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Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?

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Tim Wilson
Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 9, 2016 at 8:25:52 pm
Last Edited By Tim Wilson on Mar 9, 2016 at 8:26:41 pm

Since we're talking about various approaches to collaborative workflow on another thread, I wanted to point you to a video that Mathieu Morano posted on his CreativeCOW.net blog, reposted from his "My Canadian Studio" podcast.

Mathieu is a veteran colorist, as well as an FCP/FCPX fan from way back (director of Montreal's Final Cut MTL since 2003), and has been digging Resolve's feature set that enables editors and colorists to be working on the same project at the same time.

I'm curious what some of you workflow ninjas think about this. Appealing? How does it compare to approaches you're using?


#MCS EP04 : COLLABORATIVE WORKFLOW WITH DAVINCI RESOLVE 12 from Mon Studio Au Canada on Vimeo.



BTW, Mathieu is posting some killer stuff at his COW blog right now, including one just the other day on QNAP shared storage for FCPX, Premiere, and Resolve. You should definitely check it out.

So, take a look at the workflow Mathieu illustrates, and tell us what you think.


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Michael Gissing
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 9, 2016 at 11:30:03 pm

Certainly a nice way to speed up finishing in a facility with Resolve for editing & grade. For me the editing always happens at another facility or increasingly someones bedroom. If they were editing on Resolve then I am sure this could work even over the crap internet we suffer in this country with duplicated identical media drives so it is just data linking not media.

This is a feature that might sway more big facilities to using Resolve for the edit.


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Bret Williams
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 10, 2016 at 7:32:36 pm

[Michael Gissing] "This is a feature that might sway more big facilities to using Resolve for the edit."

It's great to have a free option out there like Resolve, but I can't see why anyone would be choosing it as their edit system of choice. It really is like they married the common ground between Adobe CC and FCP X. They completely left out the stuff that makes either one of those powerful. They don't have keywording, roles, skimming or magnetic timeline from X. They don't have the advanced audio, key framing or pancaking ability of CC. And they don't have the many plugins and effects and integration you get with X or CC. It's kinda like they took the lesser of the two apps and put them together.

Good for cuts/dissolves and color correction though!


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Michael Gissing
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 12, 2016 at 12:56:24 am

[Bret Williams] "They don't have keywording, roles, skimming or magnetic timeline from X. They don't have the advanced audio, key framing or pancaking ability of CC. And they don't have the many plugins and effects and integration you get with X or CC. It's kinda like they took the lesser of the two apps and put them together."

After coming from way behind in version 10, the editing functions have improved at a rate that no other NLE can boast. Audio is much improved. Keyframing? It has full read write automation at both the clip and track level and with VST plugins you can't say that audio isn't advanced or plugins are lacking. Roles & magnetic are not missing features as they are adopting the standard track based system that most NLEs use so calling it a missing feature rather than a preference is strange. Also why would they take on Apple over a patent?

I grant you that smart bins reading metadata might be a different approach to keywording but it isn't totally missing just differently implemented and probably well behind X. But for how long?

Integration? How about Resolve can import and export various flavours of xml and AAF including audio export via AAF without third party software. It handles more output codecs than X. Compared to X that argument is hard to fathom. It also is possible to stay in Resolve and export a finished program, graded and titled so what integration is lacking?

OFX plugins give me Boris CC and Red Giant. Not as big a choice as X or CC and certainly OFX RT performance is not great but early days.

Really the thing to note is the pace and sophistication of development of the editing side of Resolve. The changes I have seen in the past year are greater than any NLE has ever shown and the pace shows no sign of slowing. Having adapted a grade tool into an NLE as quickly and effectively as Blackmagic have done in an astonishingly short time your gripes about it as an NLE will very quickly just become the typical argument here about preference not fundamentals missing.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 12, 2016 at 2:45:32 pm

[Bret Williams] "It's great to have a free option out there like Resolve"

To take advantage of the Resolve-to-Resolve collaboration (as shown in this video), it requires the paid version on both stations ($999 each).

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Bret Williams
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 12, 2016 at 3:14:40 pm

True. Buy my point actually undercuts that and just jumps to the point that Resolve is still in its infancy and not ready for prime time. Perhaps in a place where it is truly being used for Online work. It just doesn't have the performance and tools for creative work beyond color correction. Maybe this NAB we'll see it get some integration with Fusion, some decent titling engine of sorts like X, and better use of the GPU or whatever they need to do to make playback useable.

And if you spend $1000, (or $500) wouldn't you want the ability to use AJA? Seems fair. I understand they'll give it to you free to get you to use their devices. Kind of like Apple. But if you're buying it outright, then that thinking breaks down and it's just an underpowered NLE that only supports 1 of the major IO device players. And one that recently is extremely flakey.


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David Mathis
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 10, 2016 at 8:03:21 pm

Nice tool for a rough cut for those that prefer tracks. A few things are missing but like Final Cut there will be improvements. Tracks are just painful to look at for me unless audio post is involved then that is no so bad.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 10, 2016 at 10:23:10 pm

I think the hardest part for collaboration like this is what are the odds that both the editor and the colorist are using Resolve? I think the strides BM has made with Resolve over the last 2-3 versions have been great, but from an editing perspective there's still not really a compelling reason to choose it over the 3 A's. If Resolve does become a solid editing competitor then I think this ability to grade and edit in the same timeline will be attractive to deadline driven situations. For example, I used to grade a weekly news magazine show (cut in FCP 7, colored in Color) and I would always have to start grading on a work-in-progress cut and then do any annoying number of pickups down the line because that was the only way to get it done in time. Being able to grade the same timeline the editor was cutting in would certainly be preferable to sending XMLs back and forth.


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Michael Gissing
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 12, 2016 at 1:12:15 am

[Andrew Kimery]"If Resolve does become a solid editing competitor then I think this ability to grade and edit in the same timeline will be attractive to deadline driven situations"

Ultimately everything has a deadline or a desire not to waste time fiddling with xml transfers and silly things like the inability to transfer text, framing, keyframe moves etc. So much of my time is spent with the translation process that having a direct transfer from edit to finishing would make my job so much easier. It is what I had for many years with FCP Legend being used with Color as a finishing tool.

I get that Resolve is not up there yet with other NLEs for editing but I see that as a matter of time before we are just arguing about preferences and not missing features because that list is diminishing faster than X or CC are being developed. Blackmagic is not going to be content with a half baked NLE inside a grading finishing tool. I think I made a list of things here over a year ago and much of that list has been ticked.

To be honest the collaborative grade while you edit workflow outlined here is not that important to me. It has always been messy but possible to pre grade and use ColorTrace. But to be able to feed grades back into the edit is something that could be appealing. Of course the elephant in the room is Fusion and when we see how that will also integrate into Resolve we might have even greater reason to consider Resolve as serious NLE.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 12, 2016 at 5:31:25 am

[Michael Gissing] "Ultimately everything has a deadline or a desire not to waste time fiddling with xml transfers and silly things like the inability to transfer text, framing, keyframe moves etc. "

Agreed, though the usefulness of the feature still hinges on both the editor and the colorist using Resolve which is probably going to be a rather infrequent occurrence in reality (at least in my corner of the industry). Years ago I remember thinking how much better interfacing with our in house GFX team was going to be since FCP had a Send to Motion option. Our GFX team never moved away from AE though. Just recently I finished a piece in PPro but the in house re-recording mixer uses ProTools, not Adobe Audition. The potential of 'unifying' workflows between specialized apps always seems to be greater than the reality of it actually happening in my experience.

[Michael Gissing] "So much of my time is spent with the translation process that having a direct transfer from edit to finishing would make my job so much easier. It is what I had for many years with FCP Legend being used with Color as a finishing tool."

What do you think about the round trip between PPro and SpeedGrade? That's the type of thing I always wanted the FCP/Color relationship to be. Things got a bit easier with Color 1.5 but there were still a lot of caveats in order to have a successful roundtrip between FCP Legend and Color.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 12, 2016 at 2:51:40 pm

I've done some testing of this workflow together with Patrick Inhofer. The trick is that it's largely a one-way workflow. By that I mean that one person has to be the editor while the other is the colorist. The system gets "confused" when the editor also starts making color correction changes.

Remember that this is in a networked system. You could have two detached Resolve stations (both free), where one is doing editing and then the project file is moved to the colorist for grading in Resolve.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Michael Gissing
Re: Resolve 12 collaborative workflow thoughts?
on Mar 14, 2016 at 6:55:27 am
Last Edited By Michael Gissing on Mar 14, 2016 at 7:00:23 am

[Andrew Kimery] "What do you think about the round trip between PPro and SpeedGrade? That's the type of thing I always wanted the FCP/Color relationship to be. Things got a bit easier with Color 1.5 but there were still a lot of caveats in order to have a successful roundtrip between FCP Legend and Color.

The early iterations in CS6 were awful. I haven't moved to CC. Came very close but Resolve has been able to meet my needs. Now that I am comfortable with Resolve, I don't feel the need to revisit Speedgrade. The fact that they improved grading within Pr was maybe a way to avoid the absolute need to round trip.

As Resolve improves as an edit grade & finish tool I doubt I will need to embrace Speedgrade. I was fairly excited at first but now I don't have much motivation.

Color and FCP7 never quite made it. There were so many little issues like stills, titles etc that meant you had to go back to FCP7 to finish. Going back to the NLE now seems like a waste f time and potential gotchas that I don't do that anymore.


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