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Sascha Engel
Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 3:19:41 pm

Hi,

is there a way like in my beloved Legacy, to create a Folder for my Favourite Effects and one for my Fav Transitions and Audio Plugs?

Thanx

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Mitch Ives
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 3:29:40 pm

Ive been asking for that since the first release...

Mitch Ives
Insight Productions Corp.

"Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things." - Winston Churchill


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Sascha Engel
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 4:23:49 pm

That's really a bummer. It slows down a lot. Pity, because in so many things FCPX is faster,
but that is definitely a break on the speed wheel.
Hope they will fix it.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Bill Davis
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 6:14:13 pm

Again, time to start clearing your head of the "to have what I want, it has to be like it was in Legacy" mode.

You want to save "favrotites" in X? It's dirt simple.

Create one or more "dummy" events. Put anything you want to re-use in them.

I have a dummy "voiceover workshop" event. It's got tones, countdowns, pre-recordings, all sorts of stuff that makes it easier for me to assemble voiceovers. It' lives at the top of my Event Browser. Whenver I need to do VO work, it's my "favorites" bin.

It's NEW thinking that works great in X. Trying to make X work like your OLD thinking generally leads you to think you can't do things that you CAN do - simply because you're trying to do them the old way - rather than opening your thinking to see how the new way might enable you to do even MORE than you used to be able to do with a concept like "Favorites"

Cuz, you know, now those "favorites" in the event browser are sortable, searchable, and applicable across as many projects as you like, forever.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 6:30:36 pm

So I assume your saying yes to the original question, even though you are describing a media folder and the original poster was talking about an effects folder?

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Bill Davis
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 6:48:03 pm

[Herb Sevush] "So I assume your saying yes to the original question, even though you are describing a media folder and the original poster was talking about an effects folder?
"


I'm talking about using the way X actually functions to save the metadata state of anything - any "state" of a construction including an edit, an effect, an audio echo setting, whatever - as a "recipe" into the Event Browser.

Once there, you can search out that metadata state and apply it to ANYTHING else.

So what's the point of an "effects folder" other than to just make someone who is used to them feel more comfortable from an visual or organizational standpoint?

Those "folders" were dumb. The database in X and the Event Browsers use of it is NOT DUMB at all. It's powerful. So you can not only preserve a thing, but search and sort and find and combine and version and ammed that thing in the database.

Or you can stick with a "folder" that sits somewhere and if you're really, real lucky, the interface designer will give you a way to turn it blue or pink so you can feel more comfortable.

Nothing wrong with the ability to turn something blue or pink, BTW. It's just part of the sideshow - NOT any part of adding extra POWER to the way the software works.

No reason NOT to have it. But most of us would NEVER give up database sort - in favor of dumb color labeling. That just doesn't make ANY sense once you've had the real deal.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 7:13:51 pm

[Bill Davis] "So what's the point of an "effects folder""

Speed. My Legacy Favorite Effects folder has a space on my desktop and is always visible. If I need one of the 14 or so effects I use very frequently I simply drag and drop it on a clip. If I first had to do a search to find that effect, then that would slow me down dramatically, which is the beauty of a specific "favorite effects" folder. Being totally ignorant of X, but listening to what other users are asking for I assume putting effects onto dummy media and storing it in an event (which I believe is what you are describing) is not as fast, or is it? Just asking, no agenda.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Bill Davis
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 6:09:01 pm

Herb,

You create an event. You put a space or two in FRONT of the name of the event. That forces it to the TOP spot in the list of your events.

So that user created and user managed storage space is ALWAYS visible no matter WHERE you are in X. It's every bit as visible as a folder. BUT unlike a folder, it NEVER dissapperas no matter what Project or Event you happen to be in at the time. If you change to another Project - it's STILL there and everytihng inside it is accessible. It's there if you switch to work in Multi-cam, there during audio, there during color correction, it's ALWAYS there.

AND it can be made to respond to an infinite array of user queries or sorts (or NONE if the user prefers it that way.)

That's why I feel it's tremendously more powerful than any "folder" that I've ever seen.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 7:02:29 pm

[Bill Davis] "So that user created and user managed storage space is ALWAYS visible no matter WHERE you are in X. It's every bit as visible as a folder. BUT unlike a folder, it NEVER dissapperas no matter what Project or Event you happen to be in at the time. "

Which is wonderful when your talking about media. Very valuable. I have a standard folder I call "Generic", which has my basic music stings, graphics, and even gradients, that I import into all of my projects in legacy, this would be a much better way of dealing with it as updating it once would update it for everything.

I get that and I appreciate that.

But this thread is about "favorite effects" folders, which in Legacy, and most NLEs, also never disappears and is available all the time. It appears that while there are some work arounds that handle some of this, there is nothing in FCPX that matches the simple efficiency of a favorite effects folder, especially for audio. Not a big deal, but a minor annoyance that hopefully will be addressed soon.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Bret Williams
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 8:28:46 pm

I'm not sure you and Bill were talking about the same thing. It sounds like he never used favorites in 7. I've never seen a way to put a dissolve an an event either. Or a push. Or a title effect, etc.

I think favorites will obviously be enabled in the future. Theres just no good reason not to. Or at least let us put effects and titles within events so we CAN create something like bill suggests without appending it to dummy media.

No, I will not send a suggestion to Apple. This kinda a no brainer.


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Bob Woodhead
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 7:20:02 pm

For favorites of filters, text, generators, etc, you can use a dummy project timeline. Not sure there's a great organizational structure available, though.

I can't see how to use it to store favorite transitions (that is, can't see how to copy from one timeline to another).

Ideas on these?


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Mark Dobson
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 6:56:21 pm

Hi Sasha,

I can feel your frustration.

I've requested changes in the FX Browser, which to me is the most, dare I say it, iMovie feature within FCPX.

I would like a total split between Audio and Video FX and also the ability within the application of disabling / removing all the guff that I will never use or havel already used and won't ever again.

I'm just wondering whether Digital Rebellion's 'Pro Maintenance Tools' might be able to fulfil some of these functions as it has a plugin manager which as it says

" Plugin Manager
Allows you to quickly and easily organize your editing system plugins. You can group them together, install new plugins and selectively enable and disable them - all without having to worry about where the plugins are physically located on disk.

Supports Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer, Avid Symphony and Adobe Premiere Pro"

It costs $139.

Alternatively one could physically remove unwanted plugins from the various Motion Templates Folders and place them in a temporary folder outside of the Movies Folder.


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Sascha Engel
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 9:35:13 pm

Hi Mark,

Yup seems I kicked off some domino effect again with this post ;-)
I understand Bill's way to do it and I agree - DataBase is strong,
But nevertheless, I really like the idea of favourite folders, cause I do believe, that they are faster than Jumping TLs back and forth and copy pasting.
The 7 way of dragging and dropping is absolutely quicker.
And yes, that is a bit of iMovie style, the way they solved this. Hope there's will be one improvement in the future.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Julian Bowman
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 9, 2013 at 7:50:24 am

Bill, I'm confused. you said I can create an event and simply put my plugins in it and use that as my very needed and not particularly antiquated favourites folder.

Well I just tried. It appears I cannot in fact drag my plugins into a new event and then open that event (favourites folder) and see them, let alone scrub through them to see how they may look as i can in the plugins section.

So how exactly is your workaround, which was offered up with your typically dismissive attitude of anyone wanting anything in X that you don't want or need, a bona fide current replacement for a favourites folder?

I'm guessing what you mean is I can use some laborious workaround to collate examples of the plugins, probably on other clips, that will not allow me to visually see how they look or in fact visually present them as neatly as the plugins folder. if so, not quite sure how that is the future. Surely the future would be to have a great plugins area of the NLE (which we do) decluttered by enabling user management (which we don't and was asked for in this post)


The other workaround listed below is also just a poor man's workaround. I use it, but it is

a) fiddly
b) will break when you do an upgrade
c) won't enable me to put everything I want in there
d) won't enable me to close all the plugins I DON'T want cluttering up my plugins area (especially the totally hobbyist nonsense packaged with X). Even if I put my FX Factory plugins I want in there and delete the rest, FX Factory still reinstalls them when I boot back up, so decluttering is not possible. As for Apples plugins, that's even more of a PITA arse to hide them, you have to hack the core folders.

Truly, the ability to manage your plugins as you see fit, including turning off in X those you don't need or moving those you use to a series of ordered folders, is an enhancement of the ability to edit with expediency. It is not antiquated. It is not clinging to the past. It is not wanting using X as you want to use legacy, it is wanting to use X as a professional with organisational needs for the plethora of plugins Apple themselves have encouraged.

To argue otherwise, to suggest someone is somehow howling at the moon because they want a feature added that was valid, valuable and aided productivity in other NLE's, is bordering on the deluded and makes that contributors opinions seem, er, nuts.

bill, one final question. Are you still editing on 10.0? I mean you were such a huge advocate of how perfect it was and how awesome it was and how everyone else was simply nowhere near the puck, therefore I am guessing you haven't installed any of the upgrades because really you don't need them because all they did was supply the features and changes that people were asking for that you said they didn't need because, you know, they were harping on about the past and Apple had just delivered the future.

So how is it on 10.0?



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Sascha Engel
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 9, 2013 at 8:00:43 am

Thank you Julian, you summed it up for me.
Since I am new in FCPX forum/ app, I did not wanna say something,
But I do get the feeling, Bill, that you are a bit fanatic in defending X.
It is great software, with great new innovations and very speedy, but after all it still has a lot of child sicknesses and does lack in my opinion a lot of features, that a Pro App needs and separates it from an iMovie amateur software.
A favourites folder is indeed not clinging onto the past, but an essential pro tool that should be implemented.
Because it's a shame, that all the speed I gain by X's architecture, I loose, cause I have to fiddle around with chunky work arounds to make up for missing features and functions.
Let's hope, that a lot of those things will be fixed in the next upgrade.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Neil Goodman
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 9, 2013 at 3:48:32 pm

again Bill speaks up without understanding the question at all and in a dismissive tone no less. I truly believe and this is not s dig, but that he wasn't using FCP 7 like alot of power users were using it.

A favorites folder would be be mighty welcome and is not an OLD way of thinking, just a good one.

Neil Goodman: Editor of New Media Production - The Esquire Network - NBC/Uni


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 7:22:57 pm

Is this what you mean?



- Ronny


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Sascha Engel
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 9:31:19 pm

How did you create that? I can make one for Audio and FX as well?

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Nikolas Bäurle
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 10:07:28 pm

You need to open the effect in Motion, change it to your liking and then save it as a template. You can make a new category to put it in, here's a Mac Break Studio link with Mark and Steve:







"Always look on the bright side of life" - Monty Python



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James Ewart
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 11, 2013 at 8:43:28 am

what about humble traditions. I like to keep 6 frame 12 frame 25 frame dissolves etc as favourites??


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Bob Woodhead
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 7, 2013 at 10:06:31 pm

YEAH, ok, copy n' pasta into a Favs folder. Good idea. I've have to see if an alias work as good as the real thing?

Since you have to "bake in" custom settings in Motion, it's not as fast as dragging from the TL to a folder, though.

BTW, is everyone putting in their preorders for MacCanPro & 10.1?


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Mark Dobson
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 2:47:36 am

The idea that one can open up a plugin in Motion and save it out under a different name is a good one where that's possible.

However this is not possible for many of the plugins published by Ripple Training or FXFactory where Open in Motion is disabled, possibly to stop people ripping off the ideas wrapped up in the plugins. So slightly strange to see this technique being demonstrated by Mark Spencer.


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 7:55:32 am

Open in Motion is indeed disabled in the FCPX Effects browser for some effects, but you can always open these effects inside the Motion Templates folder to change them and save new custom versions. The only effects you can not change (unless you can write code) are the core AV effects created by Apple (dissolves, wipes...) because these are not published Motion projects.

If you only need to create fav folders for your most-used effects, this is very simple in FCPX. But it's not intuitive because you cannot do it inside the application and you cannot create fav folders for audio effects (yet). I think this will change very soon.

- Ronny


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Mark Dobson
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 8:16:24 am

[Ronny Courtens] "Open in Motion is indeed disabled in the FCPX Effects browser for some effects, but you can always open these effects inside the Motion Templates folder to change them and save new custom versions."

Unfortunately many of the FXfactory and Ripple plugins are locked. It is not possible to open them in Motion.

I took this issue up with both FXfactory and Mark Spencer directly and received pretty unconvincing reasons as to why these FX are not editable.

Mark Spencer said that once his FX are part of the FXfactory package they are not editable and Gabe from Noise Industrys said:

" We are targeting our products based on Motion Templates to Final Cut Pro X users only. Although proficient Motion users may not have the ability to customize the effect, we designed the software with a different goal: no matter which system you run our software on, you are guaranteed that you can reopen a project without running into compatibility problems.

This cannot be said of customized effects: if you were to modify a version of Callouts, the project could not be moved to a different system without installing your version of Callouts. Similarly, users who do not backup their systems regularly, or who just upgraded to a different system, may be asking why a modified effect is not available again after re-installation"

The one line summary is: we traded some flexibility in order to gain predictability and reliability."

Now this just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me and some of the FXFactory FX are editable - maybe they just haven't got round to locking them up.


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Favourites Folder
on Oct 8, 2013 at 8:39:55 am

Hi Mark,

I guess so far I have been lucky being able to modify any FX Factory plugs I needed to modify. But of course I can not certify this works for all of them as I haven't tried them all, so I will take your word for this.

But even if you cannot modify certain templates in Motion you still can add them as Favorites to your FCPX browser.

- Ronny


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Richard Simmons
Re: Favourites Folder - Solution!!!
on Nov 14, 2013 at 12:16:45 am
Last Edited By Richard Simmons on Nov 14, 2013 at 1:39:16 am

I was looking for the solution to this and came across this thread. One thing led to another and I figured out a simple solution.



Go to the Final Cut Pro app, right click and select "Show Package Contents".



The navigate to Contents--> Plugins-->MediaProviders-->MotionEffect.fxp-->Contents-->Resources-->Templates-->Effects.



There I made a new folder called " Favorites" [notice the space before the F] and copied several effects into it.



I then relaunched FCP and there is it, a Favorites Effects folder. There is probably a bit more we can do using this method, this was just my first try.

Hope that helps.


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Sascha Engel
Re: Favourites Folder - Solution!!!
on Nov 14, 2013 at 6:09:58 am

Thanx, I will try that right away! But you can only ad FX on finder level?
You make copies of the FX you put in there?

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Richard Simmons
Re: Favourites Folder - Solution!!!
on Nov 15, 2013 at 2:02:47 am

Yeah, I put copies of the different effects there, just in case it messes something up. Works fine so far though. When I search for an effect, I do see 2 copies come up, but that's not a big deal to me. I haven't tried to make a favorites folder for anything else yet. Seems worth trying.


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James Ewart
Re: Favourites Folder - Solution!!!
on Nov 14, 2013 at 6:49:57 am

Why a space before the 'F' please?


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Sascha Engel
Re: Favourites Folder - Solution!!!
on Nov 14, 2013 at 9:29:39 am

I guess, so the Favourites Folder appears on top of the list in the FX Browser.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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