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In-app purchases in FCPX

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Oliver Peters
In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 24, 2017 at 4:10:18 pm

Just a "what if" question. We've kicked around various discussions of whether the ProApps team should or should not develop or add advanced features to FCPX strictly targeting the professional editing market. Do you think this could be (or should be) handled via in-app purchases and upgrades? It seems like the mechanism is there to do it and it's certainly something Schiller cracked the door to. Thoughts?

Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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James Sullivan
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 24, 2017 at 9:14:04 pm

Just to get this out of the way. Yes! I will give you $50 if I can have some proper video lanes. (cough)

My only worry would be if I was working on somebody else's system and they had installed all kinds of trinkets that make the whole NLE unstable and or sequences break when they switch system's. Once an editor gets transition happy there is no going back.

But if somebody were to figure out how to add tabs or let us really modify the look and feel of the interface(make the UI text stupid big for example) I would fork over cash. All of the stuff I want through is really stuff that Apple should add though.

And just to argue with myself, I actually like how simple Final Cut X is. I just wish that I could pancake and I would be very very happy. That and the color corrector has got to be thrown out.

What add on's where you thinking of? What would you want to buy from within the app itself? Wouldn't the Apple ID that is associated with the install complicate things for houses bigger than 5?

fight,
James



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Oliver Peters
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 24, 2017 at 9:36:47 pm

[James Sullivan] "and they had installed all kinds of trinkets that make the whole NLE unstable and or sequences break when they switch system's"

That can happen now with third-party plug-ins.

[James Sullivan] "But if somebody were to figure out how to add tabs or let us really modify the look and feel of the interface(make the UI text stupid big for example) I would fork over cash"

Just to be clear - I'm talking about Apple add-ons as in-app purchases, NOT third party products. I think it has to be by the developer to qualify as an in-app add-on anyway. Regardless, I wouldn't want other developers "hacking" into how FCPX works. I would want to leave that up to the ProApps team exclusively, precisely for safety reasons.

[James Sullivan] "What add on's where you thinking of?"

Additional tools that some might want and others wouldn't. For example, stereo 3D tools or a better color corrector or a role/track-based mixer panel with faders.

[James Sullivan] "Wouldn't the Apple ID that is associated with the install complicate things for houses bigger than 5?"

In theory, yes. But I see plenty of folks exceed 5 all the time. Just for clarity, the Apple policy is that individual users (non-commercial) may install apps on as many computers as they personally have control of (not just own). Business customers are supposed to ONLY install an app on a single machine. However, I see very few people who honor that and Apple certainly doesn't enforce it, unless it's something totally egregious. In any case, the in-app purchase system works pretty well in the iOS world.

In all honesty, I'd rather not see this happen and would prefer Apple to develop and add more features into X without any extra charges. However, many wouldn't want nor need some of these features; therefore, an in-app purchase for add-ons might be a workable middle ground. At least it becomes a way of justifying the R&D effort internally.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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James Sullivan
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 24, 2017 at 10:36:13 pm

I agree with all of your comments and thanks for clarifying what "in app add-on's" could and would be.

I keep wanting to talk "with" instead of "at" the engineer's who make the software I use to get paid so I can eat. Apple are still the only people who can design an NLE from the OS on up and I am very curious to see what the modular Macpro is going to be. (Not the unibody jam as it is too expensive for me to buy in one go) And just so we are clear of how far behind I am.

I just made the leap to Sierra last week on my cheese grater and can now have projects live on my storage thanks to Samba. I also just bought a TB of SSD for a cache and slid it right in. Years after I bought the tower off of Craig's list. Is continuing to add things to a now 7 year old computer so insane an idea? Also hugs to everyone at Nvida for making drivers that let me use a cubix with stupid cheap graphics cards to try and render real looking things in 3D.

I just thought of the add on I would pay for.

1) Let me pull selects and tag on my IPad Pro via XML and TINY proxies that X made when I injested footage and synced via USBc cable so I don't need the Internet to do it.

2) Even better, let an IPad pro be a shogun or sync to a shogun so again with the tagging and selecting while XMLing back to the full res when everything makes it onto proper storage and backed up to LTO. All while being able to lie down and with fingers instead of clicks.

3) Let me also dump a card onto said IPad Pro and have it make tiny proxies that would XML and reconnect to the same card injested on the big hardware when back at the office. Leverage the entire apple ecosystem and put Nexto out of business. (no offense)

(I want the iPad to break on the way back from shooting not the $8000 MacBook Pro with only 16gbs of ram and less buttons.)

in between gigs, feeling the heat, and composed on an iPad laying on my back,

James



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Oliver Peters
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 1:12:27 am

[James Sullivan] "1) Let me pull selects and tag on my IPad Pro via XML and TINY proxies that X made when I injested footage and synced via USBc cable so I don't need the Internet to do it.
...
3) Let me also dump a card onto said IPad Pro and have it make tiny proxies that would XML and reconnect to the same card injested on the big hardware when back at the office. Leverage the entire apple ecosystem and put Nexto out of business. (no offense)"


Working with the actual FCPX proxies outside of X is dicey. You should seriously look at Luma Touch's LumaFusion NLE. This is an iOS app available from the App Store. They are also working on a macOS companion app called LumaConnect to facilitate roundtrips for an offline/online workflow. Between these two, a lot of what you asked for will be there.

The iPad Pro can have an SD card reader accessory. This works with DSLR files only, but it let's you import the files into Photos. From there you can import the files into LumaFusion.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 3:56:08 pm

[Oliver Peters] "Additional tools that some might want and others wouldn't. For example, stereo 3D tools or a better color corrector or a role/track-based mixer panel with faders."

A Role based mixer, how much would you need to sell it for to make it worth it, and develop an application that can be bought piecemeal? If you are Apple, why not just include it in the next update since so many people have been asking for it? Something like that would be tied to the app pretty tight, and having a version of the app that has it, and a version of the app that doesn't seems like it would be cause for trouble. I think this would add a level of complexity to the app that is unnecessary. In-app 3rd party tools would make more sense, a Plugin store if you will.


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Scott Witthaus
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 12:18:27 am

[Oliver Peters] "strictly targeting the professional editing market"

What is your definition of "professional editing market"?

Scott Witthaus
Owner, 1708 Inc./Editorial
Managing Partner, Low Country Creative LLC
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Oliver Peters
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 1:32:10 am

[Scott Witthaus] "What is your definition of "professional editing market"?"

I think we've answered that context repeatedly here.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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James Sullivan
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 2:07:35 am

Thanks for the Lumafusion info and for listening to my ramblings. I looked into it already hence my pie in the sky dreams of having everything come with that honeycrisp polish we all enjoy. I can wait. I remember popping tapes in and out of decks that cost more than a car not too many years ago. I am so glad I missed linear editing everyday I get up and go to work. I feel bad for the first round of Avid owners though. That still has to hurt a little bit.

I am so close to having a camera system that will be small enough for me to use and shoot with that will all make it into one bag! It won't look as good as an Amira but who can afford to drop any of the lenses that make that puppy sing in the first place.

life is good,

James



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Oliver Peters
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 12:18:04 pm

Scott - sorry for my initial, flip answer. The truth of the matter is the definition of pro editing isn't relevant to the question. There are plenty of niche segments within FCPX users and how should those best be serviced? In-app purchases are one way of applying R&D to advanced features and getting paid for it without making everyone's version of the app more complex.

Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Scott Witthaus
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 7:36:51 pm

[Oliver Peters] "Scott - sorry for my initial, flip answer."

No worries. If that's the worst thing I hear today, it is a good day! ☺

[Oliver Peters] "In-app purchases are one way of applying R&D to advanced features and getting paid for it without making everyone's version of the app more complex."

Sure. Like Brett, I am pretty good with FCPX as it stands. I don't even need role-based mixer. I certainly don't want to see some sort of reversion to tracks. However scalability, like we saw when Symphony became and add-on option to MC, would be fine as long as it's rock solid. Personally, I would like to see Apple should focus on FCPX working with Motion like Premiere and AE do

IF you can add plug-in functionality and not sacrifice the speed and reliability of FCPX as it is, sure. But, to look at another model and as I have stated here, one of the big problems I have with the Adobe model with CC is that everyone who pays the monthly fee is paying for the development of software they might not ever use. All this while well-documented bugs are reported (many on the COW Premiere forum) in Premiere release after release. Many Premiere users state they feel they are always beta-testing for Adobe. I don't want to see that happen to X.

Scott Witthaus
Owner, 1708 Inc./Editorial
Managing Partner, Low Country Creative LLC
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Andrew Kimery
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 5:36:23 am

[Oliver Peters] " Do you think this could be (or should be) handled via in-app purchases and upgrades?"

I think Apple is going to handle it the same way they always have, Apple Tax on the hardware required to run the software. ;)


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Brett Sherman
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 1:47:10 pm

That would be a completely unprecedented method for Apple. They seem not to care about maximizing the profit from an individual sale of FCP X, but rather selling more licenses and more hardware. There is an assumption here I think is that Apple is not developing the tools for these "niche" markets because they don't see profit in it. Like it or not, I think what drives Apple is a vision for how their software functions as a whole. This does not lend itself to this sort of "add-on" structure.

To be sure, I would pay more for FCP X even as it is. Certainly for features I want. But I'm not sure that matters much. I certainly wouldn't want to trade stability for features I don't need.

On a side note, I think all plug-ins should be sold via the App market. I'm so tired of dealing with dozens of registration protocols every time I upgrade or do a clean install of the OS. It takes me almost a solid day to get a computer up and running because of this.

--------------------------
Brett Sherman
One Man Band (If it's video related I'll do it!)
I work for an institution that probably does not want to be associated with my babblings here.


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Oliver Peters
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 2:05:54 pm

[Brett Sherman] "That would be a completely unprecedented method for Apple."

I only bring it up, because Schiller has made statements that appear to open the door for it as a possibility. But I agree, that it's unlikely when it comes to their own apps.

[Brett Sherman] "On a side note, I think all plug-ins should be sold via the App market."

Apple's App Store is not a good deal for many small developers. Some of their requirements (like sandboxing) are restrictive, as well. The closest to that is to only get your plug-ins through FxFactory.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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David Mathis
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 6:41:45 pm

I think that is a great idea as long as the add ons are by Apple for the reason you gave.

Here is what I would love to see:
Video lanes
Traditional in and out points on the actual timeline not a clip
Role based mixer (as mentioned by many)
Better color correction tools (Color Finale is a good solution for now)
Movable markers (Ripple Training covered that last week in one of their videos)

I would love to see color wheels, sliders, curves, more robust tracking (like Resolve has) and vectors. A node based approach for grading would be cool but not necessary to have. I do think that a node based approach for adding visual FX would be super awesome sauce to be sure.

Other than that, I am a happy camper despite my most recent rant post. LOL At least I was sober, would hate to think what I might have typed if a martini was involved.


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Scott Witthaus
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 8:18:28 pm

[David Mathis] "Video lanes"

Just asking, but is this what we have in secondary storylines? How do you see video lanes working?

Scott Witthaus
Owner, 1708 Inc./Editorial
Managing Partner, Low Country Creative LLC
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Steve Connor
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 9:05:16 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "Just asking, but is this what we have in secondary storylines? How do you see video lanes working?

"


By Role, the same way audio does?


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Scott Witthaus
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 9:26:23 pm

[Steve Connor] "By Role, the same way audio does?"

OK. My workflow always has b-roll in secondary storylines above the primary. Self-imposed lanes. Do you want roles so you can export them easier? Want functionality are you looking for or is it because it is more like "tracks"?

Scott Witthaus
Owner, 1708 Inc./Editorial
Managing Partner, Low Country Creative LLC
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Scott Witthaus
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 25, 2017 at 11:59:38 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "Want functionality are you looking for or is it because it is more like "tracks"?
"


OK, I realize this is barely english and I apologize!

Scott Witthaus
Owner, 1708 Inc./Editorial
Managing Partner, Low Country Creative LLC
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Michael Hadley
Re: In-app purchases in FCPX
on Jul 28, 2017 at 1:22:59 pm

Great idea!

I would def pay $$ for a robust audio mixing solution, a more powerful color correction system, and possibly other add-ons I don't even know I'd like.

Would pay $150-$300 per module, no problem, given how inexpensive FCPX is.

In fact, I'm going to call Tim Cook right after I post this.


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