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Grainy/Liney(?) Footage

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Ryan Neuman
Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 8, 2017 at 5:23:55 pm

This is a really specific question and I'm guessing I'm in the right forum for it. I just uploaded this video:



and I can't for the life of me figure out why some of the background is very grainy/liney where it looks like it's moving. You can clearly see it in the first shot off in the background.

I edit on Final Cut Pro X (version 10.3.4) on a Mac (Sierra 10.12.6) and I shoot on a Canon XA10. My camera settings are usually on 24fps (PF24), my recording mode is MXP, 1/24 (but I just changed this to 1/48) shutter speed, and with the aperture at F1.8.

Does it have something to do with transcoding the media to "create optimized media" or "create proxy media"? I don't fully understand how these work but any help would be greatly appreciated!


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Doug Metz
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 8, 2017 at 6:35:48 pm

Looks like an interlacing issue.

Either you've got progressive footage in an interlaced timeline, or interlaced footage in a progressive timeline.

If your project is progressive, select that first shot and go to the 'Info' tab of the inspector, Settings view, and tick the Deinterlace checkbox. That should clean it up - verify that setting for each clip in the timeline.

If your project is interlaced, you'll want to change it to progressive (changing the project frame rate only works on an empty timeline, however you can switch from Interlaced to Progressive with an existing edit) and then make sure that all of your interlaced shots have that Deinterlace setting active. You can change it in the browser before you start an edit, just be aware that changing the setting on the master clip in the browser won't affect the bits that are already in a sequence. Anything after that will be groovy.

Doug Metz

Anode


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Claude Lyneis
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 8, 2017 at 6:42:59 pm

PF24 on the XA10 is some sort of progressive recording recording that was interlaced. http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-vixia-series-avchd-hdv-camcorders/489157-...
I think this has since been abandoned. It may be the cause of those wavy lines. For the web, you would be better served by shoot PF 30 on the xa10. On the XA20 that I use now, I think it is best to use29.97 P MP4, which is truly progressive.
I used an XA10 for sometime, now use XA20 and it is an improvement, but still thinking about a camera that can do 4:2:2 10 bit properly.
I know if film school they all want you to shoot at 24 fps, but if it is going on the web, it seems to me 30 fps is the way to go. Of course I do a lot of sports and favor 60 fps because it makes slow motion so much better.


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Jeff Kirkland
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 8, 2017 at 9:17:46 pm

I may just get out of it easy because I'm in a 25p country but with the XA10, I usually only have to go to the info panel and tell FCPX it's got progressive footage rather than actually deinterlace it.

----
Jeff Kirkland | Video Producer & Cinematographer
Hobart, Tasmania | Twitter: @jeffkirkland


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Joe Marler
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 9, 2017 at 5:14:38 pm

Besides the good advice you already got, it is difficult to assess these things after they've been re-encoded by Youtube. For some content Youtube will deinterlace this during encoding, but this content may have had interlacing baked into a progressive container.

I suggest you examine the output file using VLC which allows manual control over deinterlacing, and selection of various deinterlace modes. You can also confirm both camera file and the output file interlace settings using a tool like MediaInfo: https://mediaarea.net/en/MediaInfo/Download/Mac_OS or Invisor: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/invisor-media-file-inspector/id442947586?mt...

If the camera material is really interlaced content somehow masquerading as progressive, and if the intent is a deinterlaced output, it might require setting the "deinterlace" checkbox in the Inspector. Select the clip in the timeline, in the Inspector at the bottom right change from Basic to Settings, then above that select the deinterlace checkbox. Export that clip and examine with VLC with deinterlace both enabled then disabled.


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Jeff Kirkland
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 9, 2017 at 8:09:45 pm
Last Edited By Jeff Kirkland on Sep 9, 2017 at 8:15:05 pm

The XA10 records PsF (progressive frames in an interlaced signal) which the camera mis-tags and FCPX incorrectly interprets as being actual interlaced footage. Deinterlacing, which is what FCPX is trying to do to it, will cause unwanted artifacts.

You can either try setting Field Dominance Override of each clip to progressive or have something like EditReady rewrap the footage before import. EditReady will correctly interpret the PsF files and set the progressive flag properly in the rewrapped version.

----
Jeff Kirkland | Video Producer & Cinematographer
Hobart, Tasmania | Twitter: @jeffkirkland


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Ryan Neuman
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 19, 2017 at 12:43:39 pm

Thank you for all the help everyone. Checking the "Deinterlace" box and changing the Field Dominance Override to "Progressive" seemed to do the trick. Here's the latest video I did:







It looks good for the most part without any of that grainy/liney footage that I first talked about but I do notice somewhat of a motion blur(?) or something when there's a lot of movement. You can especially see it in the 2nd to last scene with the guy carrying boxes in the background. Not really sure what that is, but for the most part it looks a lot better than the video I posted at the very beginning of this thread.


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Doug Metz
Re: Grainy/Liney(?) Footage
on Sep 19, 2017 at 6:39:11 pm

[Ryan Neuman] "It looks good for the most part without any of that grainy/liney footage that I first talked about but I do notice somewhat of a motion blur(?) or something when there's a lot of movement."

What you're seeing is burned-in interlacing. I wonder if overriding the field dominance is the culprit... my thinking is that by essentially telling FCPX to ignore field info and read as progressive, it's getting burned in. You're probably also seeing this on your master output file.

I'd go back in (just as a quick test) and reset the field dominance on a clip or two to the proper value - probably top first, leave Deinterlace checked - and export a short clip to see if that gets 'er done.

Doug Metz

Anode


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