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Julian Bowman
Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 9:16:09 am

hey all, not really looked into the dual windows till now and it appears from a quick google search that the dual windows of 10.0.6 offer a timeline and event window.

But when I am grading clips that are on my timeline and I want to try and colour match, I would like to have one clip (the currently correctly graded clip) in one window and the second clip (that i am grading) in the other window so when I make changes i can see how close it is to the original.

Is this possible?

At the moment though I can open the already graded clip in the event window, it excludes my grading (I'm guessing because it reverts to the source file which isn't graded as the grading occurred in the timeline).

the only way I can figure out how to do it is every time i tweak i have to go back to the timline and move forwards and back a frame to flick between the two graded clips.

Cheers


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Oliver Peters
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 3:17:16 pm

[Julian Bowman] "Is this possible?"

No. The dual source/timeline viewers are the same as the unified viewer. The difference is that they stay separate with our toggling between event clip and timeline in the same window.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Julian Bowman
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 3:28:10 pm

Ok, cheers Oliver. thought that may be the case. Seems a shame as it would help with grading if i could have the two side by side clips in two windows :)



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Bret Williams
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 8:10:06 pm

The real difference, semantics possibly, is that you can't open a timeline clip in the source window. That's why it's called an event viewer. When you shift+F to reveal the clip in the event window, you're doing a match frame to the original clip.

Compound your clip and then do a match frame. There you go. That works because the compound clip is placed in the event. You can always break apart the compound with a keystroke when you're done.

You could apply the same color correction to the clip in the event by right clicking on it at "open(ing) clip in timeline," which is akin to "stepping in" to a clip in Avid. Then apply the color correction to the video there. But I don't recommend it, since what's changed and what's original become a nightmare to keep up with.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 9:16:35 pm

Eh, crap. Bret beat me to it!

Sorry.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 9:37:07 pm

Except that's all pretty useless for color correction. You are often trying to match a shot you are grading to an earlier reference shot that you also graded. Since there is no tryptic view and no way to set up a reference frame with a grade in the event viewer, it doesn't work very well. Very hard to grade in context.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 9:15:12 pm

[Julian Bowman] "Ok, cheers Oliver. thought that may be the case. Seems a shame as it would help with grading if i could have the two side by side clips in two windows :)"

-Open the Event Browser (shift command-3)

-Select the clip in the timeline

-Shift-f

-Grade Side by side.

It looks like this:



FCP 10.1 has an assignable toggle color correction keyboard shortcut as well.


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Doug Metz
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 10:43:38 pm

Except that Julian wants to see a graded clip (from the timeline) on the left, and grade a second, different clip from the timeline on the right.

At least, that's how I read it...

Cheers!
Doug

Doug Metz

Anode


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 11:24:22 pm

[Doug Metz] "Except that Julian wants to see a graded clip (from the timeline) on the left, and grade a second, different clip from the timeline on the right.

At least, that's how I read it..."


You're right, and I totally read it all wrong, apologies.

It's going to have to be a compound then, as Bret suggests.

I don't have the footage with me, or I'd show a screen grab!

:)


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Oliver Peters
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 11:26:38 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "It's going to have to be a compound then, as Bret suggests."

Sorry, but that can't work in any practical sense when you are actually grading.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 18, 2014 at 11:42:41 pm

[Oliver Peters] "Sorry, but that can't work in any practical sense when you are actually grading."

Then use a dedicated color grading system that can handle this view? Speedgrade does this beautifully, but video out is more difficult, so the definition of useless is relative.



Make a compound of a graded clip in the timeline, match frame it to the Event Viewer. View next clip in timeline, grade.

It's an unconventional way of working, but it's far from useless and it does work.

Jeremy


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Oliver Peters
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 19, 2014 at 1:10:00 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "Make a compound of a graded clip in the timeline, match frame it to the Event Viewer. View next clip in timeline, grade.
It's an unconventional way of working, but it's far from useless and it does work."


My point is that when you are grading, you are never just working to match a single shot, but rather multiple shots within the timeline. Are you going to compound each and every one? Gee - now that's a really viable solution!

And yes, Speedgrade - and also Media Composer/Symphony - handle this very well.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 19, 2014 at 1:29:16 am

I'm just saying, there's a way to do it.

Yes, compound each one. It's unconventional.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 19, 2014 at 1:30:28 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "Yes, compound each one. It's unconventional."

I think "unconventional" is being kind ;-)

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 19, 2014 at 1:36:20 am

Hope it helps someone.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 19, 2014 at 2:15:23 am

It's a little f*cked up, but it works.


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Andreas Kiel
Re: Dual timeline windows
on Apr 19, 2014 at 9:28:27 am
Last Edited By Andreas Kiel on Apr 19, 2014 at 9:38:32 am

Why not exporting a couple of stills for reference and then import these. From there you can easily somehow use the method Jeremy suggested.
Show the the Event Viewer and compare.





-Andreas

Spherico
http://www.spherico.com/filmtools

"He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby
become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will
also gaze into thee." - Friedrich Nietzsche, Beyond Good and Evil


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