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Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?

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Clint Wardlow
Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 4:08:57 pm

The reason I ask this, is because in some ways I think a great many of us delude ourselves into some kind of permanent ownership when we buy a computer or software license.

Whenever I buy a computer, say like my imac 2010, I tell myself that "hey I own this guy and it will last me a long long time." The same goes with a software license. I feel that my Adobe CS 5.5 license is mine (even though I am also a cloud subscriber). There is a feeling of permanence. That if I have to, I can make it last forever. It is strangely comforting.

However, when I look at the reality of the situation, no matter how much I tell myself my latest purchase is going to have some permanence, a year or so down the road I am looking at upgrading both software and computer. And still telling myself the same lies. This time it will be permanent. This time it will last. Yet the cycle of upgrading keeps getting shorter and shorter.

So maybe the fall out from the CC model, isn't that it eliminates this "ownership" so much as it coldly spells out that "hey, we are going to have to keep paying if we want to keep up." That the latest and greatest is only so for a very short span.

So maybe a lot of anger isn't so much because Adobe changed it's model, but more that its move quashed some of our delusions about how we do business in this screwy tech world of ours Or maybe I am just putting too much thought into it. Who knows?


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Tim Kolb
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 4:22:03 pm

[Clint Wardlow] "So maybe the fall out from the CC model, isn't that it eliminates this "ownership" so much as it coldly spells out that "hey, we are going to have to keep paying if we want to keep up." "

Clint, I completely disagree...

...with your use of the word "maybe."

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Bob Ramage
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 5:38:13 pm

Plenty of people skip software versions and certainly don't do annual computer upgrades. It's a cost/benefit thing. Adobe's move takes away our ability to skip paying for an upgrade when we judge it isn't worth the expense. Instead of perpetual license we get perpetual payment. Count me out.


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Clint Wardlow
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 5:47:12 pm

[Bob Ramage] "Plenty of people skip software versions and certainly don't do annual computer upgrades. It's a cost/benefit thing. Adobe's move takes away our ability to skip paying for an upgrade when we judge it isn't worth the expense. Instead of perpetual license we get perpetual payment. Count me out."

I actually agree with this. But I think that it has less to do with the Cloud model and more to do with the ham-handed subscription choices. In the long run we all keep paying, some admittedly less often the others. I think for the Cloud model to be successful it needs to offer up a lot more options to the consumer that can be factored into budgets without so much disruption.


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andy lewis
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 5:50:21 pm

There's a resistance? How do I join?


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Gary Huff
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 5:52:24 pm

[Clint Wardlow] "I actually agree with this. But I think that it has less to do with the Cloud model and more to do with the ham-handed subscription choices. In the long run we all keep paying, some admittedly less often the others. I think for the Cloud model to be successful it needs to offer up a lot more options to the consumer that can be factored into budgets without so much disruption."

I agree with this. For what I use, I think $29.99 per month is a good value and I see my ability to pay that every month, even in lean months, without much issue. However, $49.99 starts to really push it, and higher (as Adobe first started out with at $129.99 back when they offered subscription for CS5.5) is absolutely out of the question.


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Kevin Monahan
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 9:00:45 pm

[Gary Huff] "I agree with this. For what I use, I think $29.99 per month is a good value and I see my ability to pay that every month, even in lean months, without much issue. However, $49.99 starts to really push it, and higher (as Adobe first started out with at $129.99 back when they offered subscription for CS5.5) is absolutely out of the question."

Hi Gary,
It's a reasonable request, honestly. Be sure to tell the product team directly here: http://www.adobe.com/go/wish

Best,
Kevin

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe Systems, Inc.
Follow Me on Twitter!


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Gary Huff
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 10:09:11 pm

[Kevin Monahan] "It's a reasonable request, honestly. Be sure to tell the product team directly here: http://www.adobe.com/go/wish"

Thanks for the advice, Kevin. Do you happen to know which would be the best drop-down box option to selection? Doesn't seem to be one for Creative Cloud.


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Kevin Monahan
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 11, 2013 at 12:09:52 am

Go for Premiere Pro, After Effects, or any DV app. We'll get it.

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe Systems, Inc.
Follow Me on Twitter!


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Gabe Strong
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 5:47:24 pm

Sorry I disagree with you both. Yeah I upgrade but
without the cloud I decide when I am not forced to by
the company I am spending money with. I stay with something until I really need to upgrade. My last upgrade was in 2009. I upgraded from a 2004 Mac to a 2009 Mac Pro and from FCP 4 to FCP 7. The 2009 Mac Pro is still
my only edit computer and I still use FCP 7 alongside CS 6 quite a bit. I upgraded my camera last year from a PD 150
to a FS100. So this notion that we all 'constantly upgrade'
so we might as well pay a monthly fee is certainly not true
for me and therefore I am dead set against Creative Cloud. I will be moving back to FCP instead, it may be a new way
of working but I'm not ok with a rent it approach.

Gabe Strong
G-Force Productions
http://www.gforcevideo.com


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andy lewis
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 6:21:33 pm

I think that all of these price comparisons over time are slightly misleading. We wouldn't normally compare renting and purchasing over 3 years and expect the costs to come out similar. We would expect renting to me much, much cheaper over that time frame.

"You're getting it slightly cheaper through a subscription model (when this is claimed)...oh but on the other hand you don't own the software at the end" as if that's a small detail, strikes me as bizarre. Imagine being offered a similar deal on a car. I know, I know software is different and apparently old versions are immediately useless and without value as soon as the new version is released.


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Clint Wardlow
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 7:09:10 pm

[andy lewis] " I know software is different and apparently old versions are immediately useless and without value as soon as the new version is released."

Actually under the current creative cloud model, old software has the same value as new software. When 7 comes out, if you chose to still use 6 it cost exactly the same.


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Kirk Pitts
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 7:51:34 pm

Just yesterday I booted up my old Amiga 1200 and launched Deluxe Paint III and made a quick drawing, then loaded that drawing into ImageFX and added some effects too it.
I didn't get paid for doing it though, but fortunately I also didn't have to pay a new subscription cost to do this.
Permanent enough for me. ;-)


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Clint Wardlow
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 7:55:48 pm

[Kirk Pitts] "Just yesterday I booted up my old Amiga 1200 and launched Deluxe Paint III and made a quick drawing, then loaded that drawing into ImageFX and added some effects too it."

I loved my Amiga 1000. Deluxe Paint was the king. I also used Pagestream for desktop publishing. Hey and what about video toaster! My first computer game I ever purchased was Sim Ant for the Amiga.


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Kirk Pitts
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 8:00:15 pm

I also used Pagestream. It is still available for Mac.
I have a video toaster 4000 here also but I no longer have the genlocks.


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Tim Kolb
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 10:42:23 pm

[Kirk Pitts] "I have a video toaster 4000 here also but I no longer have the genlocks."

I have an Amiga 4000 somewhere...about $8K worth of software...and a "floptical" drive...optically tracked on one side and extra dense magnetic data tracks on the other for 20 cavernous Megabytes of storage. (It was the cool, modern update to my 44 MB Syquest drives.

Good Lord, I'm old...

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Tim Kolb
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 10:38:54 pm

[Clint Wardlow] "I loved my Amiga 1000. Deluxe Paint was the king."

I worked with Electronic Arts on beta testing and development for Deluxe Paint...loved that software.

Art Department Professional was incredible as well...Michael Jackson brings morphing into style and wears it out in the same video...

And most people forget that real time video playback from hard drive at full resolution was first on the Amiga with DPS's first board/onboard drive...

Macs were still running 180x120 15 fps grabs from television in this new thing called QuickTime...and Adobe Premiere. I remember thinking "What the hell would I ever use THAT for...?"

Ah yes...we made a lot of awesome chrome balls floating over checkerboards back in those days...and I do mean days-that was how long it took to render.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Tim Kolb
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 10:28:55 pm

[Kirk Pitts] "Just yesterday I booted up my old Amiga 1200 and launched Deluxe Paint III and made a quick drawing, then loaded that drawing into ImageFX and added some effects too it."

It's a shame you didn't have IV...I created a chunk of the texture library for that last release...

Now...did owning 1990's Deluxe Paint 3 enhance the safety of your production income here in 2013? It didn't even have HAM color mode until v4 you know...

:-)

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Kirk Pitts
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 11:36:24 pm

Since I do it as a hobby, no still having Deluxe Paint III does not affect my income. But to stay to the original thread, the move to Creative Cloud does effect my income since I will have to use more of it to continue my hobby in the future. I was sent a survey a month or so ago about CC. I am a purchaser for a public school and have bought photoshop 3, 4, CS, CS 4, and now CS6.
Personally I have owned PS 3, PS 5.5 and CS 3 Web. I hoped to make the move to CS6 at home but I really need to wait another year. Education in Florida has not been funded very well for nearly 7 years. I have never updated every increment, neither at home or at work. Can't afford to. This makes the subscription model unacceptable for me.


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Walter Soyka
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 11, 2013 at 3:32:39 am

[Tim Kolb] "Now...did owning 1990's Deluxe Paint 3 enhance the safety of your production income here in 2013? It didn't even have HAM color mode until v4 you know..."

Sure, but it did have Extra Half Bright.

64 colors ought to be enough for anybody.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Kirk Pitts
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 11, 2013 at 6:40:41 pm

That's what Photon Paint and Personal Paint was for. There was something else I used for HAM mode but I can't remember the name.


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Tim Kolb
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 12, 2013 at 1:55:20 am

[Kirk Pitts] "That's what Photon Paint and Personal Paint was for. There was something else I used for HAM mode but I can't remember the name."

I thought there was something like "DigiPaint" or "TV Paint"...?

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Kirk Pitts
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 12, 2013 at 11:39:23 am

DigiPaint rings a bell.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Could the resistance to the CC Cloud be because it destroys our illusions?
on May 10, 2013 at 9:16:54 pm

Yup. For many, I definitely think that's part of it.


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