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Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2

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Adam Schoales
Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 9, 2014 at 12:54:43 am

Super excited about the new update to FCP X but noticed something that isn't as ideal for working off site and curious if anyone has any solutions.
With 10.1.1 storing proxy/optimized media in the Library I was working on a project with external media. I created proxies for all my media and the resulting Library file, while big, was definitely manageable and fit on my portable hard drive. I'd take this drive home so if I had work for from home, while I wouldn't have any of the original ProRes media I at least had proxies from which I could work in the meantime.
Cut to recently where I opted to have the fully externally managed library on our new project. This means I have the ProRes files on my raid, and set my "optimized and proxy" media also to be outside the library. I followed more or less the same procedure: copy just the folder of proxy material and the library file to my external drive so I could work from home.

Now cut to tonight, booting up the project file and Final Cut throwing up warnings about not having the media, and the wrong storage locations. That made sense, I only have proxy media, and the storage location is different since it's now on a laptop and not my MacPro at the office. So I set the storage locations to be the drive with the proxies and all seems fine. Still getting a media offline warning but figure, "makes sense, I'm not in proxy mode yet", flip into proxy mode and... still offline.

So I try to reconnect the media; well it reconnects to the proxies, but as "original media". In other words, now my original media is connected to proxies and I'm still being told my proxies are offline.

SO I guess what I'm wondering is how do I get back to a situation like before. The ideal situation being: I have a version of my library on a hard drive that I can work from that ONLY contains proxy media (no original media).

My thinking is I need to go trash my proxies, change the library settings so that all new media is stored in the library (since I've already imported my footage it will leave that in place), and make new proxies and now it will generate those in the library itself, and then copy the library at the end of the working day as need be. This is less ideal of course since it means a larger library file (which I was hoping to avoid), but if it WORKS (since it definitely did in the past prior to this update) great.

In a PERFECT world I'd like to be able to have proxies live at the office and at home, the high res files just on the work machines, and then simply have to copy just my library file at the end of the day (since the proxies aren't going to change) knowing that I can pull that up at home, reference my proxies and away we go.
I hope this all makes sense... I understand I'm maybe doing a hacky work-around but I'm trying to sort out the best practices here.

All that being said; since the media IS reconnecting (albeit to low res proxies as original media) I suppose I can still work, especially since in this early stage of editing I'm just trying to screen, log, and assemble footage (the client won't be seeing anything), and once I'm back at the office I can just reconnect to the proper original ProRes media and all things will be fine and dandy. I'm just worried about any ripple effects down the line. Truthfully, I don't think any problems WOULD arise, but I'm not sure...


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 9, 2014 at 11:11:17 am

[Adam Schoales] "So I try to reconnect the media; well it reconnects to the proxies, but as "original media". In other words, now my original media is connected to proxies and I'm still being told my proxies are offline."

Uh-oh.... biiiiiig mistake. That will seriously mess things up if you try to reconnect to the REAL original media! Be sure NOT to try that with that library but rather start over.

[Adam Schoales] "In a PERFECT world I'd like to be able to have proxies live at the office and at home, the high res files just on the work machines, and then simply have to copy just my library file at the end of the day (since the proxies aren't going to change) knowing that I can pull that up at home, reference my proxies and away we go."

I think you may be "overthinking" the matter. First off: do you need optimized or do you (at this stage) just plan to use the original media and proxies? Because if you don't need optimized media, you simply need to set up your library to REFERENCE (leave in place) the original, external media and set your proxy media to the library that you store locally on your machine. With that things should work exactly as you expect. I.e. that's how I have done it in the past and still do for the exact same reasons. That way if you're connected to the original media you can edit with that, if not (you're out and about) it will go offline and you can switch to proxy to continue. There's absolutely no copying, reconnecting or the likes needed or necessary, since the directories never actually change. Only one goes missing temporarily. But even if you DO initially save the library externally and copy it back and forth as needed, there should be no such problems for the same reason. And the library should only always contain the proxy files and nothing else.

Just be aware that certain files such as stills and some audio do not have extra proxy files, but rather are considered fine as they are and therefore reference the original media in both modes. So you'll want to test your proxy mode BEFORE you take off (disconnect the external media and switch to proxy), to make sure all your files actually have media behind them. Kind of an unfortunate implementation imho and quite the gotcha if you don't know about it. In that case you'll have to carry copies of the affected files along with you and reconnect as needed.


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 9, 2014 at 8:57:20 pm
Last Edited By Adam Schoales on Jul 9, 2014 at 9:11:11 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "I think you may be "overthinking" the matter. First off: do you need optimized or do you (at this stage) just plan to use the original media and proxies? Because if you don't need optimized media, you simply need to set up your library to REFERENCE (leave in place) the original, external media and set your proxy media to the library that you store locally on your machine. With that things should work exactly as you expect. I.e. that's how I have done it in the past and still do for the exact same reasons. That way if you're connected to the original media you can edit with that, if not (you're out and about) it will go offline and you can switch to proxy to continue. There's absolutely no copying, reconnecting or the likes needed or necessary, since the directories never actually change. Only one goes missing temporarily. But even if you DO initially save the library externally and copy it back and forth as needed, there should be no such problems for the same reason. And the library should only always contain the proxy files and nothing else."

To clarify, I may have been confusing terminologies here. Original media is ProRes so there is no optimised media, but I was using the two terms interchangeably.

So; there's original prores media that's over 1.5 terabytes and stays at the office, and there's the proxy media which is at the office and on a portable drive for working at home. My hopes were the proxy could live on the portable drive, outside the library, so I'm just copying new library files over (and have the added benefit of being able to easily backup library files to Dropbox). With having Proxy files living INSIDE the library it was way too big to easily backup.

Based on your thoughts, this is exactly how I worked before. The downside was that making any changes facilitated copying the whole library file over which has ~130 gb of proxies (while it's true I could simply copy project files from one library to the other, in the early logging stage there's no real way to do that), so my THOUGHT was having the proxies live outside the library meant that I'd just be copying a tiny library file back and forth. Obviously that's not (yet) the case (or I'm doing something wrong).

At any rate, I'll switch to my old setup (proxies in the library) and go from there.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 10, 2014 at 1:05:29 pm
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jul 10, 2014 at 1:07:18 pm

[Adam Schoales] "My hopes were the proxy could live on the portable drive, outside the library, so I'm just copying new library files over (and have the added benefit of being able to easily backup library files to Dropbox). With having Proxy files living INSIDE the library it was way too big to easily backup."

You're only making things unnecessarily complicated for yourself IMHO. Use the library filled with proxies locally and simply attach and detach the original media as needed. No copying or moving around needed. And if you're worried about backups, that's what the built-in backup function is for. That doesn't backup MEDIA, just the library (database) files. So it's irrelevant whether you have any media in it or not. I have mine set to my Copy folder (https://copy.com?r=D4Fz3M if you want additional 20GB for starters that work exactly as DropBox does).

And if you're not using the built-in backups, then you're also depriving yourself of some great functionality as far as restoring is concerned.


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 17, 2014 at 9:08:38 pm

Just finished a week of working this way - with the original media outside the library, proxy media in the library, and copying the library to an external drive to work from home.

It's not super painful, since I just have to open up both my local/external libraries and copy the updaded project files back and forth, but does seem to be a bit odd.

I'd still love for a way in which the library files simply acts like a projects did in FCP 7 and I could easily copy that, or even email it (since it'd be so small), open it up on another computer, and it recognize "hey, the original media isn't here, but all the proxy media is, so we can work".

It just seems odd to me that you can store the proxy media externally but not reference it if it's copied/moved to another location. But maybe I'm just misunderstanding the feature.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 18, 2014 at 10:18:08 am

Well, you could technically just copy the "Current Version" file to and from the library. But I don't understand why you're even copying anything. If you have it locally, then you simply need to connect the volume with the original footage and switch. Done. No copying needed.

And no, there is no separate relinking of proxies. If you choose Relink, FCP automatically assumes you're wanting to relink the original/optimized. Which is why it's detrimental to do that and point to the proxies. After that your proxies are considered the original/optimized and any existing files of sorts are deleted.

Maybe put in an enhancement request.


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 18, 2014 at 1:29:05 pm

Yeah I get the impression that FCP X simply isn't designed for the workflow I'm hoping for. Hopefully that'll change in the future.

As to why I'm copying things, maybe I'm not making myself clear enough but let me just break down the scenario a little more clearly.


Create Library on work MacPro. 1.5 TB Media stored locally on internal RAID. Referenced by library.
Create proxy material (100+ GB) which is stored *inside* the library (since we can't reference external proxy media at this point, at least not in the way I want to).
Copy library to USB 3 drive so that we can edit from home on laptop if need arrises.

So now we have two libraries that need to be kept in sync. There are two methods to do so. The first involves simply copying the library back and forth overwriting the previous library. This is slower (since you have to transfer 100 GB of data) but sort of ensures that so long as you copy the most recent library you will not lose anything along the way.

The other way is opening both libraries on a machine and copying project files between said libraries (or doing XML outputs). Fairly easy to copy projects from portable library onto MacPro library, a little more difficult to do the other way around.

Again, in a *perfect world* I'd love a workflow where the library file is tiny, I have a folder of Original Media and Proxy media. I copy that proxy media to my portable drive, along with the most recent library file. When at home simply pull up the most recent library file, ignore warnings that there's no original material, relink to the proxy material and get back to cutting. Once I'm back at the office, take that library file, reconnect to the original media and get back to cutting. Much more similar to the FCP 7 workflow wherein my library file is essentially the equivalent of a .FCP project file in FCP 7. As I mentioned it's clear this is not how FCP X is designed to work, but perhaps in the future will be to allow for this kind of workflow (since I imagine I cant be the only one who has to sometimes work on the road and doesn't want to lug around a terabyte and a half of media).


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mark verkerk
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 20, 2014 at 2:03:39 pm

Adam, have the same problem as you - wanting to keep a work and home copy of the project in sync, and only having proxies available at home. Not being able to relink proxies is shame.

My workaround has been to name my external disk that I use at home the same as the one at work and make sure that the proxies sit in the same folder structure as on the Raid at work. You're actually then fooling the project into thinking it's still connected to its original proxy folder and all's well.

Not ideal but it works. Hope this helps.

Mark


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 21, 2014 at 1:23:15 pm

Thanks for that tip Mark. You're right, it's not a perfect solution, but it's not a terrible one either. One to keep in my pocket.

It does seem like Apple is *sort of* listening to our requests for making FCP X better and more robust so hopefully if enough people ask for a better "offsite" workflow we they'll listen.

(that and the ability to colour code clips/roles)


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 21, 2014 at 4:16:30 pm

Sorry, not trying to be thick, but I just don't get it. The whole thing makes little sense to me. There's either a kink in my train of thought or yours. Because if you're taking the proxies with you, why should you care if they are in the library, in an extra folder or wherever? If you copy the library e.g. from a server which contains the proxies, then you have the exact same files for/on each. The only thing that could possibly change would be render files, data files or cache files, all of which are irrelevant since they'd simply be regenerated as needed. Aside from that, just the "CurrentVersion.fcpevent" files which are tiny and, as I've said before, can be copied as and if needed. Elegant? No, but easily done.

What am I missing?

I don't doubt that at some point the (separate) relinking of proxies is bound to happen, but then that is a very unique workflow imho, so much that I doubt is very high up on the list. IF it's on the list. I can't think of any NLE that would allow that exact workflow either, unless something has happened with updates recently that I missed.


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 23, 2014 at 3:44:00 pm

Again, it's entirely possible I'm not making myself clear enough in my explanations so I do apologize for that (though it sounds like other people get where I'm going with this), so let me try again to clarify for you.

The original media, which is very large, lives on my internal raid at the office. The library references that media. Proxies were then generated for that media so that I could take it on the go with me on a portable harddrive and edit on the road, from home, etc. The latest update of FCP meant you could store those proxy files OUTSIDE the library, meaning the library file stayed small (like a FCP 7 project file), and all my media lived in folders externally.

THE PROBLEM is that when you open up that library on a new machine, your media goes offline.

Again, let's break it down: at the office I have a folder called PROJECT X. This is where I told Final Cut Pro i'd like to store my media. So now we have two folders, ORIGINAL MEDIA which FCP references, and the generated PROXY MEDIA folder, created by FCP with all the proxy media.

Now I want to work from home but don't need the original media and just want proxies so I can edit off my smaller portable drive. I copy over the library folder, and the PROXY MEDIA folder, so what I essentially have is a duplicate of my PROJECT X folder, just without the ORIGINAL MEDIA.

I get home, boot up the library, and FCP throws up the warning about the storage locations missing. So I point it to the new PROJECT X folder on the external drive. AT THIS POINT one would assume that final cut should go "okay, original media is missing, but I see the proxy media folder, so let's reconnect those proxies to there". I go over to the light-switch, flip over to proxy media and... nothing. It says that the proxy media is missing. This is where the problem lies; the proxy media exists but final cut doesn't seem to see it.

Now, the other option is you can tell it to reconnect your media, but this will only reconnect what it considers to be the "original/optimized" media. While this is theoretically fine, and when I copy the library back over to my internal RAID it should theoretically allow me to just reconnect back to the original media (sort of what we would have done in FCP 7 - as long as files are all named the same you can simply point to various folders) that's not a risk I'm willing to take at this point since I don't fully understand how FCP X is handling this sort of stuff.

As a result, I'm forced to return to a workflow from prior to the latest update in which the original media is stored outside the library and referenced, while the proxy media is generated and kept INSIDE the library file. Now that library file is not a tiny file, but rather ~100 GB. So say I've been working remotely and want to now update my local RAID version I either have to copy the whole ~100 GB file (slow), open both libraries and copy projects from project to project (not too difficult unless I'm using a thunderbolt drive as my portable, since my MacPro at the office has no thunderbolt connection), or export XML of the projects and import that into the local library (so far the easiest solution). I can also, as you mentioned, copy the "currentversion" files over, which I've done in the past but have been avoiding that since, again, I'm concerned about messing with stuff inside the library too much.

So again, while what you're saying is true, there's these little caveats along the way (like file transfer times etc.)

So, ultimately what I'd love to see is a way in which I can open up a library offsite, point to my new folder, have FCP recognize that the original/optimized media is gone, but the proxy media is there and allow me to reconnect those proxies AS PROXIES and get back to work (otherwise storying the proxies externally has a lot less value). So far the only way to do this is to allow FCP to manage the proxies INSIDE the library.

Make anymore sense? Again, you're right there are work arounds, none of which are particularly elegant, and it seems like there should be an easy enough solution here to get this workflow up and running.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 23, 2014 at 4:49:49 pm

[Adam Schoales] "it sounds like other people get where I'm going with this"

Not sure where the plural is coming from. ;-D

[Adam Schoales] "The latest update of FCP meant you could store those proxy files OUTSIDE the library"

See, that's where you're losing me i.e. the confusion and problems begin, because you do not have to save the proxies externally. As I've been saying all along, you simply store them WITHIN the library, copy THAT (if even needed) back and forth, done. And if that is too much, just copy the Currentversion file each time. Done. But unless you need to be editing the exact same project on multiple machines, I don't even see why you would want or need to.

[Adam Schoales] "(like a FCP 7 project file)"

Not exactly a fair comparison, since in 7 you'd more than likely be working with nothing other than the originally ingested media that could also sit anywhere. Just as you can with the current version of X, only it's called a "library", in which case, as described, it would also be very small. No difference. X has in effect caught up with 7 in that exact respect. Your problem is with the proxy files, which I personally never once used in 10 years of 7, did you? Using 7's proxy feature was a huge PITA and essentially useless IMHO.

[Adam Schoales] "THE PROBLEM is that when you open up that library on a new machine, your media goes offline."

Yes, of course. Any media you don't in fact have goes offline. If it's the original or optimized media, then you can simply reconnect. If you want to work with the proxy media (which you can't explicitly reconnect on its own, no) you simply save that to the library, after which there is no relinking needed. It is recognized automatically wherever you take it.

[Adam Schoales] "I copy over the library folder, and the PROXY MEDIA folder"

Exactly. And all I've been trying to tell you the whole time is that THAT is your error in logic or maybe just misconception. There is no need to store the proxies externally i.e. if you don't, but rather IN THE LIBRARY, then your problem is solved as described above.

[Adam Schoales] "AT THIS POINT one would assume that final cut should go "okay, original media is missing, but I see the proxy media folder, so let's reconnect those proxies to there"."

And it doesn't work that way. As I've said before. X looks into THE LIBRARY first and foremost for any and all media. If it finds original media (or their aliases that lead to it) it uses that. If it finds optimized media (or aliases), it uses THAT, even if there is no original media. If it finds PROXY media (or, again, resolvable aliases), it will use THAT (if you switch). The only difference between the three is, that you can ONLY reconnect the original and/or the optimized. Both with the reconnect media command. Proxy has no such command. If the actual proxies are not IN THE LIBRARY and it cannot resolve the aliases, game over. The only real problem you in fact have (or may be just creating for yourself?) is that there is no extra "reconnect" command for proxies. Good? Bad? I don't know. From the way I understand the logic and use it myself it isn't necessary either. Again, for me. Even though I do exactly what it is you're doing all the time. If that is something you feel is essential for your preferred workflow (i.e. the way it can/does work isn't suitable) then you need to send feedback accordingly.

Mind you, I say that sincerely. I'm not trying to be combative. I'm merely trying to tell you how it can work and how it works superbly... for me in the same situation. And from what I gather, you're not in a multi-machine situation either. In which case, now that I've thought about it, that could prove to be very helpful, yes, to avoid constant copying.

Bottom line: you simply need to store the proxies in the library and work from there wherever you are. That way you can easily switch to the original media when and if needed in the office and to the proxies no matter where you are. Bingo. Things work exactly as you'd like. Or rather, in this case and at the stage you are at, you simply modify the library settings to store the proxies in the library and CONSOLIDATE.

[Adam Schoales] "As a result, I'm forced to return to a workflow from prior to the latest update in which the original media is stored outside the library and referenced, while the proxy media is generated and kept INSIDE the library file. Now that library file is not a tiny file, but rather ~100 GB."

Not true. You couldn't have done it any other way with previous versions either. If anything, then only much more constrained (with X <10.1) than it is. It's data you're having to copy (really only once) either way. I don't see how it's relevant whether that media comes in a (separate) regular folder or along with the library that you're copying. And since these, from what you're saying, already exist in both locations, why would you want or need to recopy them every time? Simply work from the one copy no matter where you are, as described above, and you're good, no?


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 24, 2014 at 3:20:11 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "See, that's where you're losing me i.e. the confusion and problems begin, because you do not have to save the proxies externally. As I've been saying all along, you simply store them WITHIN the library, copy THAT (if even needed) back and forth, done. And if that is too much, just copy the Currentversion file each time. Done. But unless you need to be editing the exact same project on multiple machines, I don't even see why you would want or need to."

Well again, as I've been saying before copying the whole library takes more time than I have somedays. Yes, I realize I can copy the current version file but I do worry that I'm somehow causing corruption down the line (the last project I did this on has all sorts of weird bugs in it, and I worry that it's related to doing this. Not saying it *is* but it's why I'm trying to avoid this behaviour on this current project. But you're right, this should solve the problem.

[Robin S. Kurz] "Exactly. And all I've been trying to tell you the whole time is that THAT is your error in logic or maybe just misconception. There is no need to store the proxies externally i.e. if you don't, but rather IN THE LIBRARY, then your problem is solved as described above."

Let's be clear; I understand why it's happening, I simply don't understand the reasoning. Put another way; why give me the OPTION to store proxies externally if I can't point final cut to them at another time should they move/explicitly reconnect them. I don't think my logic is unsound in assuming that because I can store them externally, and I can also directly point FCP X to where media lives that it should recognize when that location changes. I understand that this is not the case, but I'm curious as to why. That's something only the engineers at Apple can explain.

[Robin S. Kurz] "The only real problem you in fact have (or may be just creating for yourself?) is that there is no extra "reconnect" command for proxies. Good? Bad? I don't know. From the way I understand the logic and use it myself it isn't necessary either. Again, for me. Even though I do exactly what it is you're doing all the time. If that is something you feel is essential for your preferred workflow (i.e. the way it can/does work isn't suitable) then you need to send feedback accordingly."

I'd argue bad. But, you're right, there's a solution which is simply storing the proxies in the Library.

[Robin S. Kurz] "Mind you, I say that sincerely. I'm not trying to be combative. I'm merely trying to tell you how it can work and how it works superbly... for me in the same situation. And from what I gather, you're not in a multi-machine situation either. In which case, now that I've thought about it, that could prove to be very helpful, yes, to avoid constant copying."

I don't take you as combative, so fear not. I appreciate you working through this with me. It's also complicated to do this kind of discussion via messes and not in person.


[Robin S. Kurz] "Bottom line: you simply need to store the proxies in the library and work from there wherever you are. That way you can easily switch to the original media when and if needed in the office and to the proxies no matter where you are. Bingo. Things work exactly as you'd like. Or rather, in this case and at the stage you are at, you simply modify the library settings to store the proxies in the library and CONSOLIDATE."

This is what I will continue to do. If you haven't been experiencing problems updating the "current version" files then I'm less concerned about doing it (though I'm always curious WHICH to update... there's always more than one).

Like I said, at this point I have an understanding of how it works and simply pining for my perfect solution which is a solution in which you're library file is nothing more than metadata that you can easily copy back and forth or email or what have you. Then ADDING the option for relinking proxy media (or, put another way, if you tell final cut pro "this is the folder where my media now is" it scans it for both original media and proxy media" and if it finds either or reconnects it).

[Robin S. Kurz] "Not true. You couldn't have done it any other way with previous versions either. If anything, then only much more constrained (with X <10.1) than it is.

This will descend into more sidebars but let's go for it anyways.

In previous versions I had my project file. At the office it was connected to a folder called "media pro-res". At the end of the day I'd copy it dropbox. Next day I'm not feeling well and decide to work from home. I grab that tiny project file and open it on my Laptop. Media is missing, so I point it to my folder of proxies I generated (using compressor since this is FCP 7) and start working. Once I'm back at the office I open up that file and reconnect to the original media.

That was my former proxy workflow, and is ostensibly what I want to go back to. FCP X changed things slightly by adding the little switch to flip between original media and proxies, where as final cut 7 (to my knowledge) didn't have that and just let you reconnect to whatever. And I supposed theoretically FCP X could do the same, I could reconnect to the media in that proxy folder, and then get back to the office and reconnect to the original media but people were saying don't do that.

There's all sorts of other wrinkles down the line here about why I can't just work the way I'd want to; for example the portable drive I'm using is thunderbolt since my laptop supports that but the mac pro I work on at the office doesn't, meaning I can't just work from ONE library file. We have a thunderbolt mac at the office which I can plug the drive into but it acts as a "server", and sadly you cannot mount the drive on the network and work from that library file, which means I then need to copy it over. Which is, again, why it'd be great if it was a small file that contained nothing but metadata. I realize these are a great deal of what-ifs and caveats, but again, it seems like there is a solution here it just hasn't been incorporated into the software.

Once again, I thank you for talking me through this, and apologies for all the confusion along the way. At this point I'll heed your advice and stick to just copying the current versions and away we go. It's *clear* that FCP X is not yet designed to do things the way I want to do it, but I am hopeful that in the future it is.


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Adam Schoales
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 24, 2014 at 3:31:40 pm

One final note, from the apple support document:

"Final Cut Pro uses your new storage locations for future source media file imports, cache files, and backups.

Important: Existing source media and backup files remain in their original locations. If you changed the cache storage location, Final Cut Pro offers to move your existing active render files and other cache files (such as thumbnail images and audio waveform files) to the new location."


This is where all of my confusion lay. I assumed that when you set that new location Final Cut would then re-scan the new location to check to see if any media is already there. It does not, it simply sets it as the new location for everything that is to come after.

Were it to behave like I expected it to (something I don't think is an unreasonable assumption, nor do any of my co-workers haha), checking to see if any media is in the folder the user has now set, all my problems and questions would go away. Fingers crossed that it will in the future.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Jul 26, 2014 at 3:52:16 pm

[Adam Schoales] "I assumed that when you set that new location Final Cut would then re-scan the new location to check to see if any media is already there."

No, as I said before, FCP scans nothing but the library and goes by what is in there. Be it original media or aliases that lead to specific (original) media. If anything, you're simply defining a new location for media that is being referenced by aliases that exist in the library, yes.

[Adam Schoales] "It does not, it simply sets it as the new location for everything that is to come after."

Exactly. That's media management. And it's a good thing that it's that way. That makes it impossible for FCP to change anything outside of the library. If it did or could, that would be detrimental. It's a (brilliant) feature, not a bug.

[Adam Schoales] "checking to see if any media is in the folder the user has now set"

X is extremely strict about metadata, which again is a feature. That makes the media management rock solid if you don't mess things up yourself, even if that means having to give up a certain amount of flexibility. Which includes relinking things willy-nilly. Whether they're the correct files or not.

Bottom line, I'd say the only thing anyone is in fact missing here is the option to specifically relink proxy files and not just the original/optimized. Which I'm not actually sure makes a lot of sense, assuming you're "playing by the (simple) rules". So it's not problem with the media management per se imho, just a missing feature for an exception to those rules. But if it's something essential for your everyday workflow, you'd need to hit the feedback page.


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Tim Dutton
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Sep 19, 2014 at 10:51:52 pm

No Adam, You are not unclear. I think the one point that Robin didn't get is that the proxy files don't stay connected when any part of the file path changes name - so when you have BIGDRIVE/MyProjectFolder/Media/Final Cut Proxy Media/ at your office with the RAID, Final cut is happy and sees the proxy files, but when you copy your project and external proxy files to the portable drive, final cut automatically no longer sees them. Only the drive name has changed, for example, to PORTABLEDRIVE/MyProjectFolder/Media/Final Cut Proxy Media/ and that alone causes final cut to lose it's connection to the proxy media. That is what Robin is missing. It seems that Robin was assuming that the connection remained intact, so I can understand the confusion in that case.

I have nearly the SAME issue! In my case, my project is almost the same size as yours, and I have 4-5 editors working on the project. We cannot be on the same physical network, so each editor has a drive with a copy of the original media, library and proxy media. Like you say, the Library file this way is ~20MB - very manageable compared to ~100GB per Library with the proxy media stored inside which is much much much less convenient to manage making quick copies back and forth.

I really like the suggestion to name the portable drive the same as the main drive. I think I will try that work around for now.

You know, I have this issue with Logic Pro as well. Any time I back up or move a Logic file, I have to reconnect media. It’s not too uncommon to see two different audio files with the same name connected to the same project. That causes headaches. I wish these editing files would have a relative file path setting which would allow you to designate a main project folder below which ALL the files would ALWAYS remain the same RELATIVE to each other allowing complete portability.

Cheers


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Sep 22, 2014 at 10:08:53 am

[Tim Dutton] " I think the one point that Robin didn't get is that the proxy files don't stay connected when any part of the file path changes name"

Probably because I can't concur. Simply copying the library works just fine here. Especially if you copy it from within FCP, which you should anyway, there's no reason why it shouldn't.


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mark verkerk
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Oct 22, 2014 at 11:23:21 am

I guess the issue here is how complex is the project - how much media do you have and is that media still growing and how many editors are working on that same media.

With a (relatively) small project, with all the media available, then your method of keeping all the proxies in the Library works fine. With a larger project, shared between more than one editor, and in which additional footage is coming in on a weekly basis, then the option to store proxies externally is very welcome.

You end up both with a small 'trimmed' Library which is easy to share with other editors and assistants over a network (copying hundreds of GBs is not an option) and an external proxy folder which can grow as more footage is imported into the master Library.

Up until 10.1.2 this worked by using a remote disk with the same name as the main storage disk and then updating the proxies on the remote disk as they came in. The updated remote Library would then be 'fooled' into thinking nothing had changed and relink correctly with the proxies. For some reason this no longer appears to work in 10.1.3. (anyone else noticed this???)

Proxy workflow has been greatly improved in recent updates, now all that's needed is a way to directly relink proxies in the same way as original media - and a whole new range of extended workflows would be supported.


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Ryan Harman
Re: Working offsite with just proxies in FCP 10.1.2
on Oct 1, 2014 at 3:55:13 am

I’m having the same problem. Though I’m not working with as much media. This tutorial explained how to manage my library and generate proxies on my laptops hard drive while keeping original and optimized files on an external drive.

http://provideocoalition.com/mspencer/video/moving-proxy-media-in-final-cut...


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