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Shane Ross
Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 8, 2014 at 8:54:15 pm

For those there who care about how Avid is doing business wise (and who seem giddy when things go bad for them)...Avid has relisted with NASDAQ:

http://www.nasdaq.com/press-release/avid-to-relist-on-nasdaq-20141204-01000

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Tim Wilson
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 8, 2014 at 10:09:40 pm

[Shane Ross] "...and who seem giddy when things go bad for them..."

Apple FCPX or Not: The Schadenfreude.


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Bill Davis
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 8, 2014 at 10:44:52 pm

It was always a shame when Sigmund got a sunburn.

(Practicicing in case I get into a stupid and obscure pun throwdown anytime soon)

I'll just slink away now...

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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TImothy Auld
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 8, 2014 at 10:46:20 pm

If you stay within their workflow it is still the most solid NLE. And the trimming functions are without peer. (He covers his head for the incoming fusillade.)

Tim


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 8, 2014 at 11:31:32 pm

I don't see any reason for any fusillade. Although I prefer FCP X above anything else for the work we do, what you say is correct. I hope the relisting is successful for Avid.

- Ronny


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 12:18:43 am

Competition is good. While Avid work has dried up to nothing in my region, I wish them (and my friends who work there) the best of luck. Oh, and I bought a bit of their stock the recently. What the hell, right? ;-)

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Craig Seeman
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 12:18:30 am

I'm sooooo predictable ;-)









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Noah Kadner
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 12:33:37 am

I take no pleasure in folks losing their livelihood. And competition is a good thing. Without it there's no reason to innovate.

Noah

FCPWORKS - FCPX Workflow
Call Box Training


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Craig Seeman
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 5:45:57 pm

I think Avid is rethinking their business model.
Their handling of MC/Symphony and updates/upgrades were probably a large part of their problems. This for a company that really isn't an NLE company anymore.
They're services a small niche and if that's their objective, they need to make it more profitable.
One might loosely compare them to what Grass Valley Group has gone through.



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Charlie Austin
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 1:46:20 am

Count me in as not being giddy. Hell, I bought V8 when it came out. The more the merrier. X is my main axe, but they all - X, 7, Pr, MC, R11(sort of...) - have their pro's and cons. ;-)

-------------------------------------------------------------

~ My FCPX Babbling blog ~
~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Mark Suszko
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 5:27:58 pm

Plenty of people thought FCPx was dead on arrival, after that initial introduction. It was just shagged out after a prolonged sqauck, after pining for the fjords.


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Bill Davis
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 8:14:09 pm

[Mark Suszko] "Plenty of people thought FCPx was dead on arrival, after that initial introduction. It was just shagged out after a prolonged sqauck, after pining for the fjords."


Mark,

You practicing your Aindreas impression for the holiday party?

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Robert d'Alexis
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 9:04:06 pm

[Bill Davis] "You practicing your Aindreas impression for the holiday party?"

LOL, that's a good one, Bill. :-)


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Tim Wilson
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 9:56:27 pm

[Craig Seeman] "really isn't an NLE company anymore."

Avid would disagree.

When people say things like "Avid makes more money off of storage," they miss the simplest of equations: the value of Unity minus Media Composer = ZERO. Avid would sell ZERO Unity networks without Media Composer.

This may seem a trivial distinction, or merely semantic, but it's not. It's the one fundamental, inviolable truth in Avid's world, and the only starting place for any discussion of what "Avid is" or "Avid means" at all.

Non-MC users could use Unity (it supports any clients you can think of), but never will. Without the workflow advantages Unity enables for Avid clients, hard to make a case why they should, either.

MC users have some reasons to use Unity, but hey, if you don't need those advantages, they can choose other kinds of storage, and they do. There are companies with banners on this very page who've built their entire business on being non-Unity storage specifically designed for Avid editors in specific scenarios that Unity might previously have been the only option.

A small market, you say? Yes it is, but it's obviously big enough to make a living in.

Unity users, though? 100% of them use Media Composer. ZERO percent of them DON'T use Media Composer.

Avid can't sell their awesome Unity storage outside this market (for technology reasons that are worth talking about another day), so once Media Composer is no longer a compelling client, Unity is done.

The same is true for Avid consultation and services. Say you're an enterprise scale customer who needs a wall-to-wall, end-to-end, multi-vendor, multi-platform solution with a customized workflow.

Avid broadcast sales consultants are actually really good at this, because Avid has never owned all the tools that, say, a newsroom needs to operate, so they HAVE to be good at the big picture if they want to make a sale at all...but honestly, if you're not using Media Composer-derived software AT ALL, there are no advantages to Unity, and no ABILITY to use Interplay, and therefore, no reason to even LOOK at a bid from an Avid services consultant.

Bringing us back to our one, inviolable truth: without Media Composer, Avid has neither the storage nor the services to make any kind of future as "storage and services company" even vaguely feasible.

So Media Composer isn't Avid's biggest SOURCE of revenue, not by a long shot, and as noted before, hasn't been for a while. But it's the only REASON for ANY revenue, and will be forever.

That's the definition of "an NLE company." No NLE = no company.

In that sense, Avid may be the only "NLE company" around at all right now.


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Craig Seeman
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 9, 2014 at 10:17:52 pm

[Tim Wilson] "Avid would sell ZERO Unity networks without Media Composer. "

But that would make MC as utility integral for Unity not so much something that has great value to them with stand alone MC sales. It's not that MC should or could "go away" but its value to them is really as part of Unity.

I have to wonder it EditShare is hoping LightWorks because their Media Composer in that it becomes integral in making their storage systems more valuable. It seems why they might have found value in LightWorks. They want/need an NLE with ties to their storage system that they can add value to.

[Tim Wilson] "That's the definition of "an NLE company." No NLE = no company.
"


I would consider them a Broadcast Enterprise company that makes an NLE to best take advantage of that. Semantics maybe but I don't consider them an "NLE Company." In fact, these days, I don't think there are any NLE companies per se.

Apple would survive without FCPX. Adobe could survive without PPro although for them, it may be seen as, at least, an integral tool in After Effects work (not that it's value is in any way limited to that).

My own guess as the array of NLEs improve, Avid's NLE ONLY market share will erode (which has no baring on MC's use with Unity system). In fact Avid, with proper management decisions, will weather that.



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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 10, 2014 at 11:16:28 am

Would it be fair to say that MC could be considered a loss-leader for Avid aimed to sell and maintain support for the larger, more profitable Avid Everywhere, Unity and consultation products?

Hernandez is a smart guy. He trimmed the company down, focused on his core user group (the folks who really use the above products) and set up the subscription model that will, at the very least, stabilize the revenue flow. Those are really good accomplishments (I leave the ACA out of it, as that seems more like a cash-grab than anything else). Now the challenge is growth and profitability. I still can't tell from the Avid press release if the company is making a profit or not. Certainly revenue will jump in this last quarter due to a rush in subscriptions before the end of the year (not mine, I will use the $300 to buy a bit more Avid stock), but what about next year? How do you increase revenue? Raise the subscription price or get new customers. And getting new customers would rely on Avid marketing which has been historically bad. The NLE field is shaking out with not a lot of people on the fence to sway. Louis did a good job keeping the company upright (burned through a ton of their cash reserve, however), now the challenge is to grow. It will also be interesting to see if they start selling off pieces, as Mr. Hernandez did this very same thing at his last company. Interesting story to watch unfold.

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Daniel Frome
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 10, 2014 at 1:02:16 pm

Just wanted to say that you've summarized the Avid situation better than I've ever seen anyone else do it.

Now... I just wish that the Avid brass would see it that way too ;) The way they treat Media Composer, it feels like the bastard child of the family.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 2:24:56 am

I think it's unfair to look at any of these items as loss leaders. Avid makes money off of all of its products. Some more, some less, but they all are slices of the complete income pie. Avid can't really afford to neglect any of them.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 12:26:28 pm

I respectfully disagree. I would bet that Avid would love to break even or just take a little loss on making and updating the NLE software as long as it drives the sales of cash-rich support contracts and (supposedly) more profitable "big-iron". Avid used to be a company that was centered around the NLE. Now the NLE is a support for the contracts, consultancy and hardware revenue streams. It would be interesting to hear how Avid defines itself these days.

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Walter Soyka
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 3:27:46 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "I would bet that Avid would love to break even or just take a little loss on making and updating the NLE software as long as it drives the sales of cash-rich support contracts and (supposedly) more profitable "big-iron". Avid used to be a company that was centered around the NLE. Now the NLE is a support for the contracts, consultancy and hardware revenue streams. It would be interesting to hear how Avid defines itself these days."

Let's conduct a thought experiment to test this idea that MC is nothing more than "support" for Avid's service contracts, consultancy,* and hardware, and that none of these sources of revenue are actually centered around the NLE.

Let's say Avid shutters Media Composer tomorrow, and positions their sure-to-be-renamed ISIS system as a hardware solution for Adobe Anywhere clusters, available with support and customized solutions.

What happens next?



* Oxford comma! I haven't heard "Harvard comma," but rather usually hear this referred to as a "serial comma."

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 4:45:08 pm

[Scott Witthaus] " I would bet that Avid would love to break even or just take a little loss on making and updating the NLE software"

What makes you believe that they aren't making money on MC or PT as individual products or business units right now?

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Charlie Austin
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 4:48:16 pm

[Oliver Peters] "What makes you believe that they aren't making money on MC or PT as individual products or business units right now?"

I think we, not surprisingly, tend to focus on MC too much. PT really is the "industry standard" and probably makes them quite a bit of $$.

-------------------------------------------------------------

~ My FCPX Babbling blog ~
~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Walter Soyka
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 5:17:44 pm

[Charlie Austin] "I think we, not surprisingly, tend to focus on MC too much. PT really is the "industry standard" and probably makes them quite a bit of $$"

Avid breaks out performance by segment in their financial statements. Video leads audio $178M to $108M through the first three quarters of this year.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 6:04:54 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Avid breaks out performance by segment in their financial statements. Video leads audio $178M to $108M through the first three quarters of this year."

Is that revenue or profit?


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Walter Soyka
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 11, 2014 at 6:16:27 pm

[Andrew Kimery] "Is that revenue or profit?"

Revenue. They don't disclose profit per segment.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 6:20:52 pm

[Oliver Peters] "What makes you believe that they aren't making money on MC or PT as individual products or business units right now?
"


Recent history shows us that Avid has not been making a profit and losing lots of available cash. Avid seems to be carrying debt, which is something it has not done in a long time. So I think we can say that as a company that had MC as it's flagship product, it did not work in a commoditized environment.

With the unveiling of Avid Everywhere, the conversation has changed. As has been stated by Avid folks themselves, MC (and PT, I would guess) are integral parts of the Avid Everywhere product not the other way around. They are there to drive sales and value of Avid Everywhere. Avid Everywhere is the new flagship product and a smart move, aimed directly at the core customer for Avid (large install, multi-user, broadcast etc). I think the company realized it's not worth competing actively for the one man shop or small shop. One-off software sales just aren't going to do it. Avid will lose small guys like me and that will be cool for them, because the money for them is in the large install with the server and media management products at the center. That's who they want. Sell the subscription and the support contracts after the initial hardware sale. Pure cash without a real product. You push MC along just enough to keep this core happy and the subscriptions being renewed. And you could say that this core is a conservative group who are not comfortable on the bleeding edge, so R&D is moderate. Beautiful.

I expect to see Avid profitable in Q4 of this year with the rush of subscriptions. Next year will be interesting.

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 6:49:51 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "You push MC along just enough to keep this core happy and the subscriptions being renewed. And you could say that this core is a conservative group who are not comfortable on the bleeding edge, so R&D is moderate. Beautiful."

Avid tried doing the bare minimum and it cost them a lot of seats to FCP Classic in the mid 2000's. Since the not-so-hot Adrenaline days Avid has been releasing bigger updates more often for MC and I don't see that changing. Going back to the recent thread about Mark Sanger (https://forums.creativecow.net/thread/335/75405#75428), he stayed on the same version of Avid for the duration of Gravity and after 3 years he felt pretty behind-the-times because of all the changes made to MC.

Is Avid going to blow up the MC interface and fundamental workflow the way Apple did with X? No, but there's still lots of room to grow w/o trying to re-invent the wheel. Avid can't afford to coast again because they will lose seats in their core market to Adobe (especially if Adobe Anywhere becomes a viable competitor to ISIS and Avid Everywhere) and eventually to X.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 7:31:39 pm

[Andrew Kimery] " No, but there's still lots of room to grow w/o trying to re-invent the wheel."

You're going to see the biggest change in a long time when the next version (end of this year?) is delivered, because it adds resolution independence. That will be a huge change for most of the Media Composer user base.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 7:35:31 pm

[Oliver Peters] "You're going to see the biggest change in a long time when the next version (end of this year?) is delivered, because it adds resolution independence. That will be a huge change for most of the Media Composer user base."

That and an overhaul of how MC handles FX are two of my biggest wants from Avid right now.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 7:27:56 pm

[Scott Witthaus] " Avid Everywhere is the new flagship product "

It is not a "product" but rather a marketing and platform strategy. You cannot purchase anything called Avid Everywhere.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 9:01:35 pm

[Oliver Peters] "It is not a "product" but rather a marketing and platform strategy. You cannot purchase anything called Avid Everywhere.
"


Philip Hodgetts went to an Avid Everywhere press event over the summer and that was his big takeaway from it. It sounds like a product, but it is, as you say, an overall strategy for the company. He said he was pretty blown away by the vision and he hopes Avid can pull it off (and stay solvent doing so).


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 9:53:22 pm

[Andrew Kimery] "He said he was pretty blown away by the vision"

Correct. It is a vision that encompasses many of the existing products as well as some new ones. In addition there are underpinnings that help to make it work, like common APIs. It is also a work-in-progress, as some components, like the marketplace portions, aren't done yet. So it's a multi-year strategy. This diagram shows how the products are organized.



- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 12, 2014 at 10:06:19 pm

Thanks for the image, Oliver.

This is another example of why I hope the three A's (plus any other new comers) are able to all stick around. Although there is certainly overlap, they all bring something unique to the table. FCP X's change is the most eye catching because of drastic departure it took from existing NLEs, but both Avid and Adobe have grand visions they are shooting for as well.


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 13, 2014 at 12:52:11 am

[Oliver Peters] "It is not a "product" but rather a marketing and platform strategy. "

Good point. But, it's not Media Composer anymore. That is a supportive product to the grand strategy.

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 13, 2014 at 3:07:07 am

It's been that way for over 10 years.

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 13, 2014 at 1:20:26 pm

[Oliver Peters] "It's been that way for over 10 years."

Hmm, I will disagree with that, but I am tired of debating! :-)

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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Oliver Peters
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 13, 2014 at 2:00:09 pm

[Scott Witthaus] "Hmm, I will disagree with that, but I am tired of debating! :-)"

LOL. I think it's a matter of perspective. If you have been a Pro Tools customer or newsroom customer, then Avid has definitely been something other than Media Composer to you. It's a diversified company, and - yes - since Media Composer was the first product, it has defined the brand. But that's more in the minds of editors who use the product than necessarily how the company has positioned itself. Avid Everywhere is simply a more unified, cohesive version of what they've been trying to do for years.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Scott Witthaus
Re: Avid to relist on NASDAQ
on Dec 13, 2014 at 2:38:12 pm

[Oliver Peters] " Avid Everywhere is simply a more unified, cohesive version of what they've been trying to do for years."

True, AE is a strategy and it has become the flagship for the company. I think it's a good idea for Avid's core users. After stumbling around for several years, it feels Avid has some direction. Not for me, however, but a good direction all the same in the grand scheme of things.

sw

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter


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