped the tape, then backed it up, the int tc generator was at whatever the last highest TC value I was getting up to, like 00:59:12-18, wherever I stopped striping and rewound the tape. this is where it would pickup again when it started to record onto the tape as it was still reading from the int generator instead of the tape.

thanks.

-m



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Aaron Neitz
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on Apr 30, 2008 at 8:18:55 pm

Yep. I love how much more complicated the Sony decks are getting. And there's nothing you can do except learn their quips by much trial and error.

at least they're mildly easier than a D5 to program.



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Chris Borjis
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on May 1, 2008 at 4:39:01 pm


Miska, I'm just curious, but why would you black a tape if your doing an assemble edit? You need only stripe to the timecode input point, the deck/fcp will lay the rest of the timecode.

I've saved hours of time not blacking full tapes.
Thats something I stopped doing altogether anymore.



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Miska Draskoczy
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on May 1, 2008 at 4:54:44 pm

yep, thats what I did, I only striped 20secs or so at the head of the tape as I would usually do with SD. I think the other poster mentioned blacking the whole tape as a possible solution to my problem.

-m



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Jonathan Abrams
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on Nov 14, 2008 at 10:54:35 pm

Hello,

I am experiencing this same problem. I am using an SRW-5500. The video is consistently two seconds and eleven frames late on the tape. Unfortunately, the 'as&in' menu setting does not appear to exist on the SRW-5500. If it does, I cannot find it in the manual.

Has anyone else experienced this problem with the SRW-5500? Any ideas on how to correct it? I have tried having the SRW-5500 reference its input (no difference), and have the SRW-5500 reference its input with our FCP station (AJA Kona 3) freewheeling for reference (no difference).

Thanks for reading!



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Mitch Ives
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on May 5, 2008 at 5:01:46 pm

[Aaron Neitz] "Also what is your reference setup? Try setting deck to Input Video and make sure there's not a signal loop going back to Kona. So Kona is plugged into deck and deck in NOT plugged into Kona."

AJA has yet to come up with a fix for this for us. We cannot have both SDI cables connected to the HDcam 2000 deck at the same time without getting a feedback loop. We've tried every combo... tried a GEN-10... nothing allows it to work...

They have (in a cryptic tone) intimated that the K3 uses a completely different approach to sync and that it's much more sensitive than any of the other Kona cards. Not sure what that means, but is apparently intended to have us lower our expectations for an eventual fix.

Mitch Ives
Insight Productions Corp.
mitch@insightproductions.com


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gary adcock
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on May 5, 2008 at 7:28:47 pm

Mitch

My guess is the deck is configured to

1) look at the video in for reference
2) the passthru data is set as EE, not PB when in stop/still


I do this and I am not having issues with any of my HDcam layoffs, I however do not work on the 2000 series HDcam deck.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD




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Mitch Ives
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on May 6, 2008 at 12:36:01 am

Thanks Gary... I'm willing to try anything at this point...

Mitch Ives
Insight Productions Corp.
mitch@insightproductions.com


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gary adcock
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on May 6, 2008 at 11:41:48 am

[Mitch Ives] "Thanks Gary... I'm willing to try anything at this point..."

let me know if it helps.

I was tracking this issue for awhile, then I found out there was issue with the deck not remembering the sync settings and always reverting to the video in signal rather than the house sync/gen 10





gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD




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daryl burney
Re: problem laying off to HDCAM
on Jul 10, 2008 at 4:31:47 am

Although I am in the PAL/50i world I have been having the same mastering/reference problems.

This is how I solved it.. thanks to help from Sony support in Singapore....

Of course trilevel sync eg "Gen10" is a must.

Then set Kona to reference.

The trick is with the menu settings on the HDW2000.
Set to the following:

F2: REF
Menu 309: Auto2
Menu 334: Normal

If you have a look at the manual you will notice that these settings will keep the deck stable using the REF input at all times but will switch to INPUT when you actually start editing to tape ie locking to the incoming video. No loopback occurs using the above settings.

If you have an early HDW like mine you may also need Sony to do a firmware upgrade. The firmware upgrade will stabilise the reference/loopback that can occur when you are sitting in "edit to tape" mode (just before actual mastering).

Hope this helps. This is working for me after many months of frustration.

regards
Daryl Burney
post supervisor
editlounge pte ltd
Singapore




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