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Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?

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eofeapr
Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 20, 2007 at 7:55:06 pm

Hi am a total Nubee here and I'm trying to learn this stuff.

I'm running Premiere pro 2 on;

tyan tiger
2x opteron 2.6 ghz
quadro fx 3000
2 sata 10k rpm os, capture - respectively
2 eide 7,200 rpm storage only drives

so far I think the system is ok but when I finish a project in either 24fps progressive, or straight 30 fps interlaced fottage I feel the footage is not as pristine as I would like (blotchy blacks, grain, dull edges)

How can I get my footage to the quality of what you see on tv or movies ??


thnx in advance
joe


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Alex Cantu
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 27, 2007 at 10:43:34 pm

Hi Joe

You have a great configuration... yet, let me ask a few things:

1.- how do u capture video?
2.- what's is source footage?
3.- do work with premiere alone?
4.- what's your final output?

I'll asume you work with DV format, which is not a "high quality" format. It's barely ok for most usages, but as u keep adding effects it degrates, also your camera and lightning matters on the quality; and finally the way u capture affects quality too. While many people work with 1394 I/O (which is fine) u can get more options and/or clearer signal by capturing component video, HDMI or SDI; now, dv is not the only way to go, DVCPro 50 and HDV gives u higher imge qualilty, also adding extra harware makes available propetary codecs that otherway u'll never have acces, or the possibility to work 8-bit or 10-bit uncompressed and cleaner effects.

There's lot know... i've been in this business since I was 20, and still believe there's lot to learn...hahaha I just remembered the old 3/4 inch tape days and first SCSI disks... woo, seems like it was yesterday.

Anyway, feel free to ask


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eofeapr
thnx for your time
on Aug 29, 2007 at 1:44:21 am

Thank you for taking the time for my post.
I'd like to start with answers to your post.

1.- how do u capture video?
firewire straigt from CAM for now, I'd love to get a deck but anything worth it is about 1000 or so and I'm still recovering from 2500 spent on the cam

2.- what's is source footage?
minidv, (is that what you're asking ?)(just in case I am focussed on human interest and documentary type work)
I shoot with dvx100b, some in 24p, then 30p, and 30I
I do my best to shoot as well as I can without depending on too much correction at post. You've clear up the degradation question in advance, although I did not take that into consideration it just made sense to me that one should film footage as close to finished quality at the CAM.

3.- do work with premiere alone?
no I am mostly on premiere, I like Final Cut just fine but my IMAC is pretty much stipped down G5 with base RAM and not up for editing(I see a MAC Pro in my future though, distant future but I do see me going there someday)
I've tried my buds Vegas but I did not like the layout too much so only light experience there,
tried Edius I like it but the expense is not prudent right now,
tried Avid a while back can't remember it too well but I'm under the impression it does'nt play well with AMD processors so it's mute.

4.- what's your final output?
Actually, the highest posible DVD quality is my focuss for right now.
I'm currently trying to learn to encode for best posible quality, stuff I could get paid for if and when I could score a job.
ALSO, In the future I'd love to take my experience into the corporate training venue and DVD would make the most sense there.
Wedding shoots are a posibity so DVD is again the likely choice of end product.
So ,,, in a word DVD(ok three words) Wink
But I'll admit that as I get more into this field I will probably want to extend my work toward all other media types if and when the time comes.



So,,, you say
'' While many people work with 1394 I/O (which is fine) u can get more options and/or clearer signal by capturing component video, HDMI or SDI''
in your post, I was under the impression that with 1394 was top of the mountain, guess I got some biased advice. Please tell me more about this, I take it I will have to get a capture card??

Also, you say
'' DVCPro 50 and HDV gives u higher imge qualilty, also adding extra harware makes available propetary codecs that otherway u'll never have acces, or the possibility to work 8-bit or 10-bit uncompressed and cleaner effects. '' in your post,,,
I'm all too aware about Pro50 and HD but these CAMs are a lil out of my leage right now,,, the extra hardware you mention here again is that a capture card discussion ???

will look forward to your response, I am so eager to learn the technology and knowing you have 20 years experience and willing to address my post is like gold to me. Your advice means alot thank so much.

joe


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Alex Cantu
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 29, 2007 at 8:58:59 pm

Nice cam! I've worked with that one for a commercial recently, I was very pleased with results. It was shot in 24p and took the footage to AFX for color correction and adding some post fx.

Back to your post. DV/mini DV is a "cheap" format (reason why is so popular, even in broadcast) and a good tape/camera prevent drops and stuff. Problem is that DV is a compressed format and has same artifact issues (similar to the noise/pixelate in jpeg) and poor croma value (so it can give a headache for keying). So, you're right trying to get cleanest shot as possible.

What i meant by "premiere alone" was if u work software only or with additional harware. I don't like MAC ...too expensive hehehe
But seriously, extra hardware gives u better codec option, faster enconding, and less render (but dv alone is not so demanding).

Is not just a "capture card", u may find cheap options that has little to offer to your workflow other than capturing analog. So far your final output is DVD yuo've made the right choices.

1394 is the best I/O for DV format because it transport DATA and (and so far i know) it can't send data other way than DV (but there is no analog to digital conversion in the process and therefor no loss), yet HDMI and SDI decompress data in a different way and allows you to choose a specific codec to work in your timeline.

And finally... I'm not that old!!! hahaha i said since I was 20 years old, not 20 years of experience. Anyway feel free to ask.


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eofeapr
What hardware ??
on Aug 29, 2007 at 11:49:06 pm

Sorry did not mean to imply anything about old , I read it too fast.
I'm 49 myself so watch what cha say bout old Wink

In reference to the hardware question please enlighten me, what additional hardware would I benefit from in Premiere ??

I'm glad to hear you like the dvx100. The fact that you have done pro work with it is really reassuring to me.


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Alex Cantu
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 30, 2007 at 8:22:29 pm

Basically it depends if u want to migrate to HDV, otherwise 1394 is enough.

Matrox (RTx2) has two good cards in the mid-range (one for HDV, and the other for DV plus some HDV features like capture and downscale), and Black Magic Design has an option for premiere (but this is closer to a high end equipment).


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eofeapr
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 30, 2007 at 11:35:27 pm

well matrox is out cause I have no pci extreme on my tyan mobo

if I did have pic x what would improve for me with this card ???


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Alex Cantu
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 31, 2007 at 5:29:52 pm

Mmmm that's a though one, most PCIe cards are replacing PCI-X in the midrange workstations.

And only high end products (like Matrox Axio or Edius SP) are designed for PCI-X and they're for HD workflows.

If u stick to SD for a while Matrox RTx2 SD and Ediux DVX might be the best cards for u (though limited for HDV). Well... Avid Liquid is an external module via USB, but I hate the interfase and feels totally ankward if u are already familiar to another NLE,plus version 7 has several hardware compatibility issues (haha these guys most hate, always post negative stuff, u see, we bought one at my work place and got really disapointed)... but is sort of popular among newbies.

Plase don't make a rushed purchase. Adding a card isn't a magical solution and it means that u may have to change all your current workflow and perhaps buying a deck in order to get full benefit (in case u are capturing directlly from the camera).

So, question reamain, are u planning to migrate to HDV in the short term?


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eofeapr
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Aug 31, 2007 at 8:42:26 pm

no, not short term, Iwill,, eventually but right now it's not in the budget.

I think I'll have to go it 'as I am' SD, firewire, Premiere,,, and stick with my encoding solutions for now.

As I mentioned earlier, I am looking forward to migrating to MAC Pro in the future. When I do a used machine may become an option. If so I may save enough from the purchase to go with a good HD capture solution that makes sense. If at the time there is anything out there that is a must have for HD I'd be willing to use my credit card and finance some of the hardware.
Till then my current mission is to get good with what I now own.

You previously mentioned having done a commercial with a dvx100, would you care to share the details of your workflow on that shoot???
plz tell me about your lighting scheme, audio, titling, ect ect..
I'm anxious to learn more.

thnx
joe


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Alex Cantu
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Sep 13, 2007 at 4:19:13 pm

Hi again

Here's the way we worked for that comercial.

The comercial was about house cleaning products, so basically we had the model for the introduction and several demos on how the products work (most of these were close shots to get details). Also the photographer insisted on using lens adapters to get field depth and avoid the "video look".

For the demos we use fill light and tried to avoid shadows, the mops and brushes "cleaned" already clean surfaces and added the filth and highlights in post production, though some had real filth like the stove and the windows.

We had a hard time explaining the client why we wanted shadows, shadows give volume and depht and they did't get at first but they liked what they were watching on the monitor. So, the shot was in the living room, a main light, a back light and a fill light, all them with a soft filter. We hd the shot done several times (long, full, medium and close), so i could have opions for editing.

For the sound we recorded to the camera and hard drive. Left was a boom mic and Right a lavalier mic, (lavalier worked better in most cases).

That's pretty much it.


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jordan
Re: Is my system OK for Premiere pro ?
on Oct 27, 2007 at 3:22:29 am

It was shot in 24p and took the footage to AFX for color correction and adding some post fx.


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