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Eric Santiago
More info...
on Jul 27, 2012 at 10:18:32 pm

Im not sure if this was mentioned but do any of you have any info as what is rated for BMCC such as SSD and misc (throw in whatever here)?
I cant seem to find anything on the BMD site on this.


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Jul 27, 2012 at 10:51:55 pm

Hi Eric,

I spoke to Dan May at the New York meet up and he said that the recording mechanisms are more or less a Hyperdeck Shuttle and as such, the approved SSDs for the Hyperdeck should have no problem with the BMCC.

You may find this link useful:
http://www.blackmagic-design.com/support/detail/supportnotes/supportnote/?s...

Also, there are a couple of cages that have been announced specifically for the BMCC such as the ViewFactor Contineo Cage and Shape also now has a cage as well.

http://www.viewfactor.net/blog/?p=71
http://shapewlb.com/en/black-magic-series.aspx

There will also be a BMCC specific A-Box from Wooden Camera.

Exciting times!

Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 8GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Marco Solorio
Re: More info...
on Jul 27, 2012 at 11:49:45 pm

I spoke directly with BMD last month regarding approved SSD compatibility so that I can purchase my SSDs before the camera arrived. She pointed me to the same link for approved SSDs for the HyperDeck.

I rolled the dice and bought a few SSDs based off that list in hopes that they'll work fine when my Cinema Camera arrives from BMD (hopefully soon). So far I have one SanDisk Extreme 480GB SSD, and two Crucial M4 512GB SSDs.

Juan Salvo mentioned he had issues with the Crucial M4 SSDs using the BMD HyperDeck, so hopefully that doesn't translate into issues with the Cinema Camera as well. I'll find out soon enough. I have a feeling though that the SanDisk will be the winner, even though it's slightly smaller in size. All just guesses on my part for now, so don't run out and buy 100 SanDisk SSDs. We'll all know soon enough which SSD is truly the best in terms of stability and performance once the camera is shipping.

On a similar note, John Brawley has had HORRIBLE results with the OCZ Vertex 3 SSD on the pre-release Cinema Camera, so I'd steer clear of that drive like the plague.

Lastly, those two cages from Shape and Viewfactor look great. I have both of them on order to be sent to me. Hopefully they get here before the camera does! =)

Marco Solorio | CreativeCow Host | OneRiver Media | ORM Blog | Facebook | Twitter | Media Batch


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Eric Santiago
Re: More info...
on Jul 28, 2012 at 9:32:42 pm

Thanks for the info Marco and Matthew.
Here's something I found in Twitter http://www.jigsawbroadcast.com/articles/first-look-blackmagic-design-cinema...


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Eric Santiago
Re: More info...
on Jul 28, 2012 at 9:38:07 pm

thanks again for the links.
I love the fact that the CC isnt odd in shape.
Im pretty sure you can even machine your own using older parts from prev set-ups.
yes this is exciting times indeed :)
heck I even ordered the handles.
how does the Hyperdeck fit in the CC workflow in your opinion?


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Jul 29, 2012 at 1:40:11 am

Yup, I ordered the handles also. I'm hoping that when/if BMD start to release further accessories than the handles will be integrated as part of their ideas. I.E., a specifically designed LANC controller that attaches to them.

And I agree with you about the shape of the camera. It definitely lends itself to some clever use of old DSLR rigs and if one were feeling handy, and had the machinery, to building ones own cages and rigs from scratch.

As for the Hyperdeck in a CC workflow, I have been hearing some people saying that it could be used as a redundant recording mechanism due to the SDI out on the BMCC. It won't record the 2.5K since the SDI only carries 1080, but especially if you will be working with the ProRes or DNxHD options, then it can be a really nice way to go in terms of redundant copies, especially if you don't trust SSD's quite yet. You could also have a ProRes or DNxHD recording going simultaneously while the camera is recording uncompressed 2.5K and you will then have some more edit friendly files than the CinemaDNG which you can reconnect to later for your color grade.

Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 8GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Eric Santiago
Re: More info...
on Jul 29, 2012 at 4:26:33 pm

I cant wait to see what the live feed looks like from the 3G SDI into a Flander :)
The shopping is endless and have to learn to stop.
Do you guys want to post your wish list for this?
For the ones with DSLR gear you are so lucky :)


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Jul 29, 2012 at 9:47:13 pm

Personally the top of my list to buy is the Alphatron viewfinder, the Tokina 11-16 Version 2 (will be pre-ordering this as well), and a solid audio solution, probably a Sound Devices mixer. For my own work I've been very happy with my Manfrotto 504HD and it can definitely handle the BMCC so I'm set for tripod support. I will probably hold off on cages and hand held support beyond the handles for a while as I am more of a tripod shooter anyway. Also, I know that more and more companies will be coming out with accessories through the year so when it comes to camera specific gear like that, I will want to wait to see what Zacuto and Redrock Micro will have to offer. I also will need to be buying my SSDs which I have not done yet so that will be a hefty cost as well that I will need to factor in. The one camera specific thing that I will be getting early on will be a battery solution. There is the Switronix option but I also will want to see what other companies will come out with. I have been checking Hot Rod Cameras to see if they have announced their battery solution but still nothing. Would love to hear what people are planning as far as power is concerned.

Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 8GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Marco Solorio
Re: More info...
on Jul 29, 2012 at 11:16:00 pm

Just a note about cage use, I mostly shoot on tripods, jibs, and anything else that the camera can be mounted to. BUT, I find that keeping my cameras in their cages works out best for me, especially since the top handle is always on them, which helps move the rigging much easier and quicker. Plus mounting other items, like LCD monitors and such make it much easier and quicker. My 5D and 7D each have their own cages. Can't work without them quite honestly. I have the Viewfactor and Shape cages on their way for the BMDCC and know that the camera will never be cageless!

Regarding battery options, there are many options that already exists (although not undermounted like the Switronix). I have a few mountable V-mount plate options that I use with my HDSLR rigs (one of them I actually built myself with voltage regulators and LED voltage readings), and will be using them with the BMDCC. All you need is the battery type of your choice (typically V-mount or Anton Bauer), a plate design that fits to 15mm rods (eBay has a TON), and a connector that plugs between the battery plate and the camera. The BMDCC has a wide voltage range, so you don't even need to worry about matching voltage types, which makes it really easy.

Marco Solorio | CreativeCow Host | OneRiver Media | ORM Blog | Facebook | Twitter | Media Batch


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Eric Santiago
Re: More info...
on Jul 29, 2012 at 11:23:46 pm

Wow that Alphatron EVF-035W-3G sounds amazing. Its up there in price but I might have to watch out for something lower or go with a SmallHD type display (got used to that with the RED).
For sound mixing, any thoughts on that?


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Jul 30, 2012 at 2:40:29 am

Marco, I honestly didn't even think of a top handle. Definitely an oversight on my part. I agree with you that a cage is incredibly important. I would love to hear your experiences with the Shape and Viewfactor cages when they come in. For safety sake of the camera I absolutely want to get a cage as soon as I can, but like Eric said, the shopping is endless.

As for power, you're right that there are many options already. And a battery plate for a V mount or an Anton Bauer would be a very versatile piece of equipment. The wide voltage range does also make it particularly friendly to different power options. With the Switronix, I like that it's actually a battery a grip. It feels like it could be a good way to go, though the V-mount can be a good counter weight too. I guess everything has their trade offs.

Eric, yes I think that the Alphatron is expensive but compared to the other options I think that it really is the best out there. Yes the SmallHD is great but you will need to get an SDI to HDMI mini converter or some other conversion option which will give you latency in your EVF. Could get deceiving, if not nauseating. To me, the extra money for the quality, and the versatility, especially considering that it does both SDI and HDMI loop through and that it is actually made by TVLogic, makes it worth the premium price tag.

For sound mixing, I am seriously looking at the Sound Devices 302 mixer and the Sound Devices MixPre-D. In many cases, the MixPre-D will be great as it is two channel, phantom power, but the 302 is a bit more of a full featured mixer. The three channel also means you can have two lavs and a shotgun so that's a nice basic audio setup there.

Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 8GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Eric Santiago
Re: More info...
on Jul 30, 2012 at 2:57:03 am

I want to thank you both for keeping this post alive.
Not only is it helpful but therapeutic ;)
Yes the shopping list is endless.
I do have deep resources in my disposal for bigger projects.
I would probably spend a month with the Cinema Camera and Handle before making any moves with credit card :)
So glad I have friends with lenses ;)

Now if we can only get John Brawley here to posts his gear list ;)


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Peter J. DeCrescenzo
Re: More info...
on Jul 30, 2012 at 3:22:51 am

[Eric Santiago] "... Now if we can only get John Brawley here to posts his gear list ;)"

JB's "gear list" varies quite a bit for different productions, as does mine:
http://twitter.com/brawlster/status/219654802685173761/photo/1/large
http://twitter.com/brawlster/status/226197687354150913/photo/1/large

Goes w/o saying that you don't always need a lot of kit to make beautiful images.

Cheers.

---

http://www.peterdv.com


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Eric Santiago
Re: More info...
on Jul 30, 2012 at 4:38:31 am

Thanks Peter for the post.
I think Ill need to work out more to carry that rig from second pic :)


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John Brawley
Re: More info...
on Aug 5, 2012 at 12:31:28 pm

I actually don't own a lot of gear.

I have a geared head because n one in Australia will pay for one on a job. The only way I can have the choice to use one is if I supply it !

I have a lor od DEDO lights, especially the more obscure ones gaffers don't normally tend to carry...I also have a few kinos.

Mostly what I have is format agnostic. I've managed to pretty much avoid owning a camera....

I even managed to avoid getting a 5D.

All i've got is a buch of still shear (Olympus / Contax / Medium format) thats not shooting related

So actually most of the time I end up renting what I want.

I am though now...putting together a list of what I like and have even ordered some gear. i'm going to build up a BMCC kit for myself.

jb


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Steven Hacker
Re: More info...
on Jan 13, 2013 at 11:46:49 am

I have the Crucial 512 M4 and on long takes (over two minutes) with my BMCC in ProRes I get a flashing Rec button instead of a solid one. Reviewing my footage I discovered I lose sync. I called BMD and they think it might be the Crucial. They are very surprised it is happening in ProRes. So I bought the Kingston on the list. Same issue.


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Marco Solorio
Re: More info...
on Jan 13, 2013 at 8:31:48 pm

[Steven Hacker] "I have the Crucial 512 M4 and on long takes (over two minutes) with my BMCC in ProRes I get a flashing Rec button instead of a solid one. Reviewing my footage I discovered I lose sync. I called BMD and they think it might be the Crucial. They are very surprised it is happening in ProRes. So I bought the Kingston on the list. Same issue."

The Crucial 512 M4 SSDs are a known drive to not work well with the BMCC. The drop frames every second in ProRes and can drop frames in RAW once in a while. In short, do not use Crucial M4 drives with the BMCC. I've outlined this here, in other forums, and on my OneRiver Media Facebook page. I owned two of them before shelving them for other work than the BMCC.

The only SSD I use at this point is the SanDisk Extreme 480GB. Works perfectly in both ProRes and RAW, including live event production I've done with the BMCC where record times were as long as two hours. It's the only SSD I trust at this point as it's been 100% rock solid. Fast boot times too (the Crucials were much slower). I have not tried the smaller 240GB version of the SanDisk, nor is it on the approved list. Keep in mind that larger SSDs work faster with the BMCC. For me, the 480GB is the only choice.

Marco Solorio | CreativeCow Host | OneRiver Media | ORM Blog | Facebook | Twitter | Media Batch


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Steven Hacker
Re: More info...
on Jan 13, 2013 at 11:18:29 pm

Thank you Marco! I only wish I read your comments on this issue before B&H told me to get the Crucial. Also, Blackmagic's FAQ list shows the Crucial M4 256MB as one they suggest. And when I spoke to BMD support on Friday, they were surprised that I had a problem with the Crucial.

I went today and bought the SanDisk Extreme 480GB and just as you said, it worked flawlessly for a 16 minute roll on the BMCC.

Again, thanks.

Steve


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Paul Jay
Re: More info...
on Feb 15, 2013 at 2:00:37 pm

We have these issues as well with the 512 GB Crucial M4.

Just to confirm.

Did anyone here used Thunderbolt ultracope during capture?

Or did you also had dropped frames without using the Thunderbolt output during capture.


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Paul Jay
Re: More info...
on Feb 15, 2013 at 3:27:29 pm

I have the Crucial 512 M4

The moment i connect Ultrascope or Media Express to the camera and hit record, it's dropping frames.

Disconnect Thunderbolt and the Dropped Frames are gone.

I'm getting doubts if this is SSD brand related.

I would like to know if the people with Sandisk 480 SSD don't have dropped when frames when Ultrascope is connected during record.


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Feb 15, 2013 at 3:38:11 pm

Are you trying to record raw over Thunderbolt or is this an issue with just trying to monitor over Ultrascope? If trying to record, my guess is that your computer may not be fast enough to handle the raw recording. It is huge bandwidth. But as per the SSD question, my understanding is that many people have had issues with the Crucial M4 SSD's. Marco has been using the SanDisk 480 successfully and while it is not on the approved list, I have been successfully using the SanDisk 240 SSD's. My experience really is that the SanDisks are the best around for this camera.

Blackmagic Cinema Camera, RED Scarlet-X, Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 16GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Paul Jay
Re: More info...
on Feb 15, 2013 at 3:57:39 pm

You can't record RAW over Thunderbolt. You can record ProRes in Media Express for example.
But this is not about RAW recording.

The moment i connect the BMC with Thunderbolt to my MacBook Pro Retina ( for Ultrascope or Media Express ) i get dropped frames internally on the camera in ProRes.

The record button is blinking.

When i disconnect the Thunderbolt it does not drop frames on the Crucial 512GB SSD


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Feb 15, 2013 at 4:33:18 pm

From Blackmagic's tech specs,

"Computer Interface Thunderbolt port for capture of RAW video and audio. USB 2.0 mini B port for software updates and configuration. Thunderbolt port for capture of RAW video and audio. USB 2.0 mini B port for software updates and configuration."

I'm unsure why this would be happening for you though. I have not tried it myself but I do know that the Crucial SSDs have cause various problems. This may be yet another.

Blackmagic Cinema Camera, RED Scarlet-X, Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 16GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Paul Jay
Re: More info...
on Feb 20, 2013 at 2:04:44 pm

With RAW video they mean you can capture umcompressed or ProRes from the Thunderbolt connection.

It's a live capture.

It's not RAW like the internal DNG RAW capture.


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Matthew Sonnenfeld
Re: More info...
on Feb 20, 2013 at 3:04:04 pm

Paul,

Could you please direct me to where you are finding this information? I don't think I have ever seen anything that says that it captures "uncompressed" over thunderbolt as opposed to raw. My understanding was that the SDI is uncompressed while the Thunderbolt is raw.

Blackmagic Cinema Camera, RED Scarlet-X, Panasonic HPX170, Canon 7D
2011 Macbook Pro 17", 2.3 Ghz Quad Core, 16GB RAM
AJA IoXT
Adobe Production Premium CS6, Avid Symphony 6, Final Cut Pro Studio 3
The College of William and Mary


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Marco Solorio
Re: More info...
on Feb 20, 2013 at 6:08:03 pm

[Matthew Sonnenfeld] "Could you please direct me to where you are finding this information? I don't think I have ever seen anything that says that it captures "uncompressed" over thunderbolt as opposed to raw. My understanding was that the SDI is uncompressed while the Thunderbolt is raw."

When using TBolt on the Cinema Camera, it captures Uncompressed (not ProRes) for 1080 HD at either 8-bit or 10-bit, and at 23.98, 25 or 29.97 FPS. There is currently no support for 2.5K resolution over TBolt.

Marco Solorio | CreativeCow Host | OneRiver Media | ORM Blog | Facebook | Twitter | Media Batch


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