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Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"

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William Davis
Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Feb 28, 2017 at 7:10:46 pm

https://9to5mac.com/2017/02/28/apple-annual-shareholders-meeting/

Cook also hinted at Apple’s product pipeline by promising Apple will “do more in the pro area.” Cook called out the creative field as especially important to Apple while pushing back against the notion that Apple is too consumer focused now. “Don’t think that something we’ve done or something we’re doing that isn’t visible yet is a signal that our priorities are elsewhere.”


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William Davis
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Feb 28, 2017 at 7:21:44 pm
Last Edited By William Davis on Feb 28, 2017 at 7:23:04 pm

Oops. I see that Steve posted a similar story a few minutes before me.


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Feb 28, 2017 at 11:58:32 pm

Well, they have great products in FCPX, Motion, Logic and Compressor. Now, who could they get to integrate all them? Wes? Hmmmm....

;-)

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Tim Wilson
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 1, 2017 at 8:24:36 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "Well, they have great products in FCPX, Motion, Logic and Compressor. Now, who could they get to integrate all them? Wes? Hmmmm...."

Of course, this raises the specter of an Adobe-like sprawl of tabs and parameters, or Avid-like modes, or both. There's also the issue that there really aren't many people using more than one of them on a regular basis, surely no more than a handful of people who are using more than a couple of them on a regular basis -- and by "regular basis", I mean enough to warrant Apple undertaking a gargantuan effort that might not result in any benefits at all for 90-whatever-percent of the people who'll use it before the sun goes nova.

Or heck, maybe just a new Send To button is all it'll take. 😎

So here's my question to you all: what do you WANT Apple to do? What would it look like if Apple was doing more in the pro area?

For some folks, the question is rhetorical, if not clueless: "Apple is already doing everything they need to be doing, as you will see revealed in the fullness of time." Presumably starting at the FCPWORKS suite at NAB. 😁

For everyone else, I'd love some specifics. Features, products, hardware, software, customer communication, third-party partnerships, adoption of industry standards -- name it. The sky's the limit.


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 1, 2017 at 9:01:44 pm

[Tim Wilson] "So here's my question to you all: what do you WANT Apple to do?"

First of all, they need to round up those responsible for "designing" the UIs for FCP X 10.3 and Motion 5.3 and they need to put them to work on tasks better suited to their talents, like maybe mopping the floors.



Spot the schoolboy design errors here. You should be able to see at least five. Experts will be able to spot many more.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Walter Soyka
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 2:32:57 am

[Simon Ubsdell] "First of all, they need to round up those responsible for "designing" the UIs for FCP X 10.3 and Motion 5.3 and they need to put them to work on tasks better suited to their talents, like maybe mopping the floors."

Ouch!

Just a thread or two down, the FCPX UI is being hailed as a paragon of design, a triumph of simplicity, clarity and consistency. How much change do you want to see?

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Jeff Markgraf
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 7:06:13 am

[Walter Soyka] "a paragon of design, a triumph of simplicity, clarity and consistency. "

Sigh. Et tu, Walter? 😱

Seriously, though, not a paragon or a triumph, and certainly not without its flaws and foibles. Just so much better than Premiere.

FWIW, I agree with much of the criticism of the new look. Some really good choices, and some real head smackers. The guy in charge of key framing must have been doing some really dank drugs.


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Brett Sherman
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 3:03:50 am

[Simon Ubsdell] "Spot the schoolboy design errors here. You should be able to see at least five. Experts will be able to spot many more.
"


I have to admit I'm not seeing any. Icons seem unnecessary, but other than that?

--------------------------
Brett Sherman
One Man Band (If it's video related I'll do it!)
I work for an institution that probably does not want to be associated with my babblings here.


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 3:54:06 pm

I was only planning on giving half a point for that. but since you're always such a lovely guy I'll award you a full point.

But - and the interns working on this at Apple seem never to have been taught this - aesthetics does not come at the top of the list of considerations in UI design.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Tim Wilson
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 4:31:13 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] " was only planning on giving half a point for that. but since you're always such a lovely guy I'll award you a full point."

😎

I'd still love to hear more from your list of schoolboy design errors, Simon. Not having designed many schoolboys myself, I'm not sure where to begin looking.

As for the rest of you, surely you have SOME thoughts on what it would mean for Apple to "do more" for professionals. Here's your chance to rave, rant, and stay on topic, all at the same time! The anticipation is almost too much to bear!


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 5:07:31 pm

[Tim Wilson] "I'd still love to hear more from your list of schoolboy design errors"

Far too many to go into in any detail but let's go for an obvious one - keyframes.

Why would you deviate from convention and position the keyframe navigation buttons both off to one side of the keyframe button itself rather than on either side of it?

Why would you choose the make the nav buttons and the keyframe buttons the identical size, shape and colour?

Why would you make the colour hard to read?

Why would you not follow convention and have the keyframe button change colour on a keyframe to highlight its state?

These are all terrible decisions with absolutely no decent rationale whatsoever. Novelty for novelty's sake, aesthetics over function, and deeply misguided and amateurish aesthetics at that.

And that's just one set of errors among many. One misjudgement of this kind is forgivable, but when they're piled up so high you can't see over the top of them, it's just rank incompetence.

But come on, this is a competition. I'm not giving away all the answers!

Hint: Look at the use of space, look at alignment, look at legibility ... etc, etc.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Shawn Miller
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 6:13:16 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "Why would you not follow convention and have the keyframe button change colour on a keyframe to highlight its state?"

Are you saying that the keyframe buttons NEVER change state? Also what is the minimum and maximum values for the scale transforms... the sliders are about 25% to the left, but the displayed value is 100.0%. Are the values on the right scrubbable text, they don't look interactive... and the rotation (knob?), I haven't seen that before, every other software application I've ever used utilizes sliders, scrubbable text or direct input boxes, the knob is weird (IMO). I also think it's strange to have a separate slider for uniform scale, a checkbox to link and unlink scale seems more elegant - just my opinion though. Lastly, is 0,0 really the default anchor point for objects in FCPX... or is it because you don't have an object selected (in the screenshot?)

Shawn



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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 6:21:25 pm

[Shawn Miller] "Are you saying that the keyframe buttons NEVER change state?"

The keyframe button itself goes grey (!) and the nav buttons behave in an idiosyncratic fashion that is too wayward to even begin to explain.

[Shawn Miller] "Also what is the minimum and maximum values for the scale transforms... the sliders are about 25% to the left, but the displayed value is 100.0%."

Yup. Mind-bogglingly poor design.

[Shawn Miller] "Are the values on the right scrubbable text, they don't look interactive"

Good point - they don't look scrubbable but they are. I hadn't spotted that.

[Shawn Miller] "and the rotation (knob?), I haven't seen that before"

It's an Apple thing and has been for a long while but it's a terrible, terrible control concept.

[Shawn Miller] " I also think it's strange to have a separate slider for uniform scale, a checkbox to link and unlink scale seems more elegant"

Agreed.

[Shawn Miller] "Lastly, is 0,0 really the default anchor point for objects in FCPX."

Yes, but this is the Apple convention and on balance I think I prefer it to the Adobe co-ordinates system.

You score very highly indeed (why am I not surprised?!), but you've still missed a few things.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Shawn Miller
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 7:03:50 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "[Shawn Miller] "Are you saying that the keyframe buttons NEVER change state?"

The keyframe button itself goes grey (!) and the nav buttons behave in an idiosyncratic fashion that is too wayward to even begin to explain."


ACK!!

[Simon Ubsdell] "[Shawn Miller] "Lastly, is 0,0 really the default anchor point for objects in FCPX."

Yes, but this is the Apple convention and on balance I think I prefer it to the Adobe co-ordinates system."


I admit, I prefer the Adobe coordinate system mostly because of laziness - I like knowing (at a glance) what half the pixel dimensions of an object is. One of my nitpicks about Premiere Pro is that you can't do mathematical operations in input boxes the way you can in AE, so if I have to put three 1920 graphics side by side, I can't just type in the transform boxes 960*3, 960*5... I actually have to "work" and type "2880", "4800"... see, pure laziness. ☺

[Simon Ubsdell] "You score very highly indeed (why am I not surprised?!), but you've still missed a few things."

I'm looking forward to hearing the rest of your thoughts on this! I bet the rest of us are looking at some glaring issues and not even realizing it. ☺

Shawn



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Walter Soyka
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 7:37:48 pm
Last Edited By Walter Soyka on Mar 2, 2017 at 7:46:08 pm

[Shawn Miller] "Also what is the minimum and maximum values for the scale transforms... the sliders are about 25% to the left, but the displayed value is 100.0%."

[Simon Ubsdell] "Yup. Mind-bogglingly poor design."

That's a tough one. Opacity and scale need different ranges. It makes sense to allow scale to range from negative to very positive, but it makes no sense to allow negative opacity or opacity above 100%. I actually like that sliders indicate sensible ranges. But in addition to what Shawn said...

I'd call out the difference in precision on percentages.

I'd call out the knob being bizarrely right-aligned to the sliders, the knob have a 3 o'clock origin for unity, and the fact that a knob cannot show more than single revolution while revolution can continue beyond 360 degrees.

I think literally everything in the position/anchor layout is wrong. The X control is closer to Y label than it is to X label. The X and Y parameter labels themselves are colored like parameters instead of the Position/Anchor labels. The numeric X control floats out where the visual elements for the other controls are, while the Y control is aligned with the rest of the numeric controls (giving it undue primacy).

There's also a potential range inconsistency on the pixel sliders in the crop control, as cropping is dependent on the size of the image.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 8:01:36 pm

Ah, now you see, that is what I was hoping for.

For Walter to come swinging by and not only see everything that I see, but plenty else besides, and to articulate it with such sublime clarity.

I can but salute you, sir.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Walter Soyka
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 8:20:23 pm

You are too kind.

We should play this game with Premiere sometime, too...

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 8:23:44 pm

[Walter Soyka] "We should play this game with Premiere sometime, too..."

Yes, indeed.

None of this stuff is perfect and it's certainly not only Apple that gets it wrong.

But at least Adobe don't throw everything at a dramatic UI overhaul and mess up quite as badly as this.

...

I know there are going to be a lot of people reading this who are thinking it's all completely irrelevant, but I'm not sure they're right.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Shawn Miller
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 9:26:23 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "Ah, now you see, that is what I was hoping for.

For Walter to come swinging by and not only see everything that I see, but plenty else besides, and to articulate it with such sublime clarity.

I can but salute you, sir."


Ha ha - me too. I was actually hoping Walter would say something yesterday. These were the forehead slappers for me:

[Walter Soyka] "
- I'd call out the difference in precision on percentages.
- I'd call out the knob being bizarrely right-aligned to the sliders, the knob have a 3 o'clock origin for unity, and the fact that a knob cannot show more than single revolution while revolution can continue beyond 360 degrees.
-I think literally everything in the position/anchor layout is wrong. The X control is closer to Y label than it is to X label. The X and Y parameter labels themselves are colored like parameters instead of the Position/Anchor labels. The numeric X control floats out where the visual elements for the other controls are, while the Y control is aligned with the rest of the numeric controls (giving it undue primacy)."


Thanks for bringing this up Simon, you and Walter made this a really fun thread. ☺

Shawn



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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 9:58:29 pm

[Shawn Miller] "Thanks for bringing this up Simon, you and Walter made this a really fun thread."

Thanks to you, too. It has indeed been fun. And interesting.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 11:26:34 am

You identified so many issues so impressively well that I momentarily forgot that you'd missed some.

One of these is something you can't see from the original screen grab, but which I've highlighted here:



If you click in a number field, an ugly, clunky blue rectangle appears, which remains even when you move the slider or scrub the number field for a different parameter. There is of course no logic to this and I would suggest there is no good reason for the rectangle highlighter at all. Just more random "design" seemingly hurled at the UI without thought or oversight.

You also rightly point out very serious issues with the layout. I would add these points.

If you are going to do away with the concept of a "ruler" to define both the default position and the end stops of the slider, why would you make the slider range colour (a very dark grey on a very dark grey) virtually impossible to read?

And then why would you overlook one of the easiest ways of making the left-hand end stop more obvious, namely the justification of the legends? The left justification of the legends leaves a random gaping space before the left end stop (arbitrarily dictated by the length of the word or words) which is not only ugly but also deeply unhelpful.

A very simple solution would have been to right-justify the legends, which would have given a very clear reference point for the left end stop.

One of the nasty limitations of the FCP X Inspector is that it is fixed width, so you can't open out the panel to create wider sliders with finer granularity. And this fixed width is very narrow indeed.

That being the case, the design of the sliders here does everything it can to minimise the length of travel - an ultimate act of perversity.

My rough calculations on a 1920x1200 monitor tell me that 133 pixels are given over to the legends (and left hand margin); there are 93 pixels for the keyframe functions and right hand margin/scrollbar, 77 pixels for the number fields, and a mere 92 pixels for the sliders themselves.

This is almost unimaginably stupid. Less than 25% of the width of the panel is actually dedicated to the sliders!

---

If they can't be bothered to sweat the small stuff ... well, you fill in the rest.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Gregor Queck
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 3:41:04 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "If you click in a number field, an ugly, clunky blue rectangle appears, which remains even when you move the slider or scrub the number field for a different parameter. There is of course no logic to this and I would suggest there is no good reason for the rectangle highlighter at all. Just more random "design" seemingly hurled at the UI without thought or oversight."

The blue field has the purpose of directing keyboard input. Even if you scrub some other field your keyboard input is directed to the blue rectangle and you know it since it's highlighted.

Seems you sometimes write 'hurled without thought or oversight'.

Please no fake news here at the cow!
:)

. . .


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 3:58:53 pm

[Gregor Queck] "The blue field has the purpose of directing keyboard input. Even if you scrub some other field your keyboard input is directed to the blue rectangle and you know it since it's highlighted. "

I'm sorry but this makes no sense at all to me. You'\re going to have to explain in more detail.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Gregor Queck
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 4:24:38 pm

Just try:
° click on 'Scale X' , you get the blue rectangle.
° mouse over 'Scale Y', change the values by click-drag (without release). The blue rectangle stays at 'Scale X' .
° type on your keyboard some number.
° the input goes to the blue rectangle, no matter what field you just changed by mouse/trackpad.
° you can move the blue rectangle by tab/shift-tab and so the focus of your keyboard input.
° if you had no BlueRec®, you didn't know where your keyboard input would go

..... see, some logic here......:)

. . .


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 4:27:19 pm

[Gregor Queck] "° the input goes to the blue rectangle, no matter what field you just changed by mouse/trackpad."

This seems to me to be the very essence of bad design.

Which is why I called attention to it in the first place.

But if it makes sense to you, I will scrub it from my list.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Gregor Queck
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 4:52:28 pm

It's the sibling of the white point/ YellowRec® in the timeline. If you select a clip in the timeline you change its values in the inspector, no matter where your playhead is. If you don't select/deselect a clip, your inspector shows ever-changing values, depending on the clip/white point under your playhead...

. . .


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 5:09:07 pm

I'm trying hard and I'd like nothing better than to say that I see what you mean, but I can't see any practical application for this that would justify the prima facie confusion.

Call me old school but for me confusion has no place in effective UI design.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Brian Seegmiller
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 5:54:38 pm

I just tried something. In PP all the fields you can change in the effects tab are highlighted blue. All you need to do it mouse over it and drag to change its value. I also tried this in FCP X. Yes, you can just mouse over the number you want to change and change it. You will get little pointers that indicate you can scroll the value up and down. The numbers do change to blue in some cases. If you want to add a certain number you can select it and the blue box will indicate you can enter a number. This is pretty much the same as it works in PP.

Also, the reason the 0 field for the X and Y value are off to the right is because it leaves room for a value of 4 digits or more.

Pretty logical to me.


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 9:12:10 pm

I must be a bear of very little brain, and I'm fully prepared to admit that I am, but I would have thought that the highlight box should follow whatever slider I am adjusting.

That it does not, overwhelms the few brain cells that I am able to summon to the task.

I can only stand in awe of those of you who can not only comfortably engage with this multi-dimensional system, but also find it useful.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Brian Seegmiller
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 11:03:11 pm

But you are a Motion ninja. I can only wish I could do the same thing. So there is that.


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Bill Davis
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 5:17:35 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "If you click in a number field, an ugly, clunky blue rectangle appears, which remains even when you move the slider or scrub the number field for a different parameter. There is of course no logic to this and I would suggest there is no good reason for the rectangle highlighter at all. Just more random "design" seemingly hurled at the UI without thought or oversight."

Uh... as to this specifically, the blue box, denotes that the field has becomes "active" and a mouse or trackpad scroll up or down increments or diminishes the value smoothly.

I use this ALL THE TIME in moving things and setting values.

Just sayin'

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 5:39:49 pm

[Bill Davis] "Uh... as to this specifically, the blue box, denotes that the field has becomes "active" and a mouse or trackpad scroll up or down increments or diminishes the value smoothly. "

No, Bill, sorry. It's not that I am in any doubt as to what the blue box "does".

If you go back and read my original comment, it is to do with the confusion in its implementation - and the sheer inelegance of it to boot.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki


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Tom Sefton
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 7:16:04 pm

For everyone else, I'd love some specifics. Features, products, hardware, software, customer communication, third-party partnerships, adoption of industry standards -- name it. The sky's the limit.

Coooool.

Right, to start off, I'd like to see some Apple manufactured displays that are available for use with MacBook Pro or Mac Pro that get up to and beyond 5K in HDR. The quality of Apple displays in the past has been incredible and having thunderbolt 3 pass through would be great.

It would also be really nice to see a new iPhone released that can playback VR footage, and an apple headset for this, or, a custom apple VR device. Some of my colleagues that previously were Apple loyal have moved away to use google or Samsung because of their VR support.

A new Mac Pro which has incredible performance, both with ultra high resolution HDR footage, but also for use with some of the most intensive processes around, like filmed VR content. Whilst on this note, having the ability to use thunderbolt 3 to add extra GPUs to offload some of the necessary compute power for these tasks. It would also be really cool to be able to specify RAM way beyond 64GB.

Software wise, if apple released a piece of software that did what Photoshop does, but works better with FCPX that would be awesome (it is still baffling that psd files cause issues in Premiere Pro), along with the fantastic updates to FCPX that have been forthcoming in the last couple of years.

Largely fanciful and unfinished but that's pretty much how most of my thoughts are with a 4 month old at home.

Co-owner at Pollen Studio
http://www.pollenstudio.co.uk


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Walter Soyka
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 2, 2017 at 8:04:27 pm

[Tim Wilson] "So here's my question to you all: what do you WANT Apple to do? What would it look like if Apple was doing more in the pro area? "

There's one area where I'd like Apple to do less.

Specifically, chill out with the macOS feature set/release schedule. It'd be nice for developers to actually spend their efforts improving their software, not just trying to keep running on Apple's ever-changing operating system.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Mark Suszko
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 3, 2017 at 11:40:42 pm

My tired old song: add auto audio transcription and open and closed-captioning to FCPX, or give us a plug-in/App that does that seamlessly and largely automatically. Captioning isn't just for the deaf; it has massive importance in future and present metadata. And the way we do it now seems prehistoric.


In hardware terms, an updated protube or some other regular polygonal shaped casing, with an emphasis returning to user-accessible upgrades and repairs.


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Tim Wilson
Re: Tim Cook says Apple "will do more in the pro area"
on Mar 4, 2017 at 1:05:43 am

[Mark Suszko] "add auto audio transcription and open and closed-captioning to FCPX"

I want to emphasize OPEN captions. Premiere is doing this better than anyone right now, but it needs to be better. You're right, Mark -- automatic is ideal! And completely do-able!


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