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Tom Daigon
Petition
on May 7, 2013 at 11:31:00 pm

If you would like to let Adobe know how you feel here is a great opportunity to do it with a bunch of other folks.

Here is a petition someone started.

http://www.change.org/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-ma...


Then send out this Tweet to help rally others that feel the same way.

Adobe: Eliminate the mandatory "creative cloud" subscription model. Sign this petition if you want a choice. http://www.change.org/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-ma...

It was just created and there are almost 1000 signatures. Its really our best shot to communicate with Adobe as a group.

Tom Daigon
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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 12:37:01 am

Tom -

The great opportunity is by going through the proper Adobe channels and letting them know directly, not by posting to some flaky petition that will never get read by anyone in the proper channels at Adobe. Have you looked at any of the other dozens of petitions this guy has written? :>)

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 12:40:22 am

Ive covered the standard "wish form" channel, Joseph. The more visibility and group involvement, the better. :D

Tom Daigon
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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 12:46:15 am

[Joseph W. Bourke] "The great opportunity is by going through the proper Adobe channels and letting them know directly, not by posting to some flaky petition that will never get read by anyone in the proper channels at Adobe."

Is this the same guy who started the "Bring back FCP 7" petition by any chance? He tried to recruit me on that one, but I never went onboard with that one.

As you said, giving feedback to Adobe directly through the feedback form is the best way to reach Adobe.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 12:49:10 am

[Joseph W. Bourke] "Have you looked at any of the other dozens of petitions this guy has written? :>)"

Wow, just checked that. I think he's a professional petition starter. How can anyone start a petition against LEGOs?!? Although I do like the Freddie Mac Meth Lab petition, that sounds fun.

By the way, it's only at 750 signatures, that's short of the 1000 previously stated....

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

Foul Water Fiery Serpent, an original documentary featuring Sigourney Weave...
MTWD Entertainment - Developing original content for all media.
"This American Land" - our new PBS Series.
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Jim Wiseman
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:21:51 am

It was at 973 and rising 20 minutes after your last post Walter. I could care less who started it. It's who signs it that counts. Do you think Adobe Channels are really listening? They will only listen to the cash register, and that may take awhile.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Shane Ross
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:26:26 am

[walter biscardi] ". How can anyone start a petition against LEGOs?!?"

Have you ever stepped on a Lego with your bare feet? It's painful.

But not worth a petition...

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Jim Wiseman
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:31:10 am

When Legos affect my work or livelihood I'll consider that petition! The best petition is keeping your money in your wallet and your work accessible.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:54:50 am

[Shane Ross] "Have you ever stepped on a Lego with your bare feet? It's painful."

Duplos are much worse. They're bigger, you can completely lose your balance and fall over.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

Foul Water Fiery Serpent, an original documentary featuring Sigourney Weave...
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"This American Land" - our new PBS Series.
"Science Nation" - Three years and counting of Science for the People.

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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:54:02 am

[Shane Ross] "Have you ever stepped on a Lego with your bare feet? It's painful."

Yeah, but sitting on a Lincoln Log has got to be the worst...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 4:14:19 am

[Joseph W. Bourke] "Yeah, but sitting on a Lincoln Log has got to be the worst..."

Um...

Oh, never mind.

I hope some of you are taking Walter's advice on the direct contact. A petition is great...it has the "tipping over police cars" feeling of activism I suppose...but as many of have noted yourselves, Adobe is a business.

If enough customers (direct contact a bit more verifiable than a web petition) simply say they'll stop buying the product unless X and Y are changed, Adobe will listen. Whether you get the exact response you're hoping for, I don't know, but Adobe does respond.

If those 900+ individual people contacted Adobe on this issue directly, it shows more initiative then clicking a URL and quickly keying their name, and I think it would be taken more seriously than the partition.

...just a suggestion.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:03:30 pm

Tim, we do what we can. Heres a good indication of how others feel about this situation.



Tom Daigon
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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 3:24:46 pm

Honestly...what's the source for that graphic, Tom? The petition site? Some other blog where somebody did a critical post of this change?

Find me somebody who's paying for the cloud now that says "I feel like I'm on the edge of losing all my work because I now pay Adobe the same amount every month that I spend on Starbucks".

Again, if there is a concern (and there are many, I do understand that), then voice it in a professional way and the discussion will continue.

However, we now have about 4 threads here where the prevailing wisdom expressed is basically "Hell no, we won't go" and you responding to each one with your own post "Yes, I agree" or "Well said" or "We are legion" or something equally as useful...

The one or two people with actual issues can't even get their questions addressed when the whole screen is full of this stuff.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 3:38:26 pm

An ongoing straw poll at The Tool Farm Tim. :D

Tom Daigon
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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 3:48:01 pm

[Tom Daigon] "An ongoing straw poll at The Tool Farm Tim. :D"

Thanks Tom...but with 246 votes cast, the sample might be a touch thin for you to use as an illustration of some sort of trend in a half-dozen posts across 3 threads though, don't you think?

(You probably didn't notice the vote count just below where you cropped the screen grab?...honest mistake.)

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Jim Wiseman
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:53:50 am

Here is one of the many responses at the petition site:

Been a user since CS 3.5.

Having attended NAB this year, looking back now I know why you refused to be clear on any additional details about the product releases... instead just trying to cram Creative Cloud's benefits down our throat. If you would have made this announcement at NAB, people would have left your booth in droves... heading over to Autodesk or Avid immediately.

You are doubling the cost to use your software for my business and we'll have to look elsewhere for our needs. This is deception and greed.

Many more good ones. Over 1,000 now.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:06:36 am

[Jim Wiseman] "Many more good ones. Over 1,000 now."

Nice.

It may make no difference at all, but I feel darn good standing up for something that is important to me.And not letting a money motivated corporation tell me that its in my best interest to rent.

Worse comes to worse. I still get to edit with great software - CS6 :D

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:46:04 am

Excuse me Tom -

But since when is there anything but a money motivated corporation? Would you prefer that Adobe go out of business? Generally speaking, companies are in business to make money...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 3:07:19 am

[Joseph W. Bourke] "But since when is there anything but a money motivated corporation? Would you prefer that Adobe go out of business? Generally speaking, companies are in business to make money...
"


That's what I was wondering, we're ALL in business to make money and when you have shareholders, well making money is more imperative. I'm definitely not in this business just for the fun of it, no matter how much fun we have. :)

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

Foul Water Fiery Serpent, an original documentary featuring Sigourney Weave...
MTWD Entertainment - Developing original content for all media.
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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 4:27:21 am

[Jim Wiseman] "Here is one of the many responses at the petition site:

Been a user since CS 3.5...
"


:-) LOL.

Not sure how significant this guy (or gal) might be for Adobe, other than their legal department on a day when they have nothing better to do.

Production Premium CS3's last release was 3.20, and Web Premium was 3.3...but "CS 3.5" was a relatively common "cracked" version floating around...

That is actually pretty amusing.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Chris Harlan
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 5:26:07 am

[Tim Kolb] "Production Premium CS3's last release was 3.20, and Web Premium was 3.3...but "CS 3.5" was a relatively common "cracked" version floating around...

That is actually pretty amusing.
"


That is a hoot!


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Stephen Bakopanos
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 4:03:40 am

I really had no idea that there were so many editors living on the breadline...


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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 4:39:32 am

[Stephen Bakopanos] "I really had no idea that there were so many editors living on the breadline..."

(chuckle)

I think the announcement may have been a little abrupt for many.

I also think that for a move this substantial, Adobe will have to work at getting the correct information out there as some of this response is based more on the unknown bits of it.

There will definitely be some that decide to set off with Lightworks, Blender, and Gimp to make a point. All this will end up spurring on some competitive development without a doubt...and no matter what, thet's healthy.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:08:05 pm

[Tim Kolb] "Adobe will have to work at getting the correct information out there as some of this response is based more on the unknown bits of it."

Correct info is already out there and folks are responding to the fact that they know that they are being strong armed into a ongoing rental situation.



Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
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Tim Wilson
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 5:12:27 am

[Stephen Bakopanos] "I really had no idea that there were so many editors living on the breadline..."

It explains why they have so much free time.

Tim Wilson
Vice President, Editor-in-Chief
Creative COW



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Jim Wiseman
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 5:16:15 am

If it weren't for editors free time, there wouldn't be a Creative Cow...

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 12:47:40 pm

[Jim Wiseman] "If it weren't for editors free time, there wouldn't be a Creative Cow..."

It's called morning coffee and render time for most. I know that's when I answer the most questions here on the Cow.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

Foul Water Fiery Serpent, an original documentary featuring Sigourney Weave...
MTWD Entertainment - Developing original content for all media.
"This American Land" - our new PBS Series.
"Science Nation" - Three years and counting of Science for the People.

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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:11:51 pm

LOL!

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
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Sandeep Sajeev
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 5:26:12 am

[Steven Bakopanos] I really had no idea that there were so many editors living on the breadline...

Because, the only reason we could possibly not be on board with this is we're poor - therefore we must suck at our jobs and not make very much money.

[Tim Wilson] It explains why they have so much free time.
Again, we must not be very busy to take the time to post on here - therefore we must suck at our jobs.

I feel like I've been Time Warped into the Apple FCPX or Not The Debate, forum from sometime last year, with Joseph.W.Burke in the Bill Davis role and a couple of hopefuls jockeying for the Aindreas part.

Let's hope it's as much fun as that whole trip was.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 5:27:30 am

[Sandeep Sajeev] "Let's hope it's as much fun as that whole trip was."

ROTFL! Indeed.


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:35:17 pm

Ahh...Sandeep...but how do you know I'm not really Bill Davis?

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:09:42 pm

Really Tim?

Tom Daigon
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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 1:56:33 pm

[James Daugherty] "I think we need a software users bill of rights."

That sure might have helped us out of this mess, James.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
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64GB ram
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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:32:44 pm

So Tom - where did this little info graphic come from? I assume it's from the petition web page? Anyway...let's do a little math. If there are 500,000 Cloud subscribers, and 1000 of them are pissed off and ready to pull the plug, what percentage of the total subscribers are represented?

Ahhh....point 002. From a sampling standpoint, that doesn't even fall close to a margin of error, let alone a telling statistic. That would say to me that way over 99 percent of Cloud users are either happy with the plan, or are keeping their mouths shut about it and working away with the software...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tim Wilson
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 3:00:30 pm

[Tom Daigon] "[James Daugherty] "I think we need a software users bill of rights."

That sure might have helped us out of this mess, James."


Something like this?


Article VIII: COMPANY YIELDS RIGHT TO EVER DEVELOP NEW BUSINESS MODEL

Under no circumstances shall The Company adopt a NEW BUSINESS MODEL (hereafter, MODEL), for any reason, including, but not limited to the following:

A. Previously purchased licenses remain in effect;
B. MODEL provides deep discounts for users with previously purchased licenses;
C. MODEL allows professional users to write off the entire licensing cost each year;
D. MODEL provides more rapid deployment of new features, user-requested changes, and/or bug fixes;
E. MODEL provides users better guidance for long-term budgetary planning;
F. MODEL is changing to reflect increasingly common business practice across the software world;
G. MODEL better provides long-term financial stability for The Company;


and ESPECIALLY if:
H. MODEL will potentially annoy, upset, or cause distress to any users.



Something like that?


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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 3:13:03 pm

That about sums it up Tim. Companies by their very nature are in the business of making money and doing what it sees as the correct direction for the company. Apple proved that two years ago. I hated the direction they went so I left to pursue other solutions. In this case, I'm in the majority that agrees with the current direction of the company and I would very much like to see a financially stable Adobe..

Those who don't agree with the direction, well they are in the same position I was two years ago.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

Foul Water Fiery Serpent, an original documentary featuring Sigourney Weave...
MTWD Entertainment - Developing original content for all media.
"This American Land" - our new PBS Series.
"Science Nation" - Three years and counting of Science for the People.

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Jim Wiseman
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 12:44:54 am

Change the "any" to "many" users, Tim. A company is allowed to make as many mistakes as is legal. Apple comes to mind, of course. Didn't buy that one, either.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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walter biscardi
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 1:25:31 am

[Jim Wiseman] "Apple comes to mind, of course. Didn't buy that one, either."

I'll say it again, Apple's mistake is slowly paying dividends for them. FCPX is gaining traction and coming back up from the bottom, almost mirroring the original path of FCP. I don't use it but we do have one copy of it in the shop. Don't discount X by any means, see where we are at next year's NAB, will probably see it in more booths.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

Foul Water Fiery Serpent, an original documentary featuring Sigourney Weave...
MTWD Entertainment - Developing original content for all media.
"This American Land" - our new PBS Series.
"Science Nation" - Three years and counting of Science for the People.

Blog Twitter Facebook


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Chris Harlan
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 4:55:54 pm

That's pretty funny.


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 8, 2013 at 2:43:22 pm

BTW James , many others are stepping up to let Adobe know how they feel. The petition is rapidly approaching 2,000 signatures. Not bad for the short time its been in existence.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid
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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 12:02:34 am

Petition Update.

Signature count is heading toward 3,000.

This represents about one full day of folks motivated by recent events being aware of its existence.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid
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Alex Gerulaitis
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 12:10:56 am

Wish someone rewrote that petition with a modicum of common sense. Nothing's wrong with petitions and letting people's voices heard - even if many such petitions are quite insane - but riding something built on inaccuracies and hysteria does little justice to that voice.


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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 2:15:13 am

[Alex Gerulaitis] "Wish someone rewrote that petition that a modicum of common sense."

Yes...there are certainly aspects of CC that one could make a clear case against, but the petition is a bit informal and non-specific.

I probably wouldn't start off a letter to the entire board and the executives of a multi-billion dollar company with "Listen, we know..."

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 12:13:19 am

Great -

You're closing in on a half of one percent of the CC user base. Looks as if most of the Cloud users are a pretty happy lot...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Art Guglielmo
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 2:12:18 am

A petition can have 300,000 signatures, it means nothing, and quite frankly, Adobe will never even read it.

The only petition that matters is the money. If enough people do not buy the software, then something would happen, but I'm pretty sure that will not be the case.



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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 2:35:49 am

Art, it means something to the people that feel good about standing up for what they feel is important. While most likely voting with their dollars as well.

And both of those things count for a lot in my book.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com


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David Mathis
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 4:41:41 am

[Tom Daigon] "Art, it means something to the people that feel good about standing up for what they feel is important. While most likely voting with their dollars as well.

And both of those things count for a lot in my book."


I agree with you 200% on this. Just voted with my wallet.


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Jim Wiseman
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 5:41:35 am

I did too, I kept it closed.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Tim Kolb
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 11:56:28 am

I think voting with your wallet will do more to communicate for you than that petition will...

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Tom Daigon
Re: Petition
on May 9, 2013 at 1:30:29 pm

:D

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
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