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I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...

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Brandon Davidson
I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 8, 2013 at 8:13:39 pm

I've had lots and lots of mixed feelings when Adobe announced their Creative Cloud only plan, and I'm going to rant about my conflicting feelings for a bit...

A part of me thinks the new Adobe plan is awesome. The idea that they can free themselves up to release new updates quickly is great. New features are exciting and can often make significant improvements to creativity or workflow. Honestly, the most exciting thing to me is that I believe the idea behind CC is that the future idea/direction is to have access to a cloud that will be more powerful than a personal computer. Your average laptop could access the cloud and use processing power and render farms. This is an exciting thought from someone like me who tends to have a tight budget for my computers and other equipment, but it's just speculation right now and I'm sure it's years down the road.

The other part of me really hates the Adobe plan. I know I sound overly paranoid, but I feel like the monthly plan gives them as a company "leverage" over me because the more projects I will have on CC the more "dependent" I will be on it. The only exit option is to completely leave and be stuck with project files I can't open. Adobe software is so integral to my current workflow I feel like that leverage hits close to home. It gives them the power to play with prices and the software and I have to keep paying them, even if I want access to use past CC versions.

Honestly, I wish we could go back to the old model of both CC and perpetual because that way there's CC, but with an exit plan. But Adobe has made their decision and I believe they're going to stick with it (and a part of me says more power to them for making a gutsy decision and sticking with it). Feeling like CC is here to stay, I'm interested to see it's future. When they release their new updates I drool a bit. It seems they are heading in an exciting direction, but I can't bring myself to jump on the boat myself feeling like as soon as I'm on the boat, I'm stuck for the ride, and it's their decision the direction we go and how much I pay to get there.

I wish Adobe success and I don't want them to fail, but I also hope this CC decision comes back to bite them a little bit so that more competition will challenge them with perpetual licenses, especially with programs like AE. Ironically, greater competition for Adobe would make me feel safer signing up for CC mostly because it would be a safety check against them playing with the prices and software too much.

Those are some of my random, conflicting thoughts...


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 8, 2013 at 11:39:12 pm

yep all that. If we're talking about peeps like al mooney in the teams - you can't but feel the software is about to get way more interesting for committed professionals.

but then there is adobe corporate, and that's a gigantic problem. Any signal they gave that they recognised the concerns is gone. They are silent now. Its that level of the conversation that is most troubling. That blank adobe hunkering down to hit shareholder subscription goals. They barely come here anymore, and when they do, they never say anything.

The level of trust they are asking for, and the degree to which they are masked in their conversation would give anyone the heebie jeebies.

It feels like there is a level to this they cannot engage in. They're financially hammering education and charities already. What's going on there is crazy. What happens once they have locked in a subscriber base in 2/3 years is very open to question. If only because they completely avoid talking about it.

there is a basic open question about the conduct of adobe as a company to this point, given we are about to hand over massive power to them by becoming software tenants. on all of these basic questions, adobe is freakishly silent.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Kevin Snyder
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 9, 2013 at 6:34:10 pm

Same here... I needed LR 5 to gain support for my new camera and I considered just jumping to the cloud since the upgrades to PPRO have looked so good. However, I ended up buying a perpetual license. I just can't bring myself to commit to the cloud.

Many of the advertisements state that it's a 12 month commitment for a particular price. Not true. It's a lifetime commitment. I don't work for just my clients, I use a lot of the Adobe software for myself as well. I plan on using software for creative purposes until I can't push a mouse around anymore, which I hope is a long way away.

I am holding out as long as possible to see if Adobe will make some kind of concession on their decision... I did download a few of the trials from the cloud. While PPRO was nice, I did realize that there hasn't been anything introduced yet that would change my final product at the end of the day...maybe just a bit faster.

I have always been a fan of Adobe (even during the headaches of Premiere 6.0) and I want them to keep making great products. I just want an exit strategy. A commitment of a couple years to get a perpetual license, you bet. A lifetime commitment...nope.


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Ridley Walker
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 12:01:45 am

[Kevin Snyder] "I just want an exit strategy. A commitment of a couple years to get a perpetual license, you bet. A lifetime commitment...nope."

+ 1


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Chris Pettit
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 12:17:22 am

[Kevin Snyder] ", I use a lot of the Adobe software for myself as well. I plan on using software for creative purposes until I can't push a mouse around anymore, which I hope is a long way away."

+1.

This is exactly what Adobe has forgotten. We're artists, not just business people. I will not make an open ended, lifelong commitment to simply hand them a monthly payment for the rest of my life without some kind of a "get out of jail" pass.

The last thing I want to do on this planet (some day) is to edit video of my grandchildren, NOT make yet another monthly payment to Adobe, (most likely made from my wheelchair).


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Alex Petrovitch
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 4:16:27 pm

What are you all referring to in terms of being "locked in for life"????
I have CS6 right now. Why is CC any different?

Side question. I have a CS6 projects, was wondering if they will open in CC? I sent a CS6 file to speedgrade, which then made it un-openable in CS6, that was fun. Can I download CC, try it, but then continue to run CS6 if I'm not interested? Will my CS6 project files still open on CS6, if I duplicate them, save a copy that has never been open on CC? Or will downloading CC make CS6 not work any longer?

Thoughts????

Alex Petrovitch
http://www.markwoodfilms.com
2013 iMAC 3.4 Quad Core i7, 32GB RAM, 3TB Fusion
FCP7/CS6/AVID
Canon 7D&5Dmk3
Panasonic HVX200


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Morten Ranmar
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 7:15:50 pm

Alex - downloading CC will render all the files on your computer useless. Adobe will take over your hard drive and your computer will self destruct. Also, You will never be able to open your mouth again.

- No Parking Production -

2 x Finalcut Studio3, 2 x Prod. bundle CS6, 2 x MacPro, 2 x ioHD, Ethernet File Server w. X-Raid.... and FCPX on trial


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Alex Petrovitch
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 7:26:28 pm

Dammit! I knew Adobe was the Matrix!

Seriously though - thoughts on my question???


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Morten Ranmar
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 7:32:40 pm

CC will only alter your file if you open and save in it. Duplicates will not be altered.

- No Parking Production -

2 x Finalcut Studio3, 2 x Prod. bundle CS6, 2 x MacPro, 2 x ioHD, Ethernet File Server w. X-Raid.... and FCPX on trial


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Alex Petrovitch
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 7:36:29 pm

What about the program itself?
If I download CC, and let's I don't like CC for whatever reason, or CC doesn't "like" the CS6 files (I've heard that sometimes using CS6 files in CC has re-linking issues, but some people have none...), will CC overwrite CS6 on my computer such that I can't go back?


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Alex Petrovitch
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 7:37:04 pm

also - i didn't purchase CS6, i'm "renting it"...dunno if that alters the conversation.

Alex Petrovitch
http://www.markwoodfilms.com
2013 iMAC 3.4 Quad Core i7, 32GB RAM, 3TB Fusion
FCP7/CS6/AVID
Canon 7D&5Dmk3
Panasonic HVX200


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Chris Pettit
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 11, 2013 at 12:00:04 am

[Alex Petrovitch] "Seriously though - thoughts on my question???"

Alex, in hopes of setting aside snarky responses to your question, I will attempt to answer it, at least from my perspective. I invite anyone who would like to challenge me on the facts to do so.

Once you commit to the CC platform, the project files that you save while developing in CC are (to varying degrees) no longer backwards compatible to any previous version of Adobe software. I say "varying" because it's complicated as to which app and which version you're talking about. Some apps will allow you to save to older versions of the app, but ONLY if you don't use ANY of the new functionality. So for example, you can develop using CC AE,and save to CS6 AE, but if you use any of the new features (like Cineware) then the file will not be compatible. The new updates to the video applications include new ULTRA HD and Hi-res formats. You cant do work with those new formats natively in CC and then expect to open your project files in anything other than applications that now require monthly payments.

Important point: PPro CC file will not open in CS6 right now. Period. If you expect to ever stop making subscription payments to Adobe, and open your projects in CS6, you will not be able to if you created your project in CC PPRO. So from a video editing platform point of view, compatibility is already a moot point. But think about how bad it will be in a couple of years. Or 5 years. CS6 is not a long term solution, even though Adobe told everyone that it was last May.

More to the point: Over time this will just get worse, and no one who's honest with you will tell you otherwise.

A development commitment to mandatory CC, without any change to Adobe policy regarding exit strategies, is a one way ticket. You will ultimately be forced into indefinite subscriptions over time.

That is a fact. You may be OK with that reality, but the truth of what's involved is undeniable. If perpetual monthly payments are OK with you, you're good to go. If they're not, think twice.


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Alex Petrovitch
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 11, 2013 at 12:21:52 am

Hey Chris,

Thank you for the thorough explanation. Very helpful!


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Sandeep Sajeev
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 10, 2013 at 5:26:24 pm

Does nobody use Capture One? I think it blows away LR and Aperture.


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Daniel Frome
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 12, 2013 at 2:48:10 pm

I feel the same as you. I eagerly watch those updates, but I don't really conceive that I will actually join the cloud. The only way to convince me is to make the software so good, and so "necessary" that I'm forced into subscription. I don't think that is ever going to happen with the available choices of software and the availability of CS6.

I've actually begun taking AvidFX (Boris RED) tutorials to eliminate a lot of my simple after effects reliance. I'm slowly realizing that most (not all, but most) of the stuff I relied on Adobe for can be safety done without them.


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Brandon Davidson
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 12, 2013 at 7:36:05 pm

Thanks for everyone's comments. It's interesting to see everyone's perspectives and it's also nice to feel like there are others who feel the way I do as well.


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walter biscardi
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Nov 30, 2013 at 4:18:27 pm

[Brandon Davidson] "The other part of me really hates the Adobe plan. I know I sound overly paranoid, but I feel like the monthly plan gives them as a company "leverage" over me because the more projects I will have on CC the more "dependent" I will be on it. The only exit option is to completely leave and be stuck with project files I can't open."

Or simply export an XML of all your projects and open them on any other NLE that supports the XML like say Adobe Premiere Pro CS6 or FCP.


[Brandon Davidson] "Honestly, I wish we could go back to the old model of both CC and perpetual because that way there's CC, but with an exit plan. But Adobe has made their decision and I believe they're going to stick with it (and a part of me says more power to them for making a gutsy decision and sticking with it)"

There's no real feasible way to run both models side by side, would create a logistical and legal nightmare for the company.


[Brandon Davidson] "I wish Adobe success and I don't want them to fail, but I also hope this CC decision comes back to bite them a little bit so that more competition will challenge them with perpetual licenses, especially with programs like AE."

So far it seems to be working quite well for the company and especially for end users like me. 2 updates already with an absolutely HUGE update that just came out. Communication between end users on the Cloud and responsiveness of Adobe to changes has been just amazing. Yes there was the unfortunate issue with the passwords, but that was easily remedied unlike having when a bank gets hit.

I know it's a tough decision for a lot of folks but I can tell you from an early adopter and someone who runs CC across 5 workstations at the office, it really works and works well. Twice already I've been saved by simply being able to download another tool that I've never had access to before.

Best of luck to you!

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

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Brandon Davidson
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Dec 2, 2013 at 5:01:50 pm

Thanks for chiming in. It does feel reassuring to know people are having a good experience on the cloud and that Adobe is living up to its promises. It helps me feel less anxious about it and a more open to it. I'm still planning on holding out on CS6 for a while to get my mileage out of that, and also so I can see how the Cloud fairs after a year or two and see what the competition might bring to the table. We will see. Thanks again for your comments.


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Mike Cohen
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Dec 3, 2013 at 5:13:16 pm

As Walter said, I am looking forward to using apps that as individual purchases we would likely never buy. The Cloud aspect is not that big of a deal (ie, sharing files as we use other services for that and our own server) but the perpetual updates (always having the latest software) is a great thing.

Complain all you like about Adobe's business model. People pay monthly for cable, Netflix, web hosting, Outlook, cell phones, electricity, etc. It is a business tool. If you don't like the power company's business practices, you can either buy solar panels or keep paying for electricity.

We are already lifetime Adobe users (ie, buying the upgrade every year or so since version 4 (not CS4, plain old 1998 era version 4 which used Media 100 hardware to sorta work). There is always another options for people who don't like the model (FCP, Avid, numerous effects apps, Quark for design, whatever the Photoshop equivalent is).

Interesting reading.

Mike Cohen


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Brandon Davidson
Re: I'm watching CC with interest, but I'm not joining...
on Dec 3, 2013 at 5:34:42 pm

I do like the idea of having access to programs I would have never tried otherwise. Thanks for your comments.


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