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Dealing with size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections?

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Michael Angelo
Dealing with size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections?
on Jul 31, 2014 at 6:34:11 am

Is there anyway to deal with the size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections if you have lots of keywords?

Having to scroll up and down to make keyword choices in the little filter search window is beyond painful for large projects with lots of Keywords, it makes it difficult to conceptualize ideas. As I approach 1000 hours of footage for my doc it's hard to keep to 30 keywords as Larry Jordan suggests in this article:

FCP X: Find Media Using Keywords
http://www.larryjordan.biz/fcp-x-find-media-using-keywords/

I've been examining other work flows digging through the threads, got some good ideas here, more text search based solutions:

General question about how people are logging and organizing footage
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/344/10397#10397

Thing is I'm a bit afraid to throw out all the thoughtful key wording I've done so far and find some text search solution. I'd rather use my marker notes and text searching to drill down to a finer detail level than my keywords. Perhaps it's best to just bite the bullet until Apple addresses this obvious need for long form professionals, stick with my keywords but how? Hmmmm....

At this point I'm actually wondering if printing out a keyword list might be a middle ground. Then perusing the list, deciding which keyword combos I desire, then going in and ticking them off in the filter search window. Of course I've sent a request to Apple, seems like a rudimentary need surprised it has yet to be addressed ;)

As always appreciate any thoughts or ideas and thankful for the forum.

MA

"A life without cause is a life without effect." -Dildano


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Dealing with size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections?
on Jul 31, 2014 at 8:33:53 am

[Michael Angelo] "Is there anyway to deal with the size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections if you have lots of keywords?"

Unfortunately, no. I feel your pain.

[Michael Angelo] "I'd rather use my marker notes and text searching to drill down to a finer detail level than my keywords."

The simple text search filter at the top of the event isn't doing it for you? Then again, I use FAVORITES for "indexing" clips, not markers. Because with markers, if I'm searching for a certain word that I indexed, FCP will only filter out the entire clip(s) with the marker and I still have to scroll through to find what I'm looking for. On clips with 30+ markers that's no real help. With favorites on the other hand I'm only given the marked section that fits the search!


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Michael Angelo
Re: Dealing with size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections?
on Jul 31, 2014 at 7:00:42 pm

Hi Robin,

Previously I started using your method of naming favorites but discovered the favorite names DO NOT show up in the timeline index ;( It's important to me in long form to watch the timeline index and see clip descriptions given the amount of material, as always I've sent a feature request to Apple. Apparently the checks in the mail for everyone's de-bugging efforts ;)

Currently I'm exploring using markers as a drill down to detail note beyond the keywords, then favoriting the best bits. That way if I do a text search for the marker details and filter using favorites, only the best stuff will be selected, at least that's an idea. Others have pointed out that text searches for markers pulls the entire clip, the favorite filter helps this challenge. Obviously using keywords would be ideal for cross referencing and whittling down material but until the Smart Collection tiny filter search window issue is fixed, having too many keywords makes the most powerful feature of the software unusable. For now using markers also allows me to see my marker notes in timeline index, this is crucial. I'm sure they will fix the Smart Collection issue once I'm 4 months into my edit LOL!

The only thing that I don't like with the marker method is I like to place markers just before the bite starts (say 10 frame handles), that way I can click on the marker in the event window, hit play and voila I can easily review the material marker by marker. The problem with this is that my eventual edit point is going lose this little bit of handle so I will lose the marker info in the timeline index once the material is in the timeline. I'm now placing the marker a moment after the bite starts which cuts off the head a little when reviewing material before editing but it's the only way I can make that valuable logging info show up in timeline index until apple adds favorites to the index. Once again it seems like an eventual fix as EVERY OTHER type of tagging is included in timeline index and yes I've sent a feature request to Apple.

In a perfect world the favorite name would also be included as a text overlay option on the clip icons while in the project timeline, that and more. Sadly this is the only data that you can display as it stands now:

Angles
Roles
Clip Names

Many NLE's allow the display of a variety of data on a clip in the timeline. Sure it gets truncated when small but when you zoom in this can be very helpful during play down. At a glance you can learn so much about a clip and there is no need to match to the source to explore. Sent a request to Apple, here are some examples of things that we should have the option to display on clips in the timeline AND in the event viewer for that matter:

marker notes
to dos
chapters
timecode
favorite name
clip resolution

Meanwhile until FCPX catches up it's time to find work arounds. As always appreciate the response and any other ideas from the forum. Where FCPX falls short of standard features in the professional market it's on the forefront of relational database editing, the future, and for that I am thankful. I hope this thread is stirring ideas and helping others like so many other threads have helped me ;)

MA

"A life without cause is a life without effect." -Dildano


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Dealing with size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections?
on Aug 1, 2014 at 4:24:21 pm

[Michael Angelo] "Previously I started using your method of naming favorites but discovered the favorite names DO NOT show up in the timeline index"

Ah, okay. Didn't realize that that was relevant. It never was for me, so it never occurred to. Good point.

[Michael Angelo] "having too many keywords makes the most powerful feature of the software unusable."

Yes, I've been annoyed by that, too, a few times. Forgot to report it, so I'll have to do that now. If you haven't already, something you'll definitely want to do also.

[Michael Angelo] "The problem with this is that my eventual edit point is going lose this little bit of handle so I will lose the marker info in the timeline index once the material is in the timeline."

Another good point. So you mean if and when you tighten the edit point in the timeline by those 10 frames? But then simply selecting the edit point and hitting ⇧ and , or . would give and take those 10 frames quickly as needed. Not super elegant, but possible.

[Michael Angelo] "Once again it seems like an eventual fix as EVERY OTHER type of tagging is included in timeline index and yes I've sent a feature request to Apple."

I get what you mean, but I think the problem with that (and possibly Apple's logic for NOT including it?) is, that the vast majority of people won't be renaming the "Favorite" tag and therefore they are completely indistinguishable from each other in a list, therefore not exactly useful. But I'll send a equal request for the few of us that DO rename them, yes. ;)

[Michael Angelo] "here are some examples of things that we should have the option to display on clips in the timeline AND in the event viewer for that matter:"

Never ever. Not things I would want to constantly have floating around. Would make for massive clutter. Something I think X has masterfully managed to circumvent in the new GUI. Most definitely one of its biggest strengths, not weaknesses IMHO. Aside from being able to find all of the above elsewhere. Be it in the Inspector and/or Timeline Index... when needed. But having the same overlays that (ironically) multicam clips have in the cameras window at least optionally in the Viewer is a long standing request of mine, yes. But again, seeing other NLEs such as PPro or Avid (or even FCP 7!) make me thank the NLE gods for not having such a visual clusterf*** in FCP. Their fugly GUIs make me shiver.


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Michael Angelo
Re: Dealing with size limit of the filter search window when creating Smart Collections?
on Aug 1, 2014 at 7:02:06 pm

Hi Robin,

FAVORITES
Funny thing about naming favorites in event manager, FCPX wasn't originally designed to do this, it was an added feature in one of their revisions which explains why it hasn't made it into the timeline index. It's true if you didn't name them they would clutter up the timeline index with the repeated word "Favorite", good point. Having a check box option to include them or not would be the way to go to address multiple work flows, specifically your workflow where you rename favorites.

METADATA OVERLAYS
I agree with you that having tons of text over the clip in the timeline is annoying and not clean when you don't want it. Once again having a check box to choose what you want (including "none") for overlay metadata is the way to go. You could choose "none" or view a variety of metadata should you need it. One example of how a powerful metadata overlay is a marker note that describes dialogue. These notes make ALL the difference when you are looking at clips in your timeline that visually look all the same (like talking heads). The metadata becomes useful as a quick way to differentiate allowing you to reorder shots without even listening to them! The list of uses go on and on but yes having the ability to totally turn them off for that refreshing clean look should be there too ;)

Appreciate the feedback, it's great to exchange these ideas...

MA

"A life without cause is a life without effect." -Dildano


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