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FCP X Design Influences

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Oliver Peters
FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 12:53:33 pm

Fodder to lead into the weekend with... Regardless of whether you like or don't like FCP X, it seems undeniable that its design has greatly influenced other software interfaces. These examples specifically come to mind. Resolve is very close to the X layout in a track-based interface. Sony's Catalyst products seem to have been designed to be hand-in-glove with FCP X. Even Premiere Pro CC 2015 has picked up some of this aesthetic with the introduction of the Lumetri Color Panel (controls on the right, scopes on the left). What are your thoughts?

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Eric Santiago
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 1:29:05 pm

Agreed and hopefully Apple will let us break it up across multiple screens :)


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 1:50:34 pm

[Eric Santiago] "hopefully Apple will let us break it up across multiple screens"

I typically work in dual-display situations and have set up some layouts that work well for me, which I've posted about before. One thing I've done is map a number of the window on/off functions across the function keys. Even though some of these already exist in the defaults, I still find workspace switching is faster with the F keys. It quickly allows me to put the viewer on the left or right screen, open scopes or the inspector, and so on. While a custom docking set-up would still be preferable, I'm pretty happy with the way this now works for me.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Paul Neumann
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 2:14:19 pm

I use HP workstations right now (day gig) and Camtasia 8.6 is the most FCPX-like feel I've ever experienced outside of Mac. That rubbery/fluid timeline thing in full effect.

I don't use Camtasia for Mac, but would reckon it's the same. Very familiar feel and look.


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Craig Shields
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 3:23:48 pm

[Oliver Peters] "Even Premiere Pro CC 2015 has picked up some of this aesthetic with the introduction of the Lumetri Color Panel (controls on the right, scopes on the left)."

Wasn't Lightroom already doing this?



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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 4:02:37 pm

I know it's not from FCP X itself, but Apple's flat UI design has certainly creeped into other applications for better or for worse (more worse than better IMO).


-Andrew


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 6:28:10 pm

[Andrew Kimery] "but Apple's flat UI design has certainly creeped into other applications"

I don't know if that's Apple or just the current flavor among designers in general.
What a fickle buch ;-)

You see flatness all over. For example, starting with Windows 8, MS went that direction. Just like website design. Everyone has decided to jump on the HTML5 vertical-scrolling-page bandwagon. You get that in Muse, but it's like all of a sudden that's the only way a site should look.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Bret Williams
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 12:16:40 am

Android started with the flat, then iOS then X. But X hasn't been given much of a flat look. Resolve 11 looked a lot more like X than 12. 12 has taken the good and made it better. Although not completely custom, they manage the spaces better than X.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 3:22:44 am

I know Apple didn't start the Flat Train but the bandwagoning didn't seem to start until after Apple started going flat so I feel fine blaming them for the popularity of this UI trend. ;)


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David Mathis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 9:09:20 pm

I am seeing a bit of this in Fusion, remaining neutral in my opinion.


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Dennis Radeke
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 9:52:04 pm
Last Edited By Dennis Radeke on Oct 8, 2015 at 9:55:07 pm

[Craig Shields] "Wasn't Lightroom already doing this?"

Yes, Lightroom was the first Adobe application to show a newer interface which included workspaces on the top (library, develop, etc.) and a progressively revealing/deep aspects to manipulating your image. In Premiere Pro, we call this feature 'stacked panels'. As a side note, we've taken the idea of stacked panels and made it a new customizing option for most panels in Premiere Pro.

Lightroom came out in 2007 so predates FCPX by quite a large margin.

I will be very forthright in saying that my bias for Adobe's general UI design is pretty high, so feel free to disagree, but I don't really see any UI influence from FCPX in this case.

Dennis - Adobe guy

PS - I launched FCPX to make sure I hadn't missed anything (you'll point out if I did) and it made me touch the keyframe editor...


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Bret Williams
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 12:14:17 am

The X interface feels like it's directly derived from Aperture, and before that iPhoto. FCP legacy and DVD Studio Pro seemed like the only two apps in Apple's lineup that kept that odd tiny font, tiny bezel look.


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David Lawrence
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 2:56:28 am

[Dennis Radeke] "PS - I launched FCPX to make sure I hadn't missed anything (you'll point out if I did) and it made me touch the keyframe editor..."

Careful Dennis, touch the FCPX keyframe editor and this might happen ;)






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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 12:25:31 pm

[Dennis Radeke] "and it made me touch the keyframe editor..."

my sympathies dennis. That must have been... difficult. I find a strong cup of tea and staring out the window afterwards for five to ten minutes helps.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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James Ewart
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 4:24:18 pm

I think if I were Dennis I would find it much more galling to have to be a monthly or annual subscription to keep tabs on the competition.


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David Mathis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 9:13:11 pm

Oliver,

Resolve feels like a combination of FCP X, general UI; a bit of Avid due to tracks; and a little bit of Smoke, due to OFX being added into the nodes. Only downside with Resolve is the need to render OFX and transitions, otherwise a step in the right direction. Of course, that could be another topic. My two cents, whatever it is worth.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 8, 2015 at 11:01:36 pm

[David Mathis] "Resolve feels like a combination of FCP X, general UI; a bit of Avid due to tracks; and a little bit of Smok"

It feels to me like R11 was more like FCPX in appearance. Then with R12, they've come up with their own style. Possibly a foreshadowing of where FCP X could go with a flatter look. ;-)

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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David Cherniack
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 3:01:43 am

[Oliver Peters] "Lumetri Color Panel (controls on the right, scopes on the left)."

Actually the Lumetri Color and Scopes panels are like all Premiere panels, movable and dockable.

I use 3 screens for documentary work. One monitor is full screen with of panel of docked bins with hover scrubable picons. I can't imagine editing with less screen real estate.

David
http://AllinOneFilms.com


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Don Walker
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 1:23:43 pm

[David Cherniack] "I use 3 screens for documentary work. One monitor is full screen with of panel of docked bins with hover scrubable picons. I can't imagine editing with less screen real estate."

When using Premiere, I really want to be in a 2 screen layout. In FCPX, (where I spend 90% of my time) I feel most comfortable on my 27" iMac in a single screen environment. In fact when I edit at home (2008 Mac Pro with (2) 20" Apple monitors), I think that FCPX is awkward, on 2 screens.

don walker
texarkana, texas

John 3:16


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David Cherniack
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 9, 2015 at 1:34:49 pm

[Don Walker] " In FCPX, (where I spend 90% of my time) I feel most comfortable on my 27" iMac in a single screen environment. In fact when I edit at home (2008 Mac Pro with (2) 20" Apple monitors), I think that FCPX is awkward, on 2 screens."

It's clear they optimized their design for a single screen. But I think having selected bins on a tabbed panel that's full screen is always going to be more efficient, at least for my use.

David
http://AllinOneFilms.com


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Bret Williams
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 12:02:21 pm

Ditto. Maybe it's 20 years of editing on 2 screens but I can barely surf the web on 1 screen now. I keep the left screen for the library. And I don't like the single viewer either. I keep the event viewer open pretty much at all times. When you're using two screens there's just wasted real estate if you don't, unless you pop open the waveform/vector, but that decreases performance a bit.

I think the single screen mode is great if you're having to edit on a laptop though.


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Tim Wilson
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 3:25:40 pm
Last Edited By Tim Wilson on Oct 10, 2015 at 3:27:09 pm

[Bret Williams] "I think the single screen mode is great if you're having to edit on a laptop though.
"


Since we're talking about design influences, this has to be near the top of the list.

Because it's the COW, we tend to talk more about things like multiple monitors and towers and such, but Apple has always pressed the advantages of FCP for laptops. As well they should. Both the 13" laptop and the iMac are their bestselling form factors, of course.

The emphasis on laptop editing goes back to the very beginning, where the first advertising images of FCP were with a laptop and a DV camera. That was ALWAYS the point, that you DON'T need heavy iron.

(Worth remembering: Steve bought Final Cut to run on as a consumer app on iMacs when Adobe refused to sell him Premiere! The rest has been a happy bonus.)

Apple's laptop-focused imagery continues into FCPX, where, as you point out, Bret, it may be even more germane today. When Apple wants to underscore the intimate connection between FCPX works and Alexa, what's the picture they use? A laptop.




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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 4:06:21 pm

[Tim Wilson] "Because it's the COW, we tend to talk more about things like multiple monitors and towers and such, but Apple has always pressed the advantages of FCP for laptops. As well they should. Both the 13" laptop and the iMac are their bestselling form factors, of course."

I wonder if a number of folks on the pro side of things are now "over" the initial enthusiasm of the FCPX design. Things like dual screens and dual viewers are for many just simply a better way to work. Are many - who are otherwise happy with X - still wishing that Apple would adopt some of the more widely accepted conventions?

When Apple revived dual viewers in FCPX, they really took an kluge approach. They didn't really do dual viewers at all, but simply split the existing source/timeline toggle of the unified viewer in two. You have none of the functionality of a source viewer that you do in any other NLE.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Tim Wilson
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 4:23:53 pm

[Oliver Peters] "I wonder if a number of folks on the pro side of things are now "over" the initial enthusiasm of the FCPX design. Things like dual screens and dual viewers are for many just simply a better way to work."

I wonder every bit as much about the opposite: are there people who've lived the 2-monitor life who've now switched to single monitors because FCPX works better there (even though it obviously works well enough on 2).

I found Don's observation on this count very interesting:


[Don Walker] "When using Premiere, I really want to be in a 2 screen layout. In FCPX, (where I spend 90% of my time) I feel most comfortable on my 27" iMac in a single screen environment. "

That makes sense. Premiere can work on one monitor, but may be better on 2. FCPX can work on 2 monitors, but may be better on one.

I'll leave this part of the debate to the folks like you and Don who are actually using both (unlike, say, me, who uses neither LOL), but the sly part of me can't help thinking that this is the heart of The Apple Way. "US adapt to how YOU want to do things? Silly boy. Here's how YOU will adapt to how WE want you to do things."

Again noting that the 2-screen approach that so many people used so productively was a detour in FCP/X's original, and now-restored, vision as a unified, 1-screen experience.

This is really another aspect of Apple's intent from the beginning to emphasize laptops as the primary ideal environment for FCP I just mentioned. In that context, I was talking about the liberation from heavy iron as a CPU thing, but its just as much about making liberation from multiple monitors an explicit design goal.

Looping back to Don's experience as an example of using tools most effectively in the contexts that each was designed for....and in the case of FCPX, designing it SO thoroughly for one monitor that it can be kind of annoying on two. The application TELLS you that it was designed for one monitor.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 4:46:42 pm

[Tim Wilson] "That makes sense. Premiere can work on one monitor, but may be better on 2. FCPX can work on 2 monitors, but may be better on one. "

I find that neither and both statements are true. On both NLEs I have workspaces/layouts that are both single and dual screen configurations based on the task at hand. I frequently switch among multiple layouts - both single and dual screen in the course of a day. This is even more true with the default workspaces that Adobe set up in PProCC2015. The Assembly workspace is very much like the FCPX single-screen design.

[Tim Wilson] " but the sly part of me can't help thinking that this is the heart of The Apple Way. "US adapt to how YOU want to do things? Silly boy. Here's how YOU will adapt to how WE want you to do things.""

Of course. That's the essence of Apple.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Tim Wilson
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 5:34:49 pm

[Oliver Peters] "I find that neither and both statements are true."

If you see anything I say that is ONLY true, assume that my account has been hacked or that I have been possessed by pods from outer space. LOL


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 11, 2015 at 7:34:53 pm

I spent 11 years at a fixed desk in an office. I had everything arranged perfectly. Program and Preview monitors, scopes, audio mixer to the left. Big CD Buyout library to the right. Hang up cork board to the left of the mixer for storyboards if I needed to reference visuals. It was my bespoke editing space. Probably about 10 x12 so 120 sq ft. Then came X. Program, preview, scopes And audio PLUS the cork board are all-on screen. (Addressing the corkboard, I import the agency storyboard frames into the Project as stills - keyword them as "storyboard" - and a click brings it into the browser. Bye, bye 4x 5 foot of needed wall space.)
CDs are gone, replaced by downloads.
I have my MacBook Pro - one portable drive - and an external ASUS USB 3 widescreen external monitor in my briefcase, but only pull it out for client sessions.
In the past week, I've edited parts of the same gig on a living room table, A coffee shop table, In my car (quick change and client upload) and on a 4 foot segment of my old desk area - but unlike in the past, I didn't use ANY of the rest of the physical space I used to depend on. So why pay for it? It's a big reason I just did a studio clearance sale and shed most of my gear.
The team for this video stretches from Florida to Phoenix to San Diego - literally spanning the US - and there's nothing regarding workspace or infrastructure that I still need from my studio space to effectively get my work done.
As a preference, studios are fine. They are just no longer a necessity to do my kind of work. And modern laptop editing is at the core of this. YMMV

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Steve Connor
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 11, 2015 at 7:46:28 pm

[Bill Davis] "As a preference, studios are fine. They are just no longer a necessity to do my kind of work. And modern laptop editing is at the core of this. YMMV
"


Mobility is great and I love the flexibility of being able to edit anywhere, but I still love my 2 x 23" cinema displays, studio monitor and reference speakers in the office.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 11, 2015 at 7:56:41 pm

[Bill Davis] "Addressing the corkboard, I import the agency storyboard frames into the Project as stills - keyword them as "storyboard" - and a click brings it into the browser. Bye, bye 4x 5 foot of needed wall space."

One feature Apple could stand to add - but NEVER will - is third-party dockable panels into the UI. There's a nice one for Premiere Pro called PDFviewer that let's you import and view any PDF document within Premiere Pro's interface.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Tim Wilson
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 12:13:28 am

[Oliver Peters] "One feature Apple could stand to add - but NEVER will - is third-party..."

Apple: "Third party? Like, as in the Green Party for politics, or like, the party that starts after the After Hours party for partying? Because those are the only possible meanings of the words 'third party' that we're aware of."


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Gabe Strong
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:31:10 am

Bill,
I'm just wondering about 1 thing. When editing on a laptop, how do
you separate the OS drive from media drive? Most people I know
(and myself) do this with an external drive as the media drive. Which
works fine when I'm at a table or desk, but if I'm going to be at a desk,
I might as well just be in my normal edit bay with my desktop.
If I'm editing while kicking back on the couch, or on the road on a hotel bed
or in an airplane, the external drive tends to want to come loose if
I move, and that short little cord connecting it just can drive me crazy.
Is there a better way?

Gabe Strong
G-Force Productions
http://www.gforcevideo.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 3:12:39 pm
Last Edited By Bill Davis on Oct 12, 2015 at 3:55:03 pm

Gabe.
I generally work on convention projection content and seldom have extremely large projects where the Proxy media that I'd need to have "live" online would exceed the capabilities of my laptop storage - but for long form editors, I can see how it can be an issue.

I have a internal 1 gig SSD in my new MacBook - after system overhead it leaves me about 400 gigs for a "current project" - and that's a LOT of proxy footage. Since I didn't do that much long form - its been ample for me. So I can work most of the time without an external drive. (I just move the correct sparse disk media bundle to the SSD from my 2tb USB 3 drive launch it and go to work. Since the bundle is a clone - my media is protected by multiple backups. At the close of a project, I clone the skinny FCP X Library without media onto both the laptop and the USB drive for protection. (I also do tiny MXF exports to each, but those are super small)

By the way, I'm now thinking the classic rule of "don't keep your media on your system drive" seems to be obsolete in the SSD era. It's super snappy with both reading from the SSD.

If I needed to work with the external attached, I can just move to any surface that supports the drive - I have a collapsable travel desk that works fine if I need the stability.

I suspect as bigger internal SSDs come down in price, it may not be a problem for long. But there are lots of solutions out there for a small, but robust and dependable travel rig.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Gabe Strong
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:10:38 pm

Bill

Thanks for the info, that makes sense, I guess since SSD drives are so fast,
as long as you have room it could work all on one drive. That is actually good
to know and exactly what I was wondering about. And as built in SSD drives get
bigger, this should get even better. Right now I'm mainly working on an old
2009 Mac Pro which has been majorly upgraded to a six core 3.46ghz with
a GTX 980 Ti (6GB) GPU.....and FCP X is pretty fast on it. But I may need to look
at getting a newer laptop for mobile editing as well.

Gabe Strong
G-Force Productions
http://www.gforcevideo.com


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 2:10:21 pm

[Bill Davis] "I spent 11 years at a fixed desk in an office..."

I don't know that the viability of cutting on a laptop has much to do with FCPX. Certainly that's part of Apple's design criteria, but we've really had that capability for over a dozen years, going back to FCP "classic", Avid Xpress DV, Sony Vegas, Premiere, etc.

Just because it works, doesn't make it preferable. However, an area that Apple did well with X is the easy switching between single and dual screen layouts, so it accommodates both preferences.

For example, as an outgrowth of how I run laptop editing when using an external screen, I've taken to redesigning my own suite to use a single larger monitor (27") centered with a smaller monitor (20") for the browser offset to the left. If I were using a laptop, then this left screen would actually be the laptop display.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 3:50:31 pm

[Oliver Peters] "I don't know that the viability of cutting on a laptop has much to do with FCPX. Certainly that's part of Apple's design criteria, but we've really had that capability for over a dozen years, going back to FCP "classic", Avid Xpress DV, Sony Vegas, Premiere, etc."

Oliver, I'm not sure why this is always a response to one of my posts about X and mobile editing. YES, other systems edit on the road. At the gleeful risk of a car analogy (just to vex some folk!), there are plenty of compact cars. Some are MUCH better designed for a long road trip than others.

What makes X a particular joy for mobile editing FOR ME is -
A - the single screen optimized interface. Everything is easy to navigate in 15 inches.
B - the killer Proxy/Optimized switch system.
C - the Share system they pioneered that allows you to upload with a single click.
D - magnitism - so I don't need to constantly zoom in to check edits after I place them.
E - the Logic plug in system so I always get pristine sound.
F - the sweet responsiveness on an SSD laptop. X has been FLYING for me lately - editing as fast as I can think, really. That's enjoyable for me.

There's more but that's enough for now.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 6:14:48 pm

[Bill Davis] "YES, other systems edit on the road. At the gleeful risk of a car analogy (just to vex some folk!), there are plenty of compact cars. Some are MUCH better designed for a long road trip than others. "

I guess from my POV, FCPX has very little to do with this. It may be better in your opinion, but if and how much better is purely subjective. After all, in the context that you presented this, we're talking about convention support videos. All things being equal, I also would (and do) pick FCPX in this situation. However, that's a genre that for the most part has been cut on laptops for years before the intro of X. But, I also have just as much if not more seat time (behind the stage, in hotel rooms, etc.) using Avid, FCP "classic" and Premiere Pro. In some cases, X is the better choice, but sometimes it isn't. So the hardware really dictates the design of X, not that the software drove a change in the selection of hardware.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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David Lawrence
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 6:26:51 pm

[Oliver Peters] "So the hardware really dictates the design of X, not that the software drove a change in the selection of hardware."

This is exactly right. While FCPX certainly takes good advantage of advances in portable hardware, it's the hardware that drives the design. Fast, powerful laptops and fast, cheap, portable storage have enabled mobile workflows across the board. All NLEs take advantage of these benefits. NLE choice is again a matter of individual taste and project need. Having used both FCPX and Premiere Pro on a laptop in the field, my experience has been that they both work equally well for the tasks I use them for. I see no reason why this wouldn't be true for other NLEs as well.

_______________________
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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:04:22 pm

Its just funny that you literally NEVER hear, for example, a group of guitar players sitting around talking - and when one player says he really enjoyed playing his Gibson - there's always two other guys popping up to say "yeah, but I could have played the same lick on my Fender (or Epiphone!)" Notice how NOBODY does that? It's like the forum name still implying that X isn't up to snuff (or Not!) STILL isn't enough after all this time. Now the other "A" fans have to work extra hard to make sure their software doesn't get dissed via implication. Perish that thought.

Are all the paid Adobe and AVID ads I see on sites everywhere not enough to keep those products in mind?

Curious.

; )

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:16:41 pm
Last Edited By Oliver Peters on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:19:06 pm

[Bill Davis] "Its just funny that you literally NEVER hear, for example, a group of guitar players sitting around talking..."

Clearly you haven't hung around too many guitar players. There are plenty of similar discussions around guitars, amps, pedals, etc. Usually guitar player discussions center around the elusive chasing of the ideal tone.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:44:57 pm

[Oliver Peters] "Clearly you haven't hung around too many guitar players. There are plenty of similar discussions around guitars, amps, pedals, etc. Usually guitar player discussions center around the elusive chasing of the ideal tone."

Guitars, drums, mics, cars, tools (Snap-on vs Craftsman anyone?), computers, operating systems, video game consoles, video game franchises, movies, harddrives, TV shows, books, magazines, headphones, beer... the tribal mentality to splinter off into 'warring' factions knows no bounds.

A while back I started getting into multi-day hikes (and subsequently camping) and when I started researching gear it was basically the same kind of brand wars. This one sucks, and that one is awesome and that one over there used to be awesome too but now they suck too... Ask 100 people and you'll get 80 different answers. To be fair though, if you are on a multi-day hike in the backcountry your choice of gear can truly be the difference between life and death so I can understand the intensity of discussion by people that venture off on a regular basis.

But back on topic, much like our discussions here, I had to narrow down the focus to the types of hikes I would generally be doing (climate, duration, terrain, etc.,) and then factor in my specific needs/wants/preferences in order to make anything useful out of all the conflicting information. In one instance I ended up going we a pair of boots (most important part of the kit) that weren't very well recommended (and I understood why) but they were the most comfortable of all the ones I tried on so I went with them. They worked out well though I doubt I would recommend them unless you were doing the same kinds of hikes as I was and you had the same kinds of needs/wants/preferences that I do.


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James Ewart
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 2:39:59 am

[Andrew Kimery] "A while back I started getting into multi-day hikes (and subsequently camping) and when I started researching gear it was basically the same kind of brand wars. This one sucks, and that one is awesome and that one over there used to be awesome too but now they suck too.."

You can't beat the Saloman Mens Quest 4D 2 GTX Boot.

Nothing else comes close!


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 3:13:39 am

[James Ewart] "You can't beat the Saloman Mens Quest 4D 2 GTX Boot.
"


How well do they breathe? I hate, really hate, having sweaty feet and my hiking is almost exclusively in warm, dry places.

I've got a pair of Saloman trail runners (forget the model) that I really like so maybe I'll look into their boots. The boots (and they might even technically qualify as hiking boots) I alluded to in my previous post were Merrell Moab Ventilators. The salesmen called them hiking high-tops which is probably a more apt description. I used them to hike Mt. Whitney and had no real complaints (no sweaty feet!) though if I had a heavier pack and/or was on a hike that was mostly rocky/'ungroomed' trails then I'd certainly opt for a boot with a stiffer sole and more ankle support.


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James Ewart
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 3:31:50 am

[Andrew Kimery] "How well do they breathe? I hate, really hate, having sweaty feet and my hiking is almost exclusively in warm, dry places."

Compared to traditional leather boots not Goretex lined? I would say as well but I wonder if that would stand up to scientific analysis.

Your feet do not seem to get hot in them. They are light and yet incredibly snug and supportive. The lacing system wraps the boot around your foot in a way that is so super comfortable they mould to the shape of your foot. Quite a high supportive boot but doesn't feel it because they are light.

I wear them in the hills of the UK but also in the Austrian Alps where I have hiked up quite challenging low peaks in groups with people wearing more traditional heavy duty boots and never once felt like I was wearing footwear that was not up to the task.

I have worked my way through a lot of boots and thought I would never wear anything but leather - it was a hard sell to get me to buy them but it would take a lot to persuade me to wear anything else now. I persuaded a friend who lives in the Lake District to buy a pair and he hasn't looked back either.

Really superb boots and worth the extra money for sure.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 7:34:52 am

[James Ewart] "Really superb boots and worth the extra money for sure."

I will have to check them out, thanks James.


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Steve Connor
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 6:22:29 am

[Andrew Kimery] "A while back I started getting into multi-day hikes"

Do you use tracks? :)


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 7:35:37 am

[Steve Connor] "Do you use tracks? :)"

The NLE talk is what gets me in the door, but it's the puns that keep me in my seat. ;)


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 8:21:28 pm

[Bill Davis] "Now the other "A" fans have to work extra hard to make sure their software doesn't get dissed via implication."

Well, this IS a debate forum, NOT an FCPX fan forum. ;-)

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Tim Wilson
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 11:10:10 pm

[Bill Davis] "you literally NEVER hear, for example, a group of guitar players sitting around talking - and when one player says he really enjoyed playing his Gibson - there's always two other guys popping up to say "yeah, but I could have played the same lick on my Fender (or Epiphone!)" Notice how NOBODY does that?"

Are you f'in kidding me? That's ALL they do, all g-damn day. Have you ever been to a guitar forum?

Our illustrious founder Ronald Lindeboom used to work for Rickenbacker. He started on necks, and moved into finishing. Those beautiful inlays? The glorious paintjobs? That was him.

I'd tell you about the time he held Paul McCartney's left-handed Rickenbacker bass, or Chris Squire's custom Rickenbacker double-necked bass in his own hands, but he probably rather I didn't. LOL

Not only do guitarists argue about the BIG stuff -- Les Paul vs. Stratocaster -- but they argue about humbuckers and pedals and headstocks, they argue about boards, they argue about tubes vs. electronics, they argue about live mixing to tape vs. Pro Tools.

You want some REAL fun? Go to the Gibson forums, where people presumably agree that Les Pauls are handed down from g-d himself, and watch them argue about which Les Paul Jimmy Page used on a specific track, or at a specific show. Maybe it's the one that Joe Walsh gave him, but Jimmy hand-shaved the back of the neck to make it narrower. Or was this the one where he used the Danelectro?

I mean, these guys get into WHEN Jimmy shaved the neck. "No way man. I know the guy who put in the new, lower bridge so he'd get more action when he bent the strings. That was 1974, so he might have used it on Physical Graffiti, except that the track you're talking about was recorded in 1970 for Led Zeppelin III."

Srsly man, these guitar guys make NLE-ers look like wee tiny babies who can barely hold their heads up, much less make a cogent argument. I'm not sure I've ever seen a more argumentative group in my life.

ON TOP OF WHICH, they're drinking while they're having many of these arguments. Unless they're doing weed or coke. Or all of them.

As far as I can tell, only a couple of us are doing that while we post. LOL

So please please PLEASE do not EVEN try to make the case that we're in any way unusual, or that we as NLE-ers, or ESPECIALLY, that we as COWs "don't get it" because we, and only we, argue about the little stuff. This goes very high on the list of most patently ridiculous and easily demonstrably wrong things I've ever seen posted in this forum.

And that's saying a LOT. LOL

Much love my man, but c'mon. So far from true that there's not even a word for it in English.


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David Lawrence
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 12, 2015 at 11:16:35 pm

This ^ +1,000,000!!! LOL!

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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 7:39:59 am

So you HAVE heard some guitar stud opine that he could have PLAYED it better on a different brand? Essentially arguing that it's the flavor of guitar that makles the real difference rather than the talent and training of the player? Strong opinions about gear, sure. But I've never heard or read about somebody arguing that a great lick could have been "better" if only Les Paul or Rodrigo y Gabrialla had used a different brand. If they have the talent seems to me people let them play what they like. But maybe you folks know better and secretly watchers are wishing that Clapton had done that swirling genius solo inside the jam dreck that was "Do what you like" on some other box. Seems unlikely to me, but whatever.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 8:18:44 am
Last Edited By Andrew Kimery on Oct 13, 2015 at 9:00:33 am

[Bill Davis] "Strong opinions about gear, sure. But I've never heard or read about somebody arguing that a great lick could have been "better" if only Les Paul or Rodrigo y Gabrialla had used a different brand."

Isn't that the root cause of people having strong opinions about gear though? The firm belief that certain gear makes the end product, and/or the process by which the end product is created, significantly better. Even if everyone agrees that the end result is awesome the supporters will say the gear played a role in enabling the awesomeness to happen while the detractors will say the awesomeness was achieved in spite of the gear being used.


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Steve Connor
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 9:54:55 am

[Bill Davis] "So you HAVE heard some guitar stud opine that he could have PLAYED it better on a different brand? Essentially arguing that it's the flavor of guitar that makles the real difference rather than the talent and training of the player? Strong opinions about gear, sure. But I've never heard or read about somebody arguing that a great lick could have been "better" if only Les Paul or Rodrigo y Gabrialla had used a different brand. If they have the talent seems to me people let them play what they like. But maybe you folks know better and secretly watchers are wishing that Clapton had done that swirling genius solo inside the jam dreck that was "Do what you like" on some other box. Seems unlikely to me, but whatever.
"


I don't understand the point you are trying to make with all this, are you saying people think you can do better edits with other NLE's?


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 2:36:34 pm

Yes Bill - right down to the brand of strings used. There are sounds and techniques used by the best players which can only be accomplished by using certain guitars, with certain strings, with certain techniques.

Example? Think of the Chris Squire's bass sound on many of the Yes albums. Couldn't have been achieved without the Rickenbacker bass and round-wound strings, plus the combination of a Marshall 100w head and Ampeg SVT heads playing through the Ampeg cabinets with 8 ten inch speakers. And that's not even getting to the stage micing!

http://www.chrissquire.com/technotes

Now think of just about any of the Beach Boys songs (Help Me Rhonda, Sloop John B, California Girls, Heroes and Villains, the ill-fated Smile project), and you're talking Carol Kaye, one of the most prolific studio bass players in history! None of the sounds she produced could have been created on anything but a Fender P Bass, with flat-wound strings, and muted very carefully with a piece of felt used in sewing, and played with a pick (not her fingers).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_Kaye

That should give you an idea of how microscopic the discussions and preferences of musicians (pro and amateur) can get. It would be as if editors discussed the type of plastic used in the keys of their keyboards! You know, it does make a difference! :>)

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 4:42:35 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "That should give you an idea of how microscopic the discussions and preferences of musicians (pro and amateur) can get. It would be as if editors discussed the type of plastic used in the keys of their keyboards! You know, it does make a difference! :>)
"


; )

Yep. I do wonder, however if this is direction by retrograde analysis. IIRC, from my music theory classes, things like the Picardy Third were essentially POST ANALYSIS discussions. The composer wrote the piece not knowing there was a RULE involved - because the rule hadn't been invented. It was only when the church folks decided that ending in a minor key made the composition "devil's work" that composers decided to get around it by resolving to a major for the close - so the priests would get off their backs.

Carol Kaye herself (who I admire greatly) in the Wrecking Crew biography that Tommy Tedesco's son did talks about playing the socks off the bass part in a song that was a modest but not a smash hit. For the largest part of the audience, her brillianace in that line was nearly lost - because if the documentary hadn't been made, I could NEVER have heard the line.

The point is that I sometimes wonder if great work BECOMES great work, often not because it's really superior work, but rather because time and circumstances cause us to look at it closely enough to post-analyze what's great about it.

Which says it's not the tool NOR the artist that actually makes it great - it's the perception of the audience driven by marketing and era and context that makes things great.

Scary thought. But I do think there's more than a nugget of truth in it.

I think that Clapton riff I referenced in "Do what you like" from the Blind Faith LP is one of the finest guitar licks ever recorded anywhere. But it's buried in a morass of self-indulgent jamming such that most people don't even know it. Not like Carol Kaye's bass line in These Boots are Made for Walking - which is also brilliant - but popular enough to have risen from "what she did on that Tuesday" to the symbol of transcendent talent it deservedly is today.

(And I'm still not convinced that whether she'd strung her bass with flat-wound or round-wound strings would have made that huge hit more or less of a huge hit.)

Fun to blather about it, tho.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 5:01:00 pm

[Bill Davis] "Which says it's not the tool NOR the artist that actually makes it great - it's the perception of the audience driven by marketing and era and context that makes things great.
Scary thought. But I do think there's more than a nugget of truth in it. "


Now apply that thought to Apple design ;-)

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 5:41:07 pm

I agree with you totally, Bill. Carol Kaye, by all accounts, played bass on something like 10,000 cuts, pop stuff, rock stuff, movie sound tracks, and whatever was paying on any given day. The fact that she was an immense talent, able to contribute in almost any genre of music, didn't improve upon songs which were bad to begin with. Although the bass part on "These Boots..." was great, the song was pap. Only a musician, or someone with a good ear for a good bass part, would pick up on it.

The marketing aspect of the music industry is legendary, and, from a musician's point of view, depressing. Those who have "the look" have always been sellable, regardless of talent (Monkees, anyone?). Those who have talent, but not "the look", are often relegated to the support roles in the industry - the studio players, song writers, sidemen (and women) who don't fit the latest visual model.

And of course as you said, what becomes a classic relates ultimately to sales volume. I don't know whether you remember classical albums in the fifties and sixties, but the marketing back then, trying desperately to popularize the classics, was to put a glamorous, semi-nude model on the album cover. Music publishers even tried this ploy with jazz albums for a long time. What seem to survive the test of time are the pieces of music we connected with when they were fresh and new sounds, as well as those which were so well written, arranged, and played, that they still sound good to new generations of listeners.

The reason that a lot of good music dies these days is that the music segments now are so narrow, that some stuff just never gets heard by a wide audience.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 6:38:41 pm

[Bill Davis] "(And I'm still not convinced that whether she'd strung her bass with flat-wound or round-wound strings would have made that huge hit more or less of a huge hit.)"

Fun to blather about it, tho.


I don't think Joseph is trying to convince you one way or the other, but just trying to illustrate that the debate itself exists. That's basically this musical digression in a nutshell. There is never going to be 100% agreement on anything subjective but some people will still argue about it as if their opinion is somehow more valid than the differing opinion of the person across from them. Musicians, editors, IT professionals, mechanics... it doesn't matter. Splintering into different camps and vying for a winner just seems to be part of human nature. Or at least a deep part of American culture that thrives on definitive outcomes (black/white, good/bad, winners/losers). The ambiguity of a tie (or of not ranking things at but just enjoying them each on their own merits) doesn't seem to sit well with a lot of people.


-Andrew


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 9:41:26 pm

You're correct Andrew. Another way to illustrate this is with tools. I've used Sears Craftsman mechanics' tools for many many years. As a matter of fact, several of my tools were my father's tools, and some of his were his father's. I've never had a problem with them, and if I were to, I could return the broken socket or whatever to Sears for a replacement.

A friend of mine who is a lineman by trade said "Craftsman tools are fine, but my life depends on my tools not breaking, so I use Snap-On."

Neither right nor wrong - just perspective...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tony West
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 3:56:18 am

David, when you use X on a laptop do you use it in the dual viewer mode or single viewer mode?

The thing about cutting on a laptop is the screen is usually small making your canvas smaller.

X with that single viewer setup seems better suited for a small screen than a 2up that would make the canvas even smaller on a laptop.

I don't cut on a laptop but every time I see folks cutting X on one, they have it in that single viewer mode.

Sometimes I will see someone cutting 7 on a laptop and that canvas looks microscopic to me : )


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David Lawrence
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 4:11:10 am

[Tony West] "David, when you use X on a laptop do you use it in the dual viewer mode or single viewer mode?"

Hi Tony, I used FCPX for ingest and logging only, so single viewer mode works fine. I give most of the screen to the browser so that I can easily enter log notes for keyword ranges. Then Xto7 out to Premiere where I do my cutting. For me this is the best of both worlds! :)

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Tony West
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 4:15:30 am

[David Lawrence] " For me this is the best of both worlds! :)"

Sounds good


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Steve Connor
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 6:21:53 am

[Tony West] "X with that single viewer setup seems better suited for a small screen than a 2up that would make the canvas even smaller on a laptop."

You're right, FYI Premiere Pro can also be configured for single viewer.


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Tony West
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 2:11:18 pm

[Steve Connor] "[Tony West] "X with that single viewer setup seems better suited for a small screen than a 2up that would make the canvas even smaller on a laptop."


Steve, when X first came out, Apple really got taken to task for that single viewer (I had to get used to it myself) But did they partly have laptop editing in mind when they did it, and wanting to make that canvas bigger on that small screen?

Was it a smarter move then we first thought in this context and did it influence others
because this

[Steve Connor] " FYI Premiere Pro can also be configured for single viewer."

Also, those CCs make working on that smaller screen easier also.


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Steve Connor
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 2:43:12 pm

[Tony West] "Steve, when X first came out, Apple really got taken to task for that single viewer (I had to get used to it myself) "

I liked it straight away, it pairs well with the skimmer. Single Viewer in PPro feels slightly less effective.

Didn't Speed Razor also have a single viewer or am I imagining it?


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 3:02:09 pm

[Steve Connor] "Didn't Speed Razor also have a single viewer or am I imagining it?"

Not sure about that, but Vegas uses a single viewer and at various times, Avid Media Composer and Xpress used single viewers. Also DPS/Leitch Velocity (now owned by Harris). In fact, the original Media Composer layout was a single viewer for the timeline and then individual pop-up windows for source clips. That's still an option today. However, I believe the toggle of source or record video in the SAME viewer window is unique to FCPX.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Dominic Deacon
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 14, 2015 at 6:16:34 am

[Oliver Peters] "However, I believe the toggle of source or record video in the SAME viewer window is unique to FCPX."

Isn't that the default on Edius? I haven't got it on my system currently to check but I seem to recall back in the day that was the way it was. In fact the first time I used FCX I thought it felt very much like Edius in its default single viewer, tracks locked, ripple mode.


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James Ewart
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 4:00:20 pm

[Tony West] "Steve, when X first came out, Apple really got taken to task for that single viewer (I had to get used to it myself) But did they partly have laptop editing in mind when they did it, and wanting to make that canvas bigger on that small screen?"

I was one of those moaning as loud as I could and by the time they introduced dual viewers I had got used to it.

I hardly ever use two unless I need to match something specific.


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David Mathis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 13, 2015 at 2:33:27 am

Beware the Cone Heads my friend. Evil laugh included for free.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 27, 2015 at 3:44:02 pm

I would think that if you want to talk about single vs dual monitors, you'd have to look at pixel count. You can get one $1500 iMac that has the resolution of what used to be two (or more) monitors, if you talk about the pixel count and not diagonal measurement. If you spend $1800 you get even more resolution.

So as far as single screen design, I would think that if you take the actual pixel count in to the size of the screen, a single monitor design makes a bit of sense, and probably where Apple is focusing their efforts.

I would imagine that 4k (and higher) display monitors will come whenever they can be manufactured cheap enough to make them compelling, or when the next display port revision comes around adding higher resolution and refresh rates (and connectors).


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 27, 2015 at 4:24:10 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "I would imagine that 4k (and higher) display monitors will come whenever they can be manufactured cheap enough to make them compelling, or when the next display port revision comes around adding higher resolution and refresh rates (and connectors)."

I agree that's what Apple was thinking. However, higher pixel count isn't necessarily better. Apple's Retina screens don't necessarily give you more screen real estate. They give you denser real estate. More PPI. Depending on how you set the scaling of the screen, you may get more, but then everything is too small.

The other issue is that screens are still locked to 16:10 (or 16:9) so more pixels means more vertical space, which usually isn't where you want the extra room. I know a few editors that have gone to the wider LG screens, but then you are still locked into a single-screen UI layout. Although the layouts in FCPX are not as versatile as in FCP "classic" and in PProCC, I think Apple did a nice job of getting the best of both worlds within the constraints they imposed on FCPX.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 27, 2015 at 4:42:03 pm

[Oliver Peters] " agree that's what Apple was thinking. However, higher pixel count isn't necessarily better. Apple's Retina screens don't necessarily give you more screen real estate. They give you denser real estate. More PPI. Depending on how you set the scaling of the screen, you may get more, but then everything is too small."

I think we are saying the same thing. Pixel count. On my laptop, for example, I can get the same resolution on my 15" retina than I did on my 17" Powerbook. It's the same amount of pixels, albeit on a smaller display (and yes, some things appear "smaller") but I can fit and arrange things exactly as they were on my 17" Powerboook. I cannot do this at retina relocation as the displayed pixel count is smaller. On a larger 5k Retina screen, I will have over quadruple the amount of pixels, provided I scale out of retina resolution. That's a lot.

[Oliver Peters] "Although the layouts in FCPX are not as versatile as in FCP "classic" and in PProCC, I think Apple did a nice job of getting the best of both worlds within the constraints they imposed on FCPX."

What I like about FCPX is that there isn't a lot of dead space. You open the tools you need at the time, and then close them up, or put them away when you're done. With other UI, there's a lot of wasted space, just sitting there not doing much are adding any significant feedback or tools. There are a multitude of shortcuts to assign to the FCPX interface, but people have to take the time to assign them, and therefore use them. Of course, there's still room for improvement, but even though I have multiple monitors, I find that I use one monitor most of the time. I really want one huge one, and I'd be good for all of my professional applications. If I had 5k raster of working space, I'd be good with pretty much any interface. That's a whole lot of pixels. I'd also probably need a new computer, which is a bummer.


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 27, 2015 at 5:08:41 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "but even though I have multiple monitors, I find that I use one monitor most of the time"

The layout I've migrated to in several set-ups (home and a few freelance spots) is a single 27" that is centered and then one 20" off to the left. In some cases, a video monitor off to the right. This works well, because your working area is centered and the browser ("bins") can be on the other monitor on the left.

I've mapped various panel/layout shortcuts to the function keys, so it's very easy to shift between the UI on one monitor or spread out across two. I switch it up, depending on the task. One thing I'd love to see is a way to make the timeline window completing fullscreen, without part of the browser still in the way. Just hide it.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 28, 2015 at 3:21:58 am

I agree that monitor real estate is what we are talking about and not necessarily having multiple monitors. Though having multiple monitors allows you to have one in portrait and one in landscape if you are in to that sort of thing.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 28, 2015 at 4:44:58 pm

[Andrew Kimery] "Though having multiple monitors allows you to have one in portrait and one in landscape if you are in to that sort of thing."

It's monitor Tetris to play track Tetris! :)

See this gif:



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James Ewart
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 4:54:33 pm

[Tim Wilson] "I wonder every bit as much about the opposite: are there people who've lived the 2-monitor life who've now switched to single monitors because FCPX works better there (even though it obviously works well enough on 2).
"


I am happy on one. But if I'm honest I would rather have an entire monitor for the browser a lot of the time..


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Don Walker
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 10, 2015 at 6:09:09 pm

I like the single viewer approach much more than the dual views for non multicam editing. Back 20+ years ago when I was editing in linear suites, we only really looked at one monitor. The I square (CMX terminology) would switch between record machine and switcher, and the switcher would switch between sources, (on the ME that was controlled by the editor). Though we had other source monitors in the room (small B&Ws for the VTR's) we really didn't need them, because the majority of our focus was on the main edit monitor. I think that FCPX emulates that approach, and I prefer it. I do understand however that for ganging purposes you need the 2nd viewer, but I find the 1 viewer approach much more efficient.
In fact, if somebody can tell me how to make PP emulate that feature, I would be much more likely to spend more time on Premiere!

don walker
texarkana, texas

John 3:16


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 11, 2015 at 12:13:35 am

[Don Walker] "In fact, if somebody can tell me how to make PP emulate that feature, I would be much more likely to spend more time on Premiere!"

Under CC2015, use the Assembly workspace. It tabs the source and record views into a single viewer.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 14, 2015 at 2:51:56 pm

BTW - since we are talking about UI design, I'm not sure how many here have seen the new Lightroom import module. A complete step backwards bordering on POS. It's adopted a very "dumbed down" iOS style, which doesn't match any other CC interface nor the rest of Lightroom. Plus it's a lot slower and less intuitive. I'm not sure what Adobe was thinking, but there's an example of making a huge change that doesn't work. FCPX's change worked - for better or worse - precisely because they cut the chord.

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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David Lawrence
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 14, 2015 at 3:44:56 pm

[Oliver Peters] " It's adopted a very "dumbed down" iOS style, which doesn't match any other CC interface nor the rest of Lightroom."

[Oliver Peters] "I'm not sure what Adobe was thinking, but there's an example of making a huge change that doesn't work. FCPX's change worked - for better or worse - precisely because they cut the chord."

Do you think it might have anything to do with their recent focus on mobile apps for iOS?

_______________________
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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 14, 2015 at 3:53:47 pm

"Do you think it might have anything to do with their recent focus on mobile apps for iOS?"

I do and that concerns me. If they implement this approach across the board, it will be contrary to what Adobe users like about their apps. Of course look is one thing, but a performance drop is inexcuseable.

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Dennis Radeke
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 15, 2015 at 3:13:29 pm

"[Oliver Peters] " It's adopted a very "dumbed down" iOS style, which doesn't match any other CC interface nor the rest of Lightroom."

[Oliver Peters] "I'm not sure what Adobe was thinking, but there's an example of making a huge change that doesn't work. FCPX's change worked - for better or worse - precisely because they cut the chord."

[David Lawrence] Do you think it might have anything to do with their recent focus on mobile apps for iOS?"


No, our decision was based on a number data points and customer input, but obviously the greater customer feedback has been negative and we are looking at addressing this as soon as possible.

Dennis - Adobe guy


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Oliver Peters
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 15, 2015 at 3:20:26 pm

[Dennis Radeke] "No, our decision was based on a number data points and customer input, but obviously the greater customer feedback has been negative and we are looking at addressing this as soon as possible"

Hopefully it gets fixed fast. I would suggest that if this sort of change were to be made in Premiere, you'd lose a lot of the gains you have made.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Bill Davis
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 27, 2015 at 8:41:18 pm

Nice if we had a dual track development effort where one interface was headed toward on-going mobile development and the other could remain focused on professional editing.

An FCP X Mobile if you will.

wait a second.... iMovie for iOS! AND the desktop - with easy linkage to FCP X like Mark and Steve talked about in this...

http://www.aotg.com/media/58275/macbreak-studio-ep-332:-from-imovie-ios-to-...

OK. I'm good.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Jim Wiseman
Re: FCP X Design Influences
on Oct 28, 2015 at 12:10:16 am
Last Edited By Jim Wiseman on Oct 28, 2015 at 1:38:27 am

To Tim's point on single screen operation, FCPX runs great on my new MacBook Pro Retina 15". Much better than the tower. At least as well as the Late 2013 nMP hexacore on first impression. BTW, I do like a two monitor setup, which the new MBP will do when necessary. Also, I bought the MBP now because I knew I would get Yosemite, required by Aperture which I have been using in a managed library since version 1. Not a big fan, actually I don't like, Lightroom's interface. Find the "Rooms" cumbersome. And yes I have tried it. Own the perpetual license 6.x, and find the Aperture interface much more fluid. Will probably use it until my computers won't run it any longer, which makes the El Capitan changeover moot as long as that is the case. Haven't heard much good about the "upgrades" to Lightroom lately. Will still practice with it once the bugs are fixed, though.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1, Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Pro X 10.2.2, Final Cut Studio 2 & 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.6, Premiere Pro CS 5 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Blackmagic Ultrastudio 4K, Blackmagic Teranex, Avid MC: 2013 Mac Pro Hexacore, 1TB SSD, 64GB RAM, 2-D500: Helios 2 w 2-960GB SSDs: 2012 Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz, 24Gb RAM, GTX-680, 960GB SSD: Macbook Pro Retina 2015, i7, 500GB, M370X 2GB: Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 16GB RAM 250GB SSD, Multiple OWC Thunderbay 4 TB2 and eSATA QX2 RAID 5 HD systems


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