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Oliver Peters
Precision Editor
on Dec 26, 2015 at 9:26:20 pm

Is anyone using the Precision Editor in FCPX to trim? Do you find it useful?

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Chris Stevens
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 9:55:32 am

I find I'm using it more & more. Mainly for seeing how much & where the additional footage is either side of a transition. Don't tend to use it for normal trimming though.

Chris Stevens - Waterline Media. Marine Production Company.
FCPX,Motion,AE, Resolve


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Craig Seeman
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 4:34:02 pm
Last Edited By Craig Seeman on Dec 27, 2015 at 4:34:38 pm

I like being able to see the handles (not always needed though) but I much prefer a two up that works when using the keyboard.



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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 5:40:25 pm

If I'm only concerned with one side of the edit, reveal in browser does the job. I'm often only concerned with where I want to trim each clip. I'll use cross dissolves to soften any feeling of a jump cut. I do like old school more stagnant shots than what is in fashion right now.

Have to admit that my mind doesn't easily imagine the final result of a roll edit looking at the frozen timeline even while looking at two up display - until I play it back with "shift-?" It's like i don't see the effect that playback speed will have. Maybe I should practice that since it could be a time saver.

I'll often look at the Precision Editor just to get a glimpse of both handles and then close it and use the two up and the browser selection. Followed by playing around playhead. So all and all I like the feature but don't use it to full advantage.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 5:52:33 pm

What improvements should be made to it? What about split edits (L & J-cuts) with the PE?

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Brett Sherman
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 6:01:23 pm

[Oliver Peters] "What improvements should be made to it? What about split edits (L & J-cuts) with the PE?"

I never thought about that. I might actually use it if I could do L & J cuts without expanding and collapsing the audio.


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 6:11:08 pm

Yeah about the only way to be able to use wider shots and reaction shots with dialog is to integrate J & L edits.

How could this be improved with the precision editor? What features would you add?

In some ways this is done really well in FCP X multi cam. You choose your sound track and cut around it.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 7:18:22 pm

[Craig Alan] "How could this be improved with the precision editor?"

Well to start with, the ability to even do it in the PE.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 9:56:57 pm

I got that. But how could you add that to the PE?

If you expand the audio and video and create an L or J cut you still get a two up when you play with the edit point. What would the PE add to the package and how should it get displayed?

When I open the PE after editing a J cut, I get sections of the now collapsed audio that look blacked/greyed out but the overlapped (L or J) audio will still play. So do you use the PE for visual edit points and then expand the audio and create your L or J?

I don't get that blacked out look. It looks like it is disabled but its not, its a handle and seeing the waveform of this audio handle is even more confusing. Underneath it is the other clips audio. This is where trackless as designed is not as good. Unless I'm missing something. If the audio is collapsed (attached) to a visual its very obvious that it's a L or J cut. Why black out that portion? Maybe a colored bar across the audio section would make it more obvious.

In any case, how would you beef up the PE by adding the ability to edit audio as well.

L cut:



collapsed L cut:


L cut in PE


Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 27, 2015 at 10:53:45 pm

[Craig Alan] "I got that. But how could you add that to the PE?"

Well, I personally think it's a less useful piece of eye candy designed to demo the software. I never use it and wish there was a two-up view when you trim via the keyboard.

In addition, I think the way split edits are implemented is a very slow way of working, unless you want dialogue overlaps, which I usually don't. For example, you can't work with split-edits in the chicklet view. You can't work with split-edits unless you expand audio using one of the other views. So, if you typically work with small timeline "tracks" (the chicklet view), then it takes 2 steps before you can even perform a split edit.

That being said, I think you could simply extend the audio and/or video portions of the A or B side within the existing paradigm for the PE. Possibly requiring a modifier key.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 28, 2015 at 5:30:35 am

Thanks Oliver. Thought I was just not getting it. Always feels like a a tug of war and too many steps to get the result of a very common need - a simple split edit. I do like seeing the available handles on either side of an edit point but the audio feels like an afterthought in the way the program was designed from not having a keyboard shortcut that brings up an audio-centric interface, the little audio space you get in the inspector to see all available tracks, the half baked version of timeline tracks for audio. I do like the connection points when adding an audio clip.

I thought you were looking for a particular feature to be added in the PE.

Like I said, I really just use it to see the handles and then go back to .... non precision?

[Oliver Peters] "wish there was a two-up view when you trim via the keyboard"

Yes that would be great. Seems like a bug that it displays 2-up but not when using the keyboard.

Can't imagine that was deliberate.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 28, 2015 at 3:35:43 pm

[Craig Alan] "Like I said, I really just use it to see the handles and then go back to .... non precision?"

You can actually use clip skimming (separate from timeline skimming) to view clip handles frame by frame.

Clip skim to the end of a clip, then use the arrows to move frame by frame. You will see the clip skimmer move beyond the boundary of the range out in the timeline. Add shift to the arrows and you move 10 frames at a time.

Looks like this (works on any clip anywhere, not just primary):



As far as the precision editor, I do think it helps to visualize how trimming works in FCPX, but once it;s understood, it seems unnecessary. I would much prefer the two-up (or more) view with kb trimming.


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 31, 2015 at 11:54:54 pm

Jeremy, I played with this but don't yet find it useful. Can't see the handles, don't see 2-up. And maybe you can help with this ... If I use red clip skimmer to go to a frame in the handle, how do I set the new out point? I can move the edit point using the comma period keys dragging it to the red skimmer but this is kind tedious.

It does seem to have some potential in that I can move over an adjacent clip but view the handle instead. But it seems like about 1/3 of the visual references that I need.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 5:32:27 pm

[Craig Alan] "If I use red clip skimmer to go to a frame in the handle, how do I set the new out point?"

I'm assuming you mean when in the PE? Simple click on the frame? Or good ol' ⇧X?

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 10:26:06 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "'m assuming you mean when in the PE?"

I meant the clip skimmer, not PE. And shift x does work.

When I tested it maybe i had gone past the handle thus it did not respond. Again if they would add two-up while using the keyboard it would be helpful.

It doesn't seem like anyone here finds the PE useful or needed anyway (I like seeing the handles and it's a quick keyboard shortcut on and off to take a quick look). But I'm not a skilled touch type editor. Though I do like keyboard commands over mousing.

So what I'd like to know is the most efficient way to create split edits?
Possibilities: expand audio/video (select adjacent clips, control-s), use shift brackets, arrow keys, and shift x to set the audio I and O but 2 up is not displayed. Create a split edit by expanding audio/video of adjacent clips and then using the trim tool/mouse to do a roll edit of the audio only. Although now the two up display shows up in the viewer, it doesn't display the visual.

So what I find myself doing is playing the video, setting a marker where i want the split edit to be and then expanding both clip's audio/video and then using the mouse and trim tool to roll edit the audio to the marker.

Or I can skim to the point where I want the split edit and shift x

It really should be a simple command, no? Select two adjacent clips, audio could be expanded or not. With the skimmer or playhead where you want the split edit to be, press a command for a split edit. Done. Why not?

I'm asking not telling even though this is the debate forum.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 10:51:45 pm

[Craig Alan] "I'm not a skilled touch type editor. Though I do like keyboard commands over mousing. "

The one kind of requires the other, no?? :D


[Craig Alan] "… but 2 up is not displayed."

Yet another something I personally have never missed or used (neither in X nor legacy). Especially when editing audio, I'm not exactly sure what the point would be either. So I'm probably the wrong person to ask.


[Craig Alan] "Create a split edit by expanding audio/video"

There is no need to explicitly expand the clip first. Simply hitting the aforementioned shortcut(s) will do that for you.


[Craig Alan] "So what I find myself doing is playing the video, setting a marker where i want the split edit to be and then expanding both clip's audio/video and then using the mouse and trim tool to roll edit the audio to the marker."

Clearly something you will not need to do ever again.


[Craig Alan] "Or I can skim to the point where I want the split edit and shift x "

Bingo. ⇧+] or [ and ⇧X. Done.


[Craig Alan] "It really should be a simple command, no? Select two adjacent clips, audio could be expanded or not. With the skimmer or playhead where you want the split edit to be, press a command for a split edit. Done."

Exactly.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:26:01 am

[Robin S. Kurz] "[Craig Alan] "I'm not a skilled touch type editor. Though I do like keyboard commands over mousing. "

The one kind of requires the other, no?? :D"


Not exactly. I worked in house as a writer at a couple of major production studios. When I went in the edit bays, the pros there could touch type basically anything that was in their heads or the director asked them to do. Just cause I prefer hen pecking at the keyboard doesn't mean I'm anywhere near that level. Touch typing implies typing without looking.

[Robin S. Kurz] "There is no need to explicitly expand the clip first. Simply hitting the aforementioned shortcut(s) will do that for you."

Well step one is expanding the audio. The fastest way to select adjacent clips requires the mouse - either rope em or shift click em. Or if there is a keyboard way to select two adjacent clips I'm all ears. Arrow keys & C will select one clip.


[Robin S. Kurz] "[Craig Alan] "It really should be a simple command, no? Select two adjacent clips, audio could be expanded or not. With the skimmer or playhead where you want the split edit to be, press a command for a split edit. Done."

Exactly."


Not exactly. They need to be expanded first AFAIK. So that's six strokes to expand audio for two clips. Or one mouse stroke and one keyboard stroke - way better.
Then two strokes to set the bracket at any edit point on the expanded video/audio and another two or more to select the edit point of choice. Then navigate and set your split edit. Then repeat to collapse both clips.

What I'm suggesting is placing your playhead anywhere in the timeline and use a keyboard shortcut that creates a split edit by extending either the audio from the clip before or the clip after without needing to expand first.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:35:52 am

[Craig Alan] "keyboard shortcut that creates a split edit by extending either the audio from the clip before or the clip after without needing to expand first.
"


There is (was) a developer that made a set of tools based on Apple services. These were a set of macros that included shortcuts for split edits in all 4 directions. This did exactly what you are asking for.

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:48:16 am

[Craig Alan] "Not exactly. They need to be expanded first AFAIK."

I'm not sure if you're not reading (and trying) what I've written, or if I'm completely misunderstanding what it is you're looking for.

Once again: ⇧] or [ EXPANDS the clip and selects the respective AUDIO edit point. Move skimmer. Hit ⇧X. Done.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 1:45:04 am

I'm trying.

With ⇧] or [ - sometimes it sticks but usually I have to use the arrow keys to plant the playhead on the edit point first or apply just ] or [ (video) and then ⇧] or [ to get it to drop to audio.

Then if it does stick that's only one of the two clips. And if I apply a J cut or an L cut the audio I am trying to make inactive needs to be trimmed or the L and J won't apply. The only way I see to end with a L or J cut is to be in trim mode. Then it trims as it extends.



So what would be the least amount of strokes to get to this point?
So far it's easier to select both clips control s T click on the edit point navigate to the desired edit point and shift X. equal parts mousing & keyboard.

Not trying to argue. Would love to be wrong.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 1:58:19 am

https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/335/86485

Don't know what to give you beyond that. Here they "stick" every time.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:55:12 am

And then there's always the Command editor...



- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 2:28:52 am

Ok thanks:

Up or down arrow to navigate to edit point (otherwise it does not stick ... at least on my rig)



navigate to new edit point

⇧X.

Done.

Get it Got it Good.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 8:07:15 pm

[Craig Alan] "Jeremy, I played with this but don't yet find it useful. "

Yeah, I don't know if it's very useful. I just said it was possible! :)

It is useful if you want to see beyond the edge of a clip in the timeline without going in to another moe or match framing.

The video is viewable in the Viewer.

[Craig Alan] " If I use red clip skimmer to go to a frame in the handle, how do I set the new out point? I can move the edit point using the comma period keys dragging it to the red skimmer but this is kind tedious. "

I think you covered this, but shift X will extend the selected edit point, but it audio, video, or both.


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 10:13:59 pm

Thanks Jeremy

Yeah I get it now. But I do like seeing both handles to determine what my options are. Each project is different though so you never know if this might come in handy. Not sure why shift X wasn't working for me the first few times I tried it but maybe I was passed the handles or just need to be parked on the edit point.

But yeah I'm really pleased with the \ for video and shift \ for audio command to set up trimming at an edit point. and shift x to set new edit point ... very cool.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 10:30:21 pm

Colon and apostrophe (US keyboard) also move the playhead to the next/previous edit point, so you don't have to move very far to make this really fast with practice.

Apostrophe to edit point, Shift ] to select right audio edge (and expand on the same command) and then comma or period to move the audio edge by one frame, add shift to move by 10 frames, or skim and hit shift-x to extend the edit.


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 7:02:35 pm
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jan 3, 2016 at 7:06:53 pm

[Oliver Peters] "For example, you can't work with split-edits in the chicklet view. You can't work with split-edits unless you expand audio using one of the other views. So, if you typically work with small timeline "tracks" (the chicklet view), then it takes 2 steps before you can even perform a split edit."

I personally find that display mode rather counter intuitive (i.e. Avid-like) and never use it, so it's not an issue I've ever run into. Never even occurred to me that you couldn't expand the audio in that case. :D

But even if, for whatever reason, I wanted/needed that tiny size for editing, I'd use one of the first three display options and simply move the clip height slider all the way to the left. Done.



I'm fairly sure the few vertical pixels more wouldn't exactly bother me much. But maybe that's just me.

Either way I simply use the shift-bracket shortcuts for a quick audio edit-point selection and extend the edit as needed. Very quick, very easy.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 8:01:34 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "I personally find that display mode rather counter intuitive (i.e. Avid-like) and never use it, so it's not an issue I've ever run into. Never even occurred to me that you couldn't expand the audio in that case. :D"

Depending on the machine and the size of the project/timeline, it can affect performance. This view is the least impactful on overall performance.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 8:43:37 pm

[Oliver Peters] "Depending on the machine and the size of the project/timeline, it can affect performance."

Currently editing a(n optimized, of course) 5K RED, 2x2 hour project off a TBo RAID on an older MBP and can't say I'm in any way disappointed by the performance. Quite the opposite actually. YMMV, sure.

Would e.g. scrolling be a little faster here or there with the "chicklet" option? Probably. But it would also drive me absolutely nuts to not know what I'm on in the timeline at a glance and slow me down considerably more, without question. No idea why anyone (not stuck in the 90's) would prefer working that way. I couldn't even understand it with legacy FCP where you at least had ONE thumbnail which was well worth the (actual) slow down for me. Getting entire filmstrips with no performance hit worth mentioning are a huge boon for me, if not a dream come true. Especially when doing things like slides... brilliant.

Something you wouldn't even want to consider with most (all?) other NLEs, I know. Oh well.

But hey... to each his own as they say.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 8:55:55 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "But it would also drive me absolutely nuts to not know what I'm on in the timeline at a glance and slow me down considerably more, "

And the other views really tell you that? They don't for me, because it's not really an accurate frame-by-frame representation. For editing waveforms, yes, but for picture, it doesn't seem necessary for a lot of folks. But that's all a matter of choice. The issue is that Apple has chosen to restrict certain functions of the timeline in that view for no reason that's been explained.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 10:42:02 pm

[Oliver Peters] "because it's not really an accurate frame-by-frame representation."

Erm... no. Of course not. [insert pejorative "duh!" here] I would have thought that's pretty much a given. I was never talking about nor did I mean frame accurate. It's just about simply IDENTIFYING any given clip in my project at a glance, as I already wrote.

Unless of course you memorize what "MVI0385xyz" in any given project contains without any reference (chicklet) whatsoever. Because I don't know how you do it, but if I'm looking for a specific spot, let alone clip, I can identify it immediately—as in the timeframe of milliseconds—by its filmstrip. If you want to scroll, skim, scrub around aimlessly instead until you find what you're looking for (the only alternative I can think of and personally am left with, if working in that mode), great. Anything but efficient in my book i.e. in the context of my workflow, which is why there is no logical reason for me to use it. And since, as I pointed out, using filmstrips (of whatever size) has no relevant effect on the performance, I don't see what possible disadvantage as opposed to advantage it could otherwise have. But I'm assuming you can enlighten me? :)


[Oliver Peters] "… it doesn't seem necessary for a lot of folks. But that's all a matter of choice."

I believe that was my conclusion also, yes.


[Oliver Peters] "The issue is that Apple has chosen to restrict certain functions of the timeline in that view for no reason that's been explained."

Aha. So there's also some sort of major, unacceptable disadvantage to doing it as I described and demonstrated above, that I'm also unable to recognize?? I'm quite curious. Because sorry, but if someone's machine can't work without some major performance hit in THAT setting either (from what I gather your only argument against using anything other option than "chicklet"?), then I'd say FCP or what horrible restrictions Apple has put on FCP's options, are the very least of their worries. Seriously. In which case, yes, I guess FCP X clearly isn't their best choice either. Oh well.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 10:50:56 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "So there's also some sort of major, unacceptable disadvantage to doing it as I described and demonstrated above, that I'm also unable to recognize?? I'm quite curious"

You can use whatever mode works best for you. No problem there. You are missing the point that Apple has chosen to restrict the functions among the various timeline views and that affects how you edit when trying to do split edits. It's not a matter of whether your way works or not. That isn't the point. If I can expand audio in one view, why not the other?

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:08:16 am
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jan 4, 2016 at 1:33:44 am

[Oliver Peters] "You are missing the point that Apple has chosen to restrict the functions among the various timeline views and that affects how you edit when trying to do split edits."

I'm sorry... among various timeline views?? So now you can't expand the audio in various timeline views?

Actually, I got it the first time around. I guess I was just trying to give you that last little benefit of the doubt.

Sorry if I can't get myself to consider functionality not being available in one of six (mind you, not two, not three, no… SIX) possible options as some sort of "restriction" worth wasting this kind of time on. Wow.

Especially in light of the fact—for the third time—that you can have the best of both your worlds with near zero effort as I described above, and you once again chose to avoid pointing to how that is not a solution to the "problem". I won't bother speculating as to why, nor do I actually even care anymore at this point.

Certainly none of the aforementioned doubt remains. Cheers.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:19:52 am

[Robin S. Kurz] "I'm sorry... among various timeline views?? So now you can't expand the audio in various timeline views?
Actually, I got it the first time around. I guess I was just trying to give you that last little scrap benefit of the doubt.
"


Are you incapable of engaging in a civil discussion? Why is it that your attitude is always confrontational?

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 12:43:36 am
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jan 4, 2016 at 1:47:58 am

Why are you able to quote, but not answer (one of many) simple questions?

- RK


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Steve Connor
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 7:23:04 am

[Oliver Peters] "Are you incapable of engaging in a civil discussion? Why is it that your attitude is always confrontational?"

Time to hit the imaginary "ignore" button?


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James Ewart
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 9:38:22 am

[Steve Connor] "[Oliver Peters] "Are you incapable of engaging in a civil discussion? Why is it that your attitude is always confrontational?"

Time to hit the imaginary "ignore" button?"


Yup


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Tim Wilson
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 3:55:06 pm

[James Ewart] "
Time to hit the imaginary "ignore" button?"

Yup"


There is in fact an ACTUAL ignore button.

Click on the link for a member's name, which takes you to their profile page.

Below their picture on that page, you will see links offering you the option to Friend/Subscribe to their posts, or Ignore them.

Note that the members you "Friend" will appear on your profile page. If you would prefer to be notified of their new posts without publicly friending, you can do that too, in a tab along the top of their profile page.

Note too that you can subscribe to somebody's posts without being logged in, but to ignore somebody, you DO need to be logged in. That's because a subscription notification is email-based of course, and stored on our server, whereas the "ignore" request is specific to your own private forum settings and preferences.

I confess that I've not exactly finished building out the member profile feature set, and will be happy to take suggestions. Drop me a note offline if you have any ideas.


....but the Ignore button works quite well, I assure you. :-)


Regards,

Tim Wilson
Editor-in-Chief
Creative COW


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Steve Connor
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 4:18:29 pm

[Tim Wilson] "I confess that I've not exactly finished building out the member profile feature set, and will be happy to take suggestions. Drop me a note offline if you have any ideas.

"


My suggestion is that you give yourself a hearty pat on the back for adding in such useful features :)


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Steve Connor
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 3, 2016 at 10:59:09 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "Because sorry, but if someone's machine can't work without some major performance hit in THAT setting either (from what I gather your only argument against using anything other option than "chicklet"?), then I'd say FCP or what horrible restrictions Apple has put on FCP's options, are the very least of their worries. Seriously. In which case, yes, I guess FCP X clearly isn't their best choice either. Oh well."

It's lovely that you don't get ANY performance hits, but a lot of people like myself and Oliver DO, are you saying FCPX isn't the best choice for us?

Because I get ZERO performance hit when I use filmstrips and waveforms in PPro, which suggests it's an FCPX issue


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 1:23:46 am
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jan 4, 2016 at 1:40:18 am

[Steve Connor] "It's lovely that you don't get ANY performance hits"

Feel free to quote the part where I said anything even close to not having "ANY performance hits".

And... "Are you incapable of engaging in a civil discussion? Why is it that your attitude is always confrontational?"

- RK


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Steve Connor
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 6:56:39 am

[Robin S. Kurz] "Feel free to quote the part where I said anything even close to not having "ANY performance hits".

And... "Are you incapable of engaging in a civil discussion? Why is it that your attitude is always confrontational?"

- RK"


Shame, you have so much to contribute


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 4, 2016 at 10:11:04 am
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jan 4, 2016 at 10:25:44 am

So I guess that means no quote? Just a jump on the ol' evasion bandwagon. Gotcha. Disingenuously trying to turn the tables (i.e. believing to) seems to be a rather common practice. Shame, yes.

But I'm glad you could at least garner some calls from the back corner of the room to feel exculpated. :D


[Steve Connor] "Time to hit the imaginary "ignore" button?"

Yes. Please. Thanks.


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 5, 2016 at 2:18:27 pm

[Robin S. Kurz] "I wanted/needed that tiny size for editing, I'd use one of the first three display options and simply move the clip height slider all the way to the left."

I use "chicklet" view often. But I would really like the ability to re-size the clips in this view like all the other views. Am i missing something?

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Steve Connor
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 5, 2016 at 5:14:48 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "I use "chicklet" view often. But I would really like the ability to re-size the clips in this view like all the other views. Am i missing something?
"


No - you're using it wrong :)


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 5, 2016 at 5:26:07 pm

I use chiclet as well, especially when reviewing 30 min shows with clients.

I also have setup kb shortcuts for direct selecting all the clip appearance options, as well as cycling the options. (Control-option 1-6 to choose specific views, and control-option up/down arrow to cycle).

Very helpful and fast to get from one view to the next.


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 5, 2016 at 10:02:47 pm

Jeremy,
great idea to be able to toggle between the appearance views.
When you are in chicklet view how do you identify what clip you are looking at?
Have you given each clip a unique name? It would have to be short if squeezed into visible portion of timeline.

It would be kinda cool to have some auto naming of clips in the timeline as an option like 1V 2V for visual clip # 1 and 2 - not replacing any other name or keyword but just as a way you could say hey could you cut 5V or move 5V after 8V. Thus making it easier to talk to clients/collaborators about a particular clip? You know without folks pointing at the timeline and trying to turn the monitor into a pad.

As far as seeing the whole timeline, shift-z does a nice job. The only advantage I see to chicklet view is displaying just names?

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 5, 2016 at 10:29:21 pm

[Craig Alan] "When you are in chicklet view how do you identify what clip you are looking at?
Have you given each clip a unique name? It would have to be short if squeezed into visible portion of timeline. "


As you can see, when viewing all ~30 mins, you can't see much of file names on either view (the naming is set to Roles here).

Here's the typical picon and waveform view:



And the same in chiclet view:



If I ever need a filename, I can either match frame back to the original, or select the file, and get it from the info tab of the inspector, or open the timeline index.

This timeline has 1100 times in it. Finding a clip with a client is going to be a modicum of pointing and saying "right there". Selecting clips with the 'c' key also makes this easy.

The timeline index also makes it easy to jump around in time. If you are working with collaborators in FCPX (like other editors/artists) ToDo markers are very handy as you can scroll through the list and jump right to the marker from the list.

The advantage to chiclet view is to allow very large timelines to be viewed on one screen as well as to get rid of the performance slow downs of picons and waveforms. I can easily hit a keyboard command to bring them back and work with them if need be. Again, I usually use chiclet view on long timelines with clients in the room, otherwise, I am in some sort of waveform view.


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 6, 2016 at 11:50:26 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "The advantage to chiclet view is to allow very large timelines to be viewed on one screen as well as to get rid of the performance slow downs of picons and waveforms"

Exactly. I was tagging spots for various locations around the country yesterday and chicklet view is perfect for that. The base spot itself is 'locked' so there is no need for thumbnails and the various end cards have unique names. Much cleaner timeline and a bit better performance. I just want to have to ability to size the 'chicklets' like you can in any other view mode (meaning adjust the clip height with that slider).

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 6, 2016 at 12:38:29 pm
Last Edited By Robin S. Kurz on Jan 6, 2016 at 12:41:55 pm

[Scott Witthaus] " I just want to have to ability to size the 'chicklets' like you can in any other view mode (meaning adjust the clip height with that slider)."

Hmmm... but doesn't that pretty much defeat the purpose of that display-mode? I'm also not clear on what you would stand to gain without thumbnails and/or waveforms showing, since that's all that is affected by the scaling. But again, then why not simply use one of the first three modes as described above? And if thumbnails and waveforms are actually that much of an issue, simply collapse everything in the roles panel in addition (⌘clicking one collapses/uncollapses all at once btw)... bingo, best of all the above worlds and you can even use all five of the other options for varying results or "customization", no?

Have still yet to hear how or why that isn't a solution to the "problem"... but I'm fairly sure I know why. ;)

And I just showed a class the PE the other day btw, for fine-tuning their roughs and they absolutely loved it. Having the handles visible directly in context was extremely helpful for them. One even asked why PPro didn't have something like that. And even if I might not use it every day myself, when I do, I love that it's an option and a very unique and useful one at that imho. But an optional two-up while skimming the handles would be nice, yes. Whereby I don't see how it qualifies as "eye-candy" either, since you don't even SEE it unless you're using it. And if you don't use it, why should one care if it's there or not? Or is just anything I don't need or use automatically eye-candy on principle? :D

I've also heard many calls for the PE in secondaries (which I would second), so it's being used and appreciated by many apparently.

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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Robin S. Kurz
Re: Precision Editor
on Jan 5, 2016 at 5:34:57 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "But I would really like the ability to re-size the clips in this view like all the other views. Am i missing something?"

Apparently the first three display options, yes. ;)

- RK

____________________________________________________
Deutsch? Hier gibt es ein umfassendes FCP X Training für dich!


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James Ewart
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 28, 2015 at 2:00:45 pm

I don't use it nearly as much as I did the equivalent (what was it called?) in Legacy.


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Craig Alan
Re: Precision Editor
on Dec 28, 2015 at 3:36:04 pm

Tracks?

I must say that it was a bit tricky in legacy as well. And maybe full time editors got past it but lots of times audio would get out of sync. I do like having connection points. But maybe that's just training wheels.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


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