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Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.

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Bill Davis
Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Feb 29, 2016 at 6:06:41 pm

Just an interesting article, particularly relating to how magnetism helps Tom in High Profile promo trailer production by pinning SFX to ending clips and making it easier to time things...

FWIW.

http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/articles/1779-cutting-the-game-of-thrones-t...

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Neil Goodman
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Feb 29, 2016 at 9:04:19 pm

The clip connection thing is cool - but anyone who does promo, builds the backplates that same way no matter what NLE. Just lasso all the clips and move them. Not quite as elegant as FCPX clip connections but really its a non issue.

Whats crazy is that he had 2 weeks to do such a simple edit, and if it was in another NLE - would it have taken 4? lol

Just kidding- I get it why a :30 cut can take 2 weeks, notes notes notes. Deal with it all the time,. Have spent more time on simpler things just cause of how many versions, v.o. tones, diff GFX packages etc.


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Bill Davis
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Feb 29, 2016 at 11:37:40 pm

As to the 2 weeks, getting to Copenhagen, settling in the hotel, finding a good coffee shop for the mornings and a bar for the evenings and researching how to say "have the newest cards arrived by bonded courier yet? in Danish cuz after all this is GofT! - all that stuff takes TIME to do at a truly professional level Neil.

That's my presumption, anyway.
; )

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Scott Witthaus
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 1:22:23 am

[Neil Goodman] "Whats crazy is that he had 2 weeks to do such a simple edit,"

Having worked with agency creative teams for over two decades, this does not surprise me one bit. Sometimes it's like "how slow do I go so you can hit your billable hours...?"

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 2:27:01 am

[Scott Witthaus] "Having worked with agency creative teams for over two decades, this does not surprise me one bit. Sometimes it's like "how slow do I go so you can hit your billable hours...?""

Or, do 8 million versions just to come back to what was close to a polished v1 two weeks later.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 12:29:39 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Or, do 8 million versions just to come back to what was close to a polished v1 two weeks later."

That's where the "zero frame trim" works it's wonders.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 2:32:55 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Or, do 8 million versions just to come back to what was close to a polished v1 two weeks later.
"


...and that's why I try to always bill agencies by the hour...

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 2:47:11 pm

According to this forum, by the hour is invalid!!!

Project fees only! :-D


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 4:04:58 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "According to this forum, by the hour is invalid!!!"

ok, how about a day rate, restricted hours and overtime hourly (with a multiplier) after the set hour limit?

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Neil Goodman
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 4:13:51 am

[Scott Witthaus] "Having worked with agency creative teams for over two decades, this does not surprise me one bit. Sometimes it's like "how slow do I go so you can hit your billable hours...?"
"


Totally - I've had promos for networks go way over 2 weeks for shows waaaaay smaller than GOT.


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 12:35:15 pm

Of course, one of the key takeaways from this article is this:

"When it came to sending across the timeline there were quite a lot of hoops to jump through and settings to get exactly right. But very basically, I exported an XML to Resolve, and an AAF from Resolve to Avid. This bought across the picture (though not any speed ramps).

With audio I tried to send as an AAF to Avid via X2Pro, but it didn’t like it (I suspect mixed sample rates and more than 24 mono tracks was the issue). So I consolidated all the audio files and used a spreadsheet from Producers Best Friend to rebuild the audio manually.

I wouldn’t particularly recommend this as a workflow, It was a little bit of a pain."

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 4:06:52 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "I wouldn’t particularly recommend this as a workflow, It was a little bit of a pain.""

Here's the rest of the quote though, "But for me it was much nicer cutting in X for 2 weeks and spending half a day sending it to Avid, than spending 2 weeks in Avid."

Anytime you transfer an edit from one NLE to another you are going to lose things, especially to/from Avid since it's the only one that uses AAF as opposed to XML.


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 4:30:01 pm

[Andrew Kimery] "Anytime you transfer an edit from one NLE to another you are going to lose things, especially to/from Avid since it's the only one that uses AAF as opposed to XML.
"


Yes, agreed - I was just quoting selectively for journalistic effect ;-)

However, it remains that the X2Pro export didn't work for the audio - which should be a matter for concern. I have great respect for what the guys at Marquis have achieved and generally it's solid enough, but at the same time I've had too many failed exports just like this to be entirely happy with the workflow. And this was a really pretty short and simple timeline ...

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 5:02:31 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "I was just quoting selectively for journalistic effect "

tsk, tsk, tsk....shame on you! ;-)

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Charlie Austin
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 2, 2016 at 4:13:18 am
Last Edited By Charlie Austin on Mar 2, 2016 at 4:15:17 am

[Simon Ubsdell] "However, it remains that the X2Pro export didn't work for the audio - which should be a matter for concern"

FWIW, it's not X2Pro in this case, it's Media Composer. Until 8.5, more than 16 tracks would cause problems, but the real issue is that -even coming from ProTools - you have to "quantatize to frame boundaries" for an AAF to work at all. X2Pro doesn't do this and, since X will have lots of edits on subframes, Media Composer won't open it. Could Marquis fix it? Maybe, but their focus is ProTools and other DAW's, which happily accept the AAF's.

I've heard of random X2Pro issues but - and this is anecdote rather than data - I've never had a problem sending X2Pro AAF's to mixes... They're usually very happy with the prep... split out properly, all tracks named etc.

-------------------------------------------------------------

~ My FCPX Babbling blog ~
~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 2, 2016 at 7:36:08 am
Last Edited By Simon Ubsdell on Mar 2, 2016 at 8:47:03 am

[Charlie Austin] "FWIW, it's not X2Pro in this case, it's Media Composer."

Thanks for clarifying, Charlie. That makes sense. It wasn't clear to me that this was the route.

Coincidentally we recently delivered some GOT trailers and spots to HBO and they were asking for mixes and stems not the original laid audio as it seems they did in this case, hence my confusion here. I was assuming the issue was getting from FCPX via X2Pro into ProTools, not taking an AAF from X2Pro straight into Media Composer - which is obviously not what it's designed to do, as you say.

Simon Ubsdell
tokyo-uk.com


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Bill Davis
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 4:26:37 pm

Isn't it interesting that as an editor working at the top of his game, Tom is willing to shoulder some export complexity AFTER his creative work is done - in order to get the benefits the X approach provides him during his actual editing.

Makes you think, huh.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 5:14:53 pm

[Bill Davis] "Makes you think, huh."

He's inflexible and stuck in his ways? ;)


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Bill Davis
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 1, 2016 at 6:04:10 pm

Exactly Andrew.

Just like Premiere Pro editors are stuck in THEIR ways - seeking workflows as much like what they've been accustomed to for the past 30 years as possible cuz, you know, change is hard.

; )

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Gary Huff
Re: Game of Thrones London Trailer workflow in X.
on Mar 3, 2016 at 1:16:25 am
Last Edited By Gary Huff on Mar 3, 2016 at 1:17:04 am

[Bill Davis] "
Just like Premiere Pro editors are stuck in THEIR ways - seeking workflows as much like what they've been accustomed to for the past 30 years as possible cuz, you know, change is hard."


Not that hard. Once you actually get over it and look past the glitz, the workflow isn't really that different, as far as the actual edit is concerned at least.


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