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FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync

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Joe Williams
FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 11, 2013 at 6:55:56 pm

I try not to post unless I cant find what I am looking for in a forum search, so here it goes. I just purchased FCPX, upgrading from FCP 7 after some amount of soul searching and a timely payday. Try as I might, I cannot get pluraleyes to synch clips of a 2-cam cooking app video I shot and now have to edit. I set up the storylines exactly as the SingularSoftware info page suggests. I have run them through several times, in this order of pluraleyes settings.

1. Just in chrono order
2. chrono order, level audio, try really hard
3. all of the above, and marked them on a clearly enunciated hard "R"

It fails to synch each time, creating a new synched project where the beginning of the primary storyline abuts the end of the top one. Cant figure it out.

There 10 recipes, and while I can synch by hand, I was led to believe when purchasing FCP X that pluraleyes 3 works.

I am willing to share project files through dropbox or weshare if that would help, and if someone could walking me through the process on FCPX.

I have always found this forum to be the best source for solutions to problems I cant trouble shoot on my own and I would like to thank all the contributors in advance for your help on this problem and countless others in the past.


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Charlie Austin
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 11, 2013 at 9:15:37 pm

[Joe Williams] "if someone could walking me through the process on FCPX."

I am not real well versed in this, but FCPX does a nice job of syncing stuff in the app, and it sounds like fairly basic shoot. Here's a link to an article that walks you through the process, and I'm sure others will chime in as well. :-)

http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage/fcp_x_multicam_basics_stone.html

-------------------------------------------------------------


~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 11, 2013 at 9:43:08 pm

First, have you contacted Plural Eyes about this problem? I am sure they would be eager to help.

Second, have you tried to use FCPX to sync, does it also have problems?

Third, I am sure that all of your sources have the same or similar audio?


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David Powell
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 2:53:10 am

What camera are you using? I use plural eyes 3 and find that sometimes it wont sync an NEX 7 properly and neither will FCP X. Try doing it straight through the plural eyes rather than xml route and see if it makes a difference. Are you mixing framerates?

Are you using the Audio as the primary or the clips?


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Nicholas Kleczewski
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 3:34:30 am

Try using the feature that allows you to "Import Media as Take's" This allows Plural eyes to make more decisions on where each clip should go in relation to the audio.

I've thrown every kinda complicated scenario one can think of at Plural Eyes and as long as it received everything logically, I've never had a problem so I have to believe it can handle this.

The only trouble I could see is if you had tons of takes where the exact same dialog was being delivered over and over again with little to no noticeable deviation from take to take. I.E. the actor was so on a one note performance from take to take theres no discernible difference between them. Thats the only time I've seen Plural Eyes give up.

good luck
nick

Director, Editor, Colorist
http://www.trsociety.com


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Joe Williams
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 4:05:35 am

Sorry guys I just got home from work so Ill take these one by one, addressing questions in the responses.

1. I had no clue that FCP X had integrated audio synch. Good to know. I wonder what other useful stuff they added to all the useful stuff they cut. Thank you for the walk through link, I will look for optimization strategies for this and give it a go.

2.
a) Yes, I did. They are looking into to it but their immediate response was to have me re-install P-eyes from a new download link. This had no effect and they seem to think its a problem with my FCP. Will keep you updated.

b) I have not. I will tomorrow. Updates coming.

c) Yes.

3.
a) A Cam is an AF100 on a XCS steadicam with two lav mics, one on the lapel and one planted near the actor. Mono mixdown but only using this for high and mid pop since... B cam Canon 5dmk2 static running a ME66 shotgun through a beachtek xlr adaptor.

b) I will search through the forums for using P-eyes standalone (have never done it that way) but I would greatly appreciate a link to whatever information you had in mind.

c)No. 29.97fps

d) I have the 5d footage as the primary since it is easier to edit this way, with the static shot as my base. Would it make a difference to pop the audio off and run it as the primary storyline for synching purposes?

4.
a) will try.

b) nope. It was from a script but she was not particularly good at hitting her lines.

5.
a) Like I said, I bought FCP X 2 days and didnt even fathom that this was a feature and therefor was zeroed in on forum searches for FCPX/P-eyes problems, not FCPX synch issues. Sorry for any time wasted.

b) I am still interested if anyone else has experienced this issue but I guess Red Giant support will have to help me out there.




Thank you to all responders, you guys are such a big help.

-Joe

5.
a)


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 3:56:36 am

Look, this function is built into FCP-X.

It does nearly all of what Plural Eyes does for basic sync of multi-cam material right inside the software.

If each camera has an audio track, just set the angle editor in X to do an audio sync.

If the audio tracks are truly distorted or any of the cameras didn't record sound, then you can just set a manual marker at the first dowbeat or at ANY other audio or visual cue that all three cameras recorded.

Heck, even if just TWO cameras have a sync point, do those, then you can ADD angle in the FCP-X suite and sync a third camera to a different point than the sync point you used for the first two.

X is really good at this and it's easy. Just watch a few videos on YouTube or read the downloadable manual.

No reason to make this difficult.

I managed to sync 14 cameras on a project recently - one of which started and stopped 4 times - I can't imaging your project is going to be more difficult than that.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Nicholas Kleczewski
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 3:59:45 am

For what he is doing I agree FCPX should be able to do it no problem. But there is definiately a huge difference in what Plural Eyes is capable of versus FCPX. Plural Eyes can chew through just about anything you throw at it. FCPX can get confused quick if anything is out of order or things dont fit in the at little invisible window of sync with audio.

Director, Editor, Colorist
http://www.trsociety.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 5:21:10 pm

[Nicholas Kleczewski] "But there is definiately a huge difference in what Plural Eyes is capable of versus FCPX. Plural Eyes can chew through just about anything you throw at it. FCPX can get confused quick if anything is out of order or things dont fit in the at little invisible window of sync with audio.

Director, Editor, Colorist
http://www.trsociety.com"



I'll just note that the OP's experience was exactly the opposite.

I own both. I haven't opened Plural Eyes (a fine product, btw, but largly unnecessary IF you edit in X) in nearly a year.

FWIW.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Nicholas Kleczewski
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 5:24:42 pm

I just synced a 2 year long documentary that has over 10,000 clips, shoots with 2 cams, shoots with 10. Sorry, but anyone who thinks Plural Eyes is less capable than FCPX's built in sync is only working on simple projects and hasn't experienced what taxing either looks like. Absolutely no comparison in speed or capability.

Director, Editor, Colorist
http://www.trsociety.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 5:37:37 pm

[Nicholas Kleczewski] "Sorry, but anyone who thinks Plural Eyes is less capable than FCPX's built in sync is only working on simple projects and hasn't experienced what taxing either looks like. Absolutely no comparison in speed or capability."

Nobody said one was "less capable" than the other.

Fine. Lets go with your plan. Anyone who has to sync up 10,000 clips - buy Plural Eyes. Have fun.

The rest of the planet full of video makers who simply need to so something like maybe my 14 camera DSLR-GOPro shoot and needs to get the edit done fast, accurately and well - you con't NEED anything else - so, you can spend extra for capability you don't need - or you can just use what you've already paid for and that works really, really well. (those pesky Apple software engineers being actually pretty good coders, i suspect.)

Isn't it great when two camps who have differing needs EACH have the tools they need?

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 5:46:37 pm

I was only suggesting to see if FCPX could do it as it might point to bigger problems if it can't.

There are times when Plural Eyes is needed.

Joe may or may not need it, but he is obviously having problems.

Can't we help him try and solve this?


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Nicholas Kleczewski
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 5:57:12 pm

Precisely, which is what my post did suggesting a workflow for him instead of whining any time I think my small shred of expertise in this world is called into question by someone who might have a different or even better perspective.

But hey, it wouldn't be much of a creative cow forum without em'! There'd literally be 1/10th the posts...

Director, Editor, Colorist
http://www.trsociety.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X and Pluraleyes 3 Complete Failure to Sync
on Feb 12, 2013 at 6:30:52 pm

[Nicholas Kleczewski] "Precisely, which is what my post did suggesting a workflow for him instead of whining any time I think my small shred of expertise in this world is called into question by someone who might have a different or even better perspective. "

Look, nobody is calling into question your expertise.

The facts are that the OP owns both Plural Eyes AND FCP-X.

It appeared to me that he felt that since he had a dedicated sync program - he ought to use it to solve his problem.

BUT - he got into problems and wasn't having success. That might be because of a foundatonal problem, or it might be that the tool is overly complex for the problem that he needs solving.

I think the OP was talking about 3 cameras on some type of live performance. That's not rocket science. X (and Plural Eyes) does this kind of thing every day.

Unless there's something the OP is not revealing, this is a pretty easy sync job. So there's no functional reason I can imagine where there's need to launch the dedicated program just to do something that's built right into the software he's already editing within.

Occams Razor is a useful concept.

Simple as that.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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