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Walter Soyka
Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 11:14:12 am

David Mathis, maybe Kodak has been reading your posts here. Check this out:

http://kodak.com/ek/us/en/consumer/products/super8/default.htm?cid=go



"Kodak says that it will launch multiple Super 8 cameras, film development services and post production tools as part of its Super 8 Revival plan."

http://www.engadget.com/2016/01/05/kodak-resurrects-super-8-with-a-new-vide...



"The first new Super 8, expected to arrive in a limited-edition version in the fall of 2016, was conceived with help from the industrial designer Yves Behar. It is likely to cost between $400 to $750, Mr. Clarke estimated. Processing the film should cost $50 to $75 a cartridge, he said. Mr. Clarke expects in 2017 a lower-cost version aimed at a broader audience."

http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2016/01/05/kodak-goes-retro-with-new-super-8-ca...

$1800/hr in processing will get those shooting ratios back down, right?

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Noah Kadner
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 2:36:23 pm

In other news, Wells Fargo is reviving the stage coach. Not sure if it's going places...

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP eXchange - FCPX Workshops


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Claude Lyneis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 5:47:30 am

I think Quinton Tarantino used it in Hateful 8.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 3:02:39 pm

Hipsters rejoice!


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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 3:14:43 pm

Wow! This is exciting!

I do know that the Super 16 format is still alive as well. Bolex still makes the cameras but at a higher price. I was lucky to find a used one on eBay for the price of FCP X, in very good condition. Now if only that film scanner was not expensive that would be great.

I just wonder if the Super 8 movie, not seen it yet, had anything to do with this resurgence. Who knows, maybe 8 Track will be brought back to life. Stranger things have happened.

Remember kids, X marks the spot as in FCP X.


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Warren Eig
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 3:54:30 pm

Well, Google cassette tapes For some reason they are making a comeback...

Warren Eig
O 310-470-0905


email: info@babyboompictures.com
website: http://www.BabyBoomPictures.com



For Camera Accessories - Monitors and Batteries
website: http://www.EigRig.com



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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 3:59:51 pm

That is a surprise. Perhaps people see analog as a solid and groovy format. Who knows what will happen with VHS next. Nothing like that blinking 12:00 AM because the power went out.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 4:03:49 pm
Last Edited By Jeremy Garchow on Jan 8, 2016 at 12:46:06 am

Hipsters! Rejoice!

Vinyl helped (and streaming) kept the music industry afloat in 2015.

http://waxra.com/vinyl-and-streaming-services-kept-the-music-industry-afloa...

Next up for revival, the wax cylinder:



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Bill Davis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 2:36:51 am

Looks as if I'm completely ready for the next hipster era since I have this beauty tucked away...



They do NOT make them like they used to!

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Gary Huff
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 5:35:27 pm

[Bill Davis] "They do NOT make them like they used to!"

Yep, they are much better now.


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Bill Davis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 7:43:08 pm

Hardly negates Santayana's observation...

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Gary Huff
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 11, 2016 at 1:37:47 am

[Bill Davis] "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

Perfectly describes the future customers of this camera.


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 9:58:55 pm

If it weren't for cassette tapes, what would we use pencils for?

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 11:45:49 pm

Perhaps this will answer your question:







Of course one question remains. Will it blend?


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Mark Suszko
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 7, 2016 at 9:52:12 pm

Will this revived film fit in my old super-8 camera? Sprocket-wise?


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Charlie Austin
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 12:44:26 am

[Mark Suszko] "Will this revived film fit in my old super-8 camera? Sprocket-wise?"

Sure... same cartridges they still make now.

-------------------------------------------------------------

~ My FCPX Babbling blog ~
~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Craig Seeman
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 3:24:28 am

So at NAB does Blackmagic announce the Cintel Mini for Resolve and FCPX?



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Bret Williams
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 3:40:26 am

No love for the Logmar? http://www.wired.com/2014/07/logmar-super-8/


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Charlie Austin
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 3:56:11 am

Supposedly amazing. Also $5995.



-------------------------------------------------------------

~ My FCPX Babbling blog ~
~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Claude Lyneis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 4:30:15 am

Just went to Hateful 8. Credits said it was filmed with Kodak film and I believe it was 70 mm. So in spite of Kodak's bankruptcy, Hollywood loves film. Same applies for the new Star Wars although it was in iMax 3D, whatever format they are now using. On the other hand the resolution for super-8 leaves a lot to be desired and no blockbusters are to be expected. Of course the workflow all goes through digital intermediaries, so the editing is not much different starting from film or digital.

I still have my late sixties Minolta super 8 camera, but at these film prices it will continue resting deep in the garage.


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Mark Suszko
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 5:37:11 am

I've kept my high school super eight camera and projector all these years... I think I'm going to have to buy one cartridge, for a goof, and shoot something with it. Probably try to find footage of myself from then and match it to today or something along that line.


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Bret Williams
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 1:46:55 pm

I don't understand how the Kodak one will be $500. At that price if it were any good just buy it for the digital side and never worry about the film.


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Noah Kadner
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 4:09:53 pm

Here's the real rub:

"Processing the film should cost $50 to $75 a cartridge"

A Super 8mm roll is good for just under 3 minutes and that price is on top of the cartridge itself. Can you imagine spending $100 just to capture 3 minutes of footage at a resolution far below what you can get right now on just about any current smartphone? (I've seen Super 8 scanned up to 1080p on a Rank and it really starts to fall apart so forget about anything like 4K.)

Sure there will be a few high profile hipsters who make some noise with this gear for a short project or two but if this is Kodak's gameplan to become relevant again to indie fillmmakers, they're doomed.

Gimme a 1000' load of 35mm I can shoot and process for under $100 and you'll get my attention. For most would-be filmmakers the aesthetic appeal of film was never in question; it was all about the economics.

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP eXchange - FCPX Workshops


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Bill Davis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 7:52:40 pm

And in addition to the production cost issue Noah raises, there's the environmental one as well.

The silver nitrate based toxic chemical stew that was traditionally associated with film processing just seems like 18th century tech.

You can't avoid all chemicals and pollutants - that's a given - but when society has developed reasonable alternatives and simply CHOOSE to continue to generate toxic sludge, I'd like a better reason than "But it makes me feel so retro-wonderful!"

I love aesthetics as much as the next guy. But sometimes chasing them just don't make enough sense.

My 2 cents.

Your mileage will most certainly vary.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 9, 2016 at 1:51:40 am

[Bill Davis] "You can't avoid all chemicals and pollutants - that's a given - but when society has developed reasonable alternatives and simply CHOOSE to continue to generate toxic sludge, I'd like a better reason than "But it makes me feel so retro-wonderful!""

Honest question, does anyone know how 'clean' the mining of raw materials, manufacturing and disposal of electronic equipment used in modern cameras is compared to film? I know countries have tried to go green and ban/limit the use of things like lead in manufacturing, but I don't know how extensive those measures are. As a primer this is a recycling web site's list of hazardous materials that are commonly used in electronic devices.

http://ewasteguide.info/hazardous-substances


-Andrew


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Bill Davis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 9, 2016 at 5:35:55 pm

Andrew.

Your question caused me to do a bit more research and it appears that my traditional thinking about the environmental impact of photo chemical processing might have been out of date. It appears that while photo processing discharge is a thing - there are ways to mitigate the environmental impact. So the hipsters can maybe rejoice. Live and learn!

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 9, 2016 at 6:20:13 pm

[Bill Davis] "there are ways to mitigate the environmental impact."

Please tell me they put the waste into large barrels and shoot them into the Sun? ;)


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Bill Davis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 10, 2016 at 8:32:07 am

Nothing so cinematic. Seems to employ sulfur to turn the damaging silver nitrate into something much more environmentally benign. Found an interesting article on a photo hobbyist/environmentalist who asked real chemistry experts how to treat his darkroom discharge into a maybe leaky septic system near a fragile ecosystem - and got surprisingly happy answers. ACTUAL science to the rescue - and my opinion has officially changed. At least until the next time I'm swayed by an argument!

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 8, 2016 at 6:55:55 pm

For that price, I could get a Digital Bolex camera and some lenses for it. I was lucky enough to get a Super 16 Bolex for about $300 on eBay, she is in very good condition. I think there should be a revival in the 16 mm market.

I believe that Bolex continues to make new film cameras but at a much higher premium.

With that new Kodak camera, looks like home movies about cats.


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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 10, 2016 at 1:10:07 am

Do they send the film back after it has been developed? I would like to have it and would prefer to scan the film myself. Willing to take on the learning curve and develop a new skill set.


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Noah Kadner
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 10, 2016 at 1:52:46 am

I can't imagine they wouldn't send you the developed film along with a digital copy. Hopefully in nice ProRes 444 and not something silly like H.264. Can you imagine....

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
FCP eXchange - FCPX Workshops


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Mark Smith
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 10, 2016 at 2:30:20 pm

Big Yawn.
Super 8 is a very niche item and actually a pretty lousy image unless you have your own Kinetta scanner to digitize your shot film.
Film is pricey at at super 8 level while it has a look, it can never step outside that look and be better, offer shallow DOF or better image quality associated with larger film formats.
If there were a road sign for this endeavor it would read "Dead End"


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Michael Phillips
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 10, 2016 at 3:09:15 pm

If nothing else, it will be put down as a marketing expense. There hasn't been this amount of talk on shooting film (or not) in a while.

The cost per minute aside, it is not a silent camera - so blimping and all the things we used to do to quiet the cameras. Even though it records audio, double system will still be a viable and used option. In the specs, I do not see fractional rates - just classic film whole numbers with crystal sync. Maybe this will change, but audio recorders everywhere will need to be aware of 48.048kHz recording for sync and no SRC when working in "NTSC" based countries. The lack of 29.97p/30p raises an eyebrow as well for some productions.


Michael


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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 20, 2016 at 1:15:19 am

Was just poking around eBay found a used camera for $0.99 plus shipping of about nine bucks. Look pretty good so I bought, yet to test it out. Now looking for a reasonable price on telecine equipment. Prefer to do my own scanning. What resolution should I use? Was thinking of topping out at 2K resolution. Probably would edit in X or Resolve, still making a choice there.


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David Mathis
Re: Way OT: Kodak reviving Super8
on Jan 23, 2016 at 1:30:35 am

Found this interesting:



Camera Operator | Editor | PA
FCP X, Motion, Compressor, Resolve Studio, Photoshop
Black MagicDesign Cimea Camera, Bolex H16, Kodak Super 8


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