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cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.

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Aindreas Gallagher
cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 1, 2014 at 6:06:38 pm

I had to say it.

I'm in a big broadcaster for a few months that does a lot of sport.
they have avid - around sixty suites of avid. Horrible horrible horrible avid on isis as far as the eye can see. I thought I would have to get up to snuff on avid - even though I'm a promo producer for the gig, it's a lottery as to what editor you get slotted. But I know this perfectly acceptable editor, been working with him for years. he's a slob, but I know his quirks.

Turns out you can clip up on their web based logging system, pull it off Isis in avid as a bin and a sequence string out, then consolidate the lot out as an AAF, bounce it to mac land and hello premiere.

It reads the AAF, the lot appears perfectly in premiere, bins and sequences, the mxf plays like butter and away you cut. Relative to avid, it feels like escaping hell.

A word on pancaking in Premiere: there is no other way to cut promos but this way; pancake your teams, hero shots as tabbed select sequences slotted over your master edit and start dragging the shots down to the master - premiere, god bless its cotton socks, performs an instance not a move - so you simply scrub the top selects pancake, grab the clip you like, drag to main timeline and repeat. When you really want to dig into the source bin - bang it out on monitor two as large tiles and hoverscrub until the cows come home. It is all just the nicest thing.

It also encodes pro res out at warp speed - relative to FCP - or avid for that matter.

Given it can handle anything under god natively without blinking - there is nothing on God's green earth that can touch Premiere for a short form edit.
It is the utter King.

There's no way I'm going rental - but that editing system is just luurvely.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Steve Brame
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 3, 2014 at 11:36:28 pm

Well, I did "go rental", and after the last few weeks of trials and tribulations with CC, and now CC 2014, I decided to try Media Composer after a ~7 year hiatus. I swear that I felt like I'd picked up a hammer and chisel and was trying to carve a project in stone. I'd had a duplicate experience way back when I first abandoned MC for Premiere CS, then several months later had to reanimate a MC project.

Asus P6X58D Premium * Core i7 950 * 24GB RAM * nVidia Quadro 4000 * Windows 7 Premium 64bit * System Drive - WD Caviar Black 500GB * 2nd Drive(Pagefile, Previews) - WD Velociraptor 10K drive 600GB * Media Drive - 2TB RAID0 (4 - WD Caviar Black 500GB drive) * Matrox MX02 Mini * Adobe CC
-------------------------------------------
"98% of all computer issues can be solved by simply pressing 'F1'."
Steve Brame
creative illusions Productions


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Gary Huff
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 4, 2014 at 2:04:59 am

[Aindreas Gallagher] "I had to say it."

And now we can abuse you in replies! Hooray! :-p


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Andy Field
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 7, 2014 at 2:48:22 pm

Aindreas - makes me smile hearing you sing Premiere Pro's praises...how it beats the competition for what you wanted to do - hands down and yet you still can't stomach paying for the innovation and convenience they've offered on their terms

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Herb Sevush
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 3:50:31 pm

[Andy Field] "how it beats the competition for what you wanted to do - hands down and yet you still can't stomach paying for the innovation and convenience they've offered on their terms"

I've just switched over to CC and I still loath the rental system. The two ideas are not connected at all. I've got no trouble paying for the innovation, I have a lot of trouble with their terms. Still, if that's the only choice I have, and it makes business sense, I'll live with it. But I won't like it.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Tim Kolb
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 9, 2014 at 4:42:12 pm

I think that appreciating the product and not being comfortable with the subscription format are 2 issues that are legitimately distinct from each other.

I don't know how many CC users would say they 'love' the subscription system...there are simply varying degrees of protest volume.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Herb Sevush
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 3:51:31 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "A word on pancaking in Premiere"

OK, I give up, what is "pancaking" ?

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Andy Field
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 7:56:00 pm

I think he means creating a "reel" of individual clips....one of the downsides of digital recording is creating hundreds of short clips to sort through. I prefer the old fashioned "scrub" through a reel to find your shots.....usually take one disk worth and throw it into a timeline/sequence....and call it reel one reel two - Premiere Pro CC makes it easy to load the "reel" into the player window - select in and out..and edit into a new timeline without (or with if you choose) editing a nested sequence into the next sequence...there's a toggle for that....... you could do it in FCP 7 as well i think by editing with the cmd key down....

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Herb Sevush
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 8:56:13 pm

[Andy Field] "Premiere Pro CC makes it easy to load the "reel" into the player window - select in and out..and edit into a new timeline without (or with if you choose) editing a nested sequence into the next sequence"

OK, got it, and this is basically my way of working. I don't use bins I use timelines, whittling down and duplicating the timeline, till I have my best shots and then copying and pasting from that timeline into the editing timeline. Didn't realize "pancake" was the term for it.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Franz Bieberkopf
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:13:38 pm
Last Edited By Franz Bieberkopf on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:18:05 pm

[Herb Sevush] "Didn't realize "pancake" was the term for it."

Herb,

It's a specific example of working sequence to sequence, taking its name from stacking timelines one above the other; it was posted about a year ago:

http://vashivisuals.com/adobe-cs6-5-editing-tips-for-music-videos/
(tip #3)
"As is often the case … simplicity allows for quantum leaps in productivity. By stacking 2 timelines on top of each other…an editor can now access an entire reel of selects in chronological order (or whatever order desired) and instantly drop them into the active timeline below."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=s71kPGsCjGA#t=147
(Edit: apologies, not exactly the most concise demonstration.)

Franz.


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:28:21 pm
Last Edited By Aindreas Gallagher on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:28:46 pm

yes - the thing is premiere introduces a massively useful wrinkle with drag instancing. as I will demonstrate below...

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Herb Sevush
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:28:40 pm

Franz -

Thanks for the link. Interesting article. I'm not sure I need to see both timelines at all times, but I might give it a try next time I'm breaking down a lot of footage.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Franz Bieberkopf
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:36:05 pm

[Herb Sevush] "Thanks for the link. Interesting article. I'm not sure I need to see both timelines at all times, but I might give it a try next time ..."

Herb,

I don't use this specific method myself, and I'm not sure it would offer me any advantages - you'll probably get more insight from Aindreas.

Franz.


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:39:33 pm
Last Edited By Aindreas Gallagher on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:49:03 pm

there is a thing tho. it's like having an avid source monitor copy where you can see the entire source timeline in context. its handy for shortform -

http://i.imgur.com/YfyWoMY.png

see? if you need to put a 30 spot together in a hurry - particularly if you have multiple category / sport elements - there is pretty much nothing on god's earth that beats that setup. You can scrub instantaneously live between timelines X style. Given PPro handles the clip move from timeline to timeline as a non destructive instance move, I don't know any other system that allows you to chew selects and master in context anything like that.

I don't think a competitor scenario exists?

* just to add - in my case those selects string outs are seriously tighter than the bin material - they're real selects close enough to music tempo - you can more or less drop them in. Again - kind of a short form thing - not for big daddy editing, but its quite a rapid wheeze to work this situation with good selects.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Herb Sevush
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:48:19 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] " You can scrub instantaneously live between timelines X style. Given PPro handles the clip move from timeline to timeline as a non destructive instance move, I don't know any other system that allows you to chew selects and master in context anything like that."

I can see using it when I cut my food beauty shot montages at the start of each season - going from 2 hour assembly of shots, whittle down to about 10 minutes of selects, then "pancake" edit down to the final :30 of shots to music. Nice.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 11:16:20 pm

[Herb Sevush] "when I cut my food beauty shot montages at the start of each season - going from 2 hour assembly of shots, whittle down to about 10 minutes of selects, then "pancake" edit down to the final :30 of shots to music."

sure teensey image edit thing you'd do on your scale bud, and.. it not half favours overly isolated shot by single shot selections - I'm not actually sure on it really - even while running bins for quotes and stuff - but if you've got an hour or two to final a thing once the radio edit is down, the split timeline working that well scrubbing across source to master feels - a little zany.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Steve Connor
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 9, 2014 at 8:01:05 am

[Aindreas Gallagher] "there is a thing tho. it's like having an avid source monitor copy where you can see the entire source timeline in context. its handy for shortform -

http://i.imgur.com/YfyWoMY.png

see? if you need to put a 30 spot together in a hurry - particularly if you have multiple category / sport elements - there is pretty much nothing on god's earth that beats that setup. You can scrub instantaneously live between timelines X style. Given PPro handles the clip move from timeline to timeline as a non destructive instance move, I don't know any other system that allows you to chew selects and master in context anything like that.
"


Didn't know you could do that, very nice!

Steve Connor
Mellowing slowly


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 9, 2014 at 11:29:33 am

[Aindreas Gallagher] "I don't think a competitor scenario exists?"

Very nice workflow - I'm nicking that right away.

You can however do the exact same thing (bar the hover scrubbing) with two timelines in FCP 7 (which I'm embarrassed to admit I still use more than anything else).



Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 11, 2014 at 8:14:40 pm

I know - sure I checked it after I posted, and of course - FCP legend there. same instance operation.

but It's the combo of that - and the scrubbable bins as live tiles on monitor two, the ranged markers quotes notation - taken all in its pretty seriously formidable because you're hitting the same assets six different ways depending on need/mood.

also if you're single window on a client machine the fact that a bin brought to its own window floats forward regardless of other stuff - say monitor or timeline selected - I much prefer to FCP7. you'd get tired of the bin being hidden by selected other bits of the interface in 7.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 11, 2014 at 8:21:50 pm

Yes, I completely agree - Premiere has some truly amazing features like this, really finely honed to help you work fast. Some seriously good work has gone into this stuff.

Now, about that subscription thing ...

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 11, 2014 at 9:47:15 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "Now, about that subscription thing ..."

i'm not touching it with a radioactive barge pole. Premiere CC is actually a poisoned chalice.

I still don't know how to judge their numbers given the twelve cannons boom worth of deal/flyer/you won a subscription on a cornflake packet in vegas effort they're mustering to get to the publicly visible subscription number.

either way there has to be a more proper compact with the customer - at least the one who doesn't have photoshop tattooed on their forehead.
because god knows adobe are somehow deeply terrified by the implications arising from the photographer CC rejection.

you would be curious, oil drilling style, about the current gauge of subscription depth adobe are draining across the different software they hold near monopoly on from prior license holders - and where and how close they variously are to tapping out as drilled viable wells.

It's hard not to think wall street has a simplistic notion of this reality.

You'd think there are very different numbers, and some wells are already maybe close to dry. Illustrator anyone? Photoshop?

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 11, 2014 at 9:57:30 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "either way there has to be a more proper compact with the customer - at least the one who doesn't have photoshop tattooed on their forehead. "

What is it with those darn paparazzi or whoever they are that are calling all the shots here? It's very weird that they get all the cake and the rest of us get none.

[Aindreas Gallagher] "It's hard not to think wall street has a simplistic notion of this reality."

Say it ain't so, Joe!!!

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 8, 2014 at 10:26:53 pm

actually that's not what I mean. hang on - I'll do a screen grab.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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David Powell
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 9, 2014 at 6:14:23 pm

I've never seen the Sequence pancake before. I do something similar in Avid by making selects on the time line and then loading the timeline into the Viewer and cutting into the sequence. Other than dragging and dropping, I suppose the other advantage is the filmstrip view of all the individual clips. I tried a similar workflow in FCPX using a Compound clip but found it far less effective due to the lack of marker retention on the clips.

I've been working on a corporate video and short spots the last few weeks and this workflow would've def saved a lot of time using Premiere. Now if premiere could only change their trim functions to make sense from the keyboard.


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Kevin Monahan
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 10, 2014 at 5:47:22 pm

Hi David,

[David Powell] "I do something similar in Avid by making selects on the time line and then loading the timeline into the Viewer and cutting into the sequence. "

Virtual KEM? Premiere Pro CC can do that now too. See this video tutorial: http://tv.adobe.com/watch/learn-premiere-pro-cc/edit-sequences-in-the-sourc...

Thanks,
Kevin

Kevin Monahan
Support Product Manager—DVA
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe
Follow Me on Twitter!


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 11, 2014 at 8:50:12 pm

[Kevin Monahan] "Virtual KEM? Premiere Pro CC can do that now too."

Place with hordes of avid - after a 7 upgrade fiasco. One senior guy talked about a really detailed understanding of how the premiere timeline was able to quickly compile, with tiny little files dropped after initial playback/scrubbing through, realtime playback on nearly anything. I barely knew what he was talking about but he really and truly liked it. Anything -anything- I mentioned about premiere - he knew.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: cutting promos with premiere is the nicest thing in the entire world.
on Jul 11, 2014 at 9:22:50 pm

[Kevin Monahan] "Virtual KEM? Premiere Pro CC can do that now too. See this video tutorial: http://tv.adobe.com/watch/learn-premiere-pro-cc/edit-sequences-in-the-sourc.....
"


I do love the new Premiere and all but this feature has been in FCP7 (and Media Composer, of course) since like ... forever.

Or am I missing something?

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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