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Budrick21
Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 5, 2007 at 7:34:08 pm

I've been asked output a one-hour doc that was shot and edited in HDV. It needs to got to DVCPro HD, with timecode to match the sequence. I'm trying to understand the workflow. The system is an Intel running 5.1.4.

So my question is:

Do I just conform and go? Should I go out SDI via Kona? Do I render the sequence to QT first, and if so, should I render to DVCPro HD? Can I get sequence timecode to match the tape timecode (blacked and coded tape is provided)

No previous experience with HDV, but I've been reading through the forums and I still have these questions.


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JeremyG
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 2:54:58 am

Budrick! How the heck are ya? How'd that other thing turn out for you?

If I were you I'd lay off the HDV sequence via SDI to your deck. What deck do you have?

Jeremy



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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 3:25:21 am

Jeremy G, my old friend. You've become a Cow Leader since that long thread all those months ago. Well-deserved, to be sure.

The project you first helped me with is still going! But it will air November 13 on most PBS stations! That show is finishing up, and seems to be in ok shape, if a little late.

The reason I'm writing today is I've been asked come in and help out another project.

It's another Avid editor cutting on Final Cut (5.1.4). The show was shot and edited HDV, and now they want to output to a Panasonic AJ1200A at 720, 30p. It seems like a lot of people have issues with HDV so I read around to see what the process was going to be like.

It's a one-hour show, so I went to do a test on edit to tape.
It conform for about two hours, now it's just about done blacking the tape, and I'm trying to judge the probability that the system will fail - cpu crash, digital dropouts, who knows. The room was even functioning when I walked in tonight, so my confidence in the equipment isn't high.

Could I have just blacked the head of the tape and done an assemble edit? What is a conform? I know it's not a render, but is it a file saved somewhere? Will I have to do a two-hour conform and a one-hour tape stripe for every output, even if the shoe doesn't change?

Anyway, it's awfull good to hear from you - I was hoping you'd chime in!

Bud


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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 3:58:21 am

So the tape has finished black and coding, but I can't get the edit to tape happening! I've set in points and outpoints, tried to drag to the edit-to-tape window and drop on the insert tab.

Nothing. No response at all from the deck or Final Cut.

That's it for tonight.


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JeremyG
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 3:43:23 pm

Glad to hear you are well!


Yes, HDV has to conform as it has to rebuild all these things called i-frames. It's the nature of the beast and that's why people tend to not capture HDV as HDV but as something else, such as DVCPro HD. It alleviates all that hassle. The 1200A will not do assemble edits, unfortunately. Your choices are to rent a 1400 which has this capability or to do as I do and run my rs422 to a beta machine (or any other deck that can handle a proper assemble edit), video and audio to the 1200A, then send the tc out from the beta to the tc in of the 1200A and set the tc to external on the 1200A. Not really professional and a total hack, but it gets the job done. You should check your frame offset though to make sure your are frame accurate.

Jeremy



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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 4:25:50 pm

Insert edits will do in a pinch, although if absolutely necessary a 1400 could be procured (I think).

So here's what I've been handed:

A project in HDV that needs to go out to DVCPro HD.

Every time I output I can expect a two-hour conform.

When I go to edit-to-tape, I get no response from the system. I've never used edit-to tape, so one I've marked in and out points on the sequence, enabled all the tracks, set an in point in the edit-to-tape window, what's left to make it happen? Am I supposed to drag and drop from the timeline? Do I drag the sequence from the bin? (I'm away from the facility until tomorrow so I can't try things until then).

The interface looks like it should be really easy, but I just can't make it go...


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JeremyG
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 4:36:57 pm

The 1200 won't do insert edits either.

What I am saying is that the 1200 is not an editing deck, so you can't do what you are trying to do. It's not FCPs fault or your fault, it's the deck that doesn't have the capability. The 1400 deck does. You can do inserts and assembles with the best of them. If you do get a 1400 deck, you will have to drag the finished sequence from the browser onto the 'assemble' overlay of the edit to tape window. That will make sense once you are in front of FCP. This process will not work the 1200A though as the 1200 doesn't edit to tape. That's where my whole route the timecode through another deck comes in handy.

And yes, HDV has to conform before an edit to tape unfortunately. That's why people don't like to edit native HDV.

Jeremy



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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 6:59:12 pm

Thanks, Jeremy. Without any kind of error message, it was hard to know what was missing. So it sounds like I can't do exactly what 's been asked. Thye've been hitting play on FCP and crash recording, but without the conform process it seems like they're not going to get a broadcast-ready tape. Maybe a trip to Compressor is called for...


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JeremyG
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 7:15:57 pm

Yeah, just understand you will be recompressing an already heavily compressed movie.

do you have another deck there such as a beta machine?


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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 7:55:34 pm

The primary consideration is the highest quality output possible.

Matching timecode is important, but secondary.

They did a play-and-crash output and thought it was ok, but that sounds dicey.

Having two decks is not a likely outcome. Renting a 1400 is more likely. It sounds like the best route for tonight(!) is print to video (instead of edit-to-tape), hang out for two hours while the show conforms, and then hit the record button on the deck.

It sounds like it should work...


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JeremyG
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 6, 2007 at 8:33:44 pm

[Budrick21] "It sounds like it should work... "

Oh yeah, nothing wrong with that except for the timecode not matching the sequence.

Jeremy





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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 11, 2007 at 5:27:05 pm

Hey Jeremy

If you're still paying attention to this thread, here's a link to 'that other thing':







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JeremyG
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 11, 2007 at 5:35:30 pm

Looks good, man! Nice work.


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Budrick21
Re: Print to tape HDV to DVCProHD
on Oct 11, 2007 at 5:40:58 pm

And thanks again for your help!


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