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Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube

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Rikki Blow
Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 10, 2017 at 4:00:14 pm

Do any of you clever folk have any ideas why my FCPX exports (decent quality .movs OR .mp4) are changing colour quite dramatically when processed on both YouTube and Vimeo, and, more to the point, is there anything I can do to prevent it?

Specifically, I'm editing films with a 'brand' orange colour used on title screens etc, and it always comes out way redder online. The export looks absolutely fine on my 2016 MacBook Pro decent spec touch bar jobbie, and if I upload a screengrab to YouTube/Vimeo as the thumbnail/screenshot, then that also looks fine, but the processed video always comes back looking red.

Anyone got any suggestions of what to look for in my export that might be casuing this, as I'm sure it's not a common occurence on these sites, and I also don't think it was happening on earlier versions of FCPX.

I'm on latest FCPX 3.4, and Sierra 10.12.2, and I'm exporting with a fairly standard H.264 HD mov setting, although same thing happens on a slightly smaller .mp4 too.

Attached screens of exported mov

and then how it looks on Vimeo (exactly the same effect on YouTube too).


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Noah Kadner
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 12:52:00 am

Not much you can do here- YouTube tends to apply its own filters upon upload. Try a shorter upload from a ProRes compression.

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP Exchange - FCPX Workshops
XinTwo - FCPX Training


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Rikki Blow
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 11:07:29 am

hi noah

well yes, i uploaded a 20 second colour test in prores 422 and that remains the brand orange.

but clearly i can't start putting up 8 minute interviews in this codec.

do you think that fiddling about slightly with the orange values i might be able to find something that compresses closer to what the brand colour should be? or will the whole orange range just turn red?

isn't it weird that vimeo is also turning this red? that's why i decided to ask on an FCPX forum rather than a YouTube forum - it seemed unlikely both youtube and vimeo were using the same compression technique.


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Bret Williams
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 12:07:31 pm

What's your bit rate?

_______________________________________________________________________
http://BretFX.com FCP X Plugins & Templates for Editors & Motion Graphics Artists


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Rikki Blow
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 1:17:08 pm

bit rate info:



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Bret Williams
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 2:37:41 pm

Ok, so 16mb/sec. That should be fine. You're REC709? I'm wondering if it's a color profile thing. I do a lot of Home Depot work (can you say orange?) and I've never come across this color shift.

_______________________________________________________________________
http://BretFX.com FCP X Plugins & Templates for Editors & Motion Graphics Artists


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Rikki Blow
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 5:41:17 pm

yep i know that youtube filters and compresses, but this is such a big shift, and although i guess the video looks generally a tiny bit redder if you look hard, it's this particular shade of orange that seems to go way off - also the fact it's doing the same on vimeo makes me really wonder if i have some weird camera or FCPX colour profiling setting wrong somewhere along the workflow, but i'm just not sure where to look. i don't think it stems from any camera setting though, because i've imported and edited footage from other cameras with same result.


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Noah Kadner
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 11, 2017 at 11:51:56 pm

Also you might have an issue in your monitor calibration. I would recommend doing a final grade out to a broadcast monitor ie not your desktop.

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP Exchange - FCPX Workshops
XinTwo - FCPX Training


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Rikki Blow
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 12, 2017 at 9:49:31 am

unfortunately i don't have a broadcast monitor, but i'm a bit confused - if it's a monitor thing then surely watching a youtube video would have have the same cast as watching the quicktime or the pre-edit in final cut.

they might ALL be wrong, but not JUST the uploaded/compressed one.

am i misunderstanding something about calibration?


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Noah Kadner
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 12, 2017 at 7:44:51 pm

You could try the Rec2020 preset and see if it makes any difference.

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP Exchange - FCPX Workshops
XinTwo - FCPX Training


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Rikki Blow
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 13, 2017 at 4:17:33 pm

tried 2020 and any difference was negligible.

however, have been doing a bunch of tests using 'Drop' - a neat little screen colour analyser, and after playing around with monitor profiles and different browsers, i've got some more details to report.

main headline - this seems to be a HUGE problem with Firefox. (v 54.0 on Sierra on 2016 Touch Bar 15" MacBook Pro)

I created a short video in FCPX of a simple solid orange screen (RGB 244/70/28) and uploaded it to youtube and to vimeo.

looking at the vids on Safari browser (which I don't often use), they are coming back within reasonable tolerance of those RGB values. the only slight anomaly is that the YouTube generated thumbnail choices are a lot redder, but I tend to upload thumbnails generally and these always look fine on both Firefox and Safari.

but looking at both Vimeo and YouTube on the Firefox, the solid orange videos appear bright red (like 255/0/0!! - although the self-generated thumbnail on Vimeo reads 255/30/00).

doing a bit of research on Firefox, seems a few other folk have complained of some colour problems. I tried setting my icc profile in the Firefox color_management configuration (which was a suggestion on one mozilla forum), but this didn't help - and i haven't got any further with this.

one other big difference of note between Safari & Firefox:
when i was playing around selecting different colour profiles on my monitor, i discovered that Safari would change its look in the same way as the rest of my monitor screen, but Firefox would briefly blink as I changed, and while the rest of my screen takes on new colours, the web page reverts to however Firefox was displaying it - ie keeping the colours constant.

all this is probably straying far outside the remit of an FCPX forum, sorry, but it started with my concerns over export settings and why my video colours might be changing so much when uploaded.

if anyone has any Firefox colour knowledge they'd like to share, I'm still baffled what's happening and why it's not a big deal the hasn't been fixed by Mozilla (unless it's some system or software setting i'm missing here).

attached is a pic of various oranges! top left is YouTube on Firefox, top right Vimeo. in the middle is the quicktime i uploaded. bottom left and right are Safari on YouTube and Firefox respectively. hopefully you can see why this freaking me out!


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Bret Williams
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 13, 2017 at 11:13:28 pm

Don't worry. Nobody else is using Firefox. :)

_______________________________________________________________________
http://BretFX.com FCP X Plugins & Templates for Editors & Motion Graphics Artists


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Noah Kadner
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 14, 2017 at 5:10:48 am

Was just going to say- problem solved...

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP Exchange - FCPX Workshops
XinTwo - FCPX Training


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Rikki Blow
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 14, 2017 at 8:14:27 am

well maybe it's a UK thing, but i know lots of firefox users :(


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Noah Kadner
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 14, 2017 at 8:23:24 pm

Sounds like an issue to bring to Mozilla's attention then. Though I'm guessing they've long known about it for a while already and perhaps don't consider color accurate web video a major priority?

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP Exchange - FCPX Workshops
XinTwo - FCPX Training


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Shane Ross
Re: Colours changing when I upload to Vimeo/YouTube
on Aug 15, 2017 at 5:44:46 pm

The best you can do is export a ProRes master and deliver that. How it's encoded by YouTube or Vimeo...and how Firefox or Safari or Chrome display that...is out of your control. Nothing you can do about it. I deliver shows to TV networks, and I can say that they get compressed by the network, and then sent out via satellite to various cable providers, who then encode that signal again for their delivery system. And I can't control that.

So it might look one way on Spectrum in Los Angeles, but different on Comcast in NY, and COX in Missouri.

To top that off, everyone's TVs (or in your case, computer monitors) are calibrated different, so THAT is a factor in what colors people see.

Shane
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Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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