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Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP

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Micajah Smithson
Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 5:38:53 pm

Is it just me or do you notice the most enthusiastic supporters of X-FCP (a phrase I didn't come up with - but seems appropriate) seem to be a lot of the trainers. With the exception of Richard Harrington, Walter Biscardi and a few others, most of the trainers are promoting the hell out of their new X-FCP training, and "Media Management" books.
More than a few of them had the software a week before the rest of us.
Did they think the "Pros" were going to just accept this?

What do they have to lose? Apple just opened them up to a lot more potential purchasers of their training.


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Stefan Buhrmester
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:08:32 pm

Well... A good teacher needs to be enthusiastic about the stuff that he teaches. A good teacher knows that and it's common teaching practice to make yourself enthusiastic about something in order to be a better teacher. You want your training to be good in order for people to watch it.

Imagine your trainer explains you something with an attitude like "Yeah that's rubbish anyway, just kill yourself." :D


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Andree Franks
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:30:48 pm

cause how would they make money if they tell everybody it sucks!
not saying it does, i am keeping my opinion to myselt until i did a full project and received a crash course on it.



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Stefan Buhrmester
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:36:37 pm

Guys, know what would be awesome?

A training series titled "Honest FCPX training". The teacher would constantly rant and bitch about the bugs and missing features in FCPX, heavily breathing every time he is confronted with one, and show workarounds for them, while concluding every episode with "man this sucks, I might also just go ahead an kill myself".


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Andrew Landini
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 7:04:34 pm

You mean like "You Suck at Photoshop" but instead, "Final Cut Pro X Sucks at You".

Oh man, we're onto something. Call the investors.


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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 5:54:13 pm

[Stefan Buhrmester] "A training series titled "Honest FCPX training". The teacher would constantly rant and bitch about the bugs and missing features in FCPX, heavily breathing every time he is confronted with one, and show workarounds for them, while concluding every episode with "man this sucks, I might also just go ahead an kill myself"."


There was such a beast: it was called Tom Wolsky's 'Final Cut Editing Workshop' and it sold some but was blasted because Tom could be so forthright about things. His comments and asides were sometimes quite barbed and bordered on your proposed training model, Stefan.

It should have sold far more than it did.

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Tom Daigon
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:46:17 pm

A good business person who happens to train others, will see this as a wonderful opportunity to make lots of money as well. Nothing wrong with that, but they have a vested interest in folks wanting to learn the new software. And therefore most wont undermine themselves and the situation.

Tom Daigon
Avid DS / FCP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com


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Shawn Lloyd
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:38:07 pm

Yes, they act as if we're all crazy. Do they not realize that 90% of their piers feel exactly the opposite? Maybe they have too much of a financial stake in the training to be completely honest. Whatever the reason, it seems very disingenuous, and a bit insulting to the collective intelligence of the professional community. Sadly, I feel like both Apple and the evangelist / trainers are all loosing a lot of credibility.


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Richard Cooper
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:40:14 pm

In every situation, there is opportunity, many times multiple opportunities.... the gift is to be able to see through all the crap with a clear vision and actually be able to see it. It is what separates the very successful business people from the rest....
You can liken it to he "gold rush"...
Most of the stampeders toiled away for years never to find any gold at all... Only to leave broken, beaten down and destitute... If they even made it out alive. They were blinded by "gold fever" and missed the "real opportunity" to actually get rich during this time because they could not see the "real opportunity".

The only people that actually made any real money in the "gold rush" were the ones selling services and supplies to the miners. "Mining the miners" so to speak.... It is actually very smart from a business standpoint....

More power to them! They provide a valuable service.... One that people are free to use... Or not.

In general, and not specifically regarding this forum, I have seen that most successful people already have a plan when a roadblock appears and are already in the process of implementing that plan while every one else is running around screaming and complaining and yelling about how bad everything is. This is human nature and certainly NOT unique to FCPX.
One of the things that I have noticed on the Cow this week is a lot of the people I have come to respect over the years here have been noticeably less active than usual... No doubt they are busy implementing their plan and working hard to make sure they remain ahead of the curve when the dust settles and everyone decides to get back to work.

Richard Cooper
FrostLine Productions, LLC
Anchorage, Alaska
http://www.frostlineproductions.com


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Scott Sheriff
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 6:47:10 pm

[Micajah Smithson] "Is it just me or do you notice the most enthusiastic supporters of X-FCP (a phrase I didn't come up with - but seems appropriate) seem to be a lot of the trainers. With the exception of Richard Harrington, Walter Biscardi and a few others, most of the trainers are promoting the hell out of their new X-FCP training, and "Media Management" books.
More than a few of them had the software a week before the rest of us.
Did they think the "Pros" were going to just accept this?

What do they have to lose? Apple just opened them up to a lot more potential purchasers of their training."


No, it's not just you that have noticed that.
It's pretty clear they have a financial dog in the fight. It's too bad most won't own up to it.

Scott Sheriff
Director
http://www.sstdigitalmedia.com

I have a system, it has stuff in it, and stuff hooked to it. I have a camera, it can record stuff. I read the manuals, and know how to use this stuff and lots of other stuff too.
You should be suitably impressed...

"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." ---Red Adair


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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 7:05:47 pm

[Scott Sheriff] "No, it's not just you that have noticed that. It's pretty clear they have a financial dog in the fight. It's too bad most won't own up to it."


It's funny, over the years some people have accused us at the COW of trying to control opinion and I just smile at that. Control the opinion of people like Bob Zelin, Walter Biscardi, Craig Seeman, and hundreds of other COW leaders? You cannot be serious. ;o)

We have lost a lot of leaders over the years because manufacturers and publishers get them to leave by currying favors like getting them onto the beta programs and other things. Many have fallen for it and their opinions become the best that money can buy.

Our goal here at the COW has always been to find a "balanced" discussion, one wherein both the antagonists and the protagonists court as respectful a dialogue as is possible when worlds collide. It doesn't always happen perfectly but over the years, it all balances out and in the end it becomes a discussion in which there is much to learn and draw from.

Yes, we have a financial dog in the fight but one thing about ole Cowdog, he'd bite the crap out of anyone who tries to make him slip on any suit wherein the label reads, "One Size Fits All."

A healthy dairy farm, as I learned growing up on one, is made up of Holsteins, Guernseys, Brown Swiss, Jerseys, Ayrshires, and a few others that strengthen the overall herd as they swap genes, bringing their best characteristics to the whole. You often start with pure breds, but you build your dairy with them to insure that the "destination" of the herd is one in which the gene pool is diverse and strong, protecting it from becoming merely a bunch of sickly in-bred "pure breds."

There's a metaphor in there if you want to discern our strategy in action.

And that, my friends, is what I love best about the COW.

;o)

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Andree Franks
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 7:34:25 pm

I like Walter Biscardi!

All caused by FCPX? lol the power baby

Oh one thing I don#t like about some leaders and users here is the arrogance and how rude they are! :p
got to go...



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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 9:22:29 pm

[Andree Franks] "Oh one thing I don't like about some leaders and users here is the arrogance and how rude they are!"


You find it odd that artists and professionals can sometimes be arrogant, opinionated, and rude? They are people that work in very stressful situations, make decisions in the crucible that often can affect a lot of money, but their confidence and expertise allow them to make decisions that regularly hold up under pressure. They have often built this strength and ability over decades.

Yet, most of the time they are graciously answering people's questions and offering support and do so with great willingness to help others -- even those who are competitors.

I guess you missed that part -- eh, Andree?

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Andree Franks
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 9:59:24 pm

Ronald Lindeboom, your answer to my comment sounds like you felt attacked from em. hmmm?
A course humans are arrogant, opinionated, and rude not matter what situation which many as in myself are and where in.

Besides I am not talking about the them that "most of the time".
Tell me what do you would call if someone asked a simple question and the answer you receive is (What a stupid question)?
Offering support?

Besides you can not defeat competition with knowledge. But your signature quote Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.
which I really like. :)
Mentions how. ;)



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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 5:40:08 pm

[Andree Franks] "Ronald Lindeboom, your answer to my comment sounds like you felt attacked from em. hmmm?"

No, I do not feel threatened or attacked by you. My point is that I think you did a GREAT disservice to the many leaders and members here who have made hundreds of thousands of posts helping people and interacting. Today, there are well over two million posts in the COW and the number of slaps, insults, and barbs, is infinitesimally low.

Sure, there are times when things go awry, but much like travel on major airlines, the percentage is so low we buy our tickets and get on the plane anyway.

At least here when things break down, no one gets killed.

;o)

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Hector berrebi
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 10:27:13 pm

[Shawn Lloyd] "it seems very disingenuous, and a bit insulting to the collective intelligence of the professional community. Sadly, I feel like both Apple and the evangelist / trainers are all loosing a lot of credibility."

Shawn

trainers train people, that's what they do. you would be surprized how many people actually want to learn FCPX

[Shawn Lloyd] "Do they not realize that 90% of their piers feel exactly the opposite?"

90%... how did you come up with these stats, you haven't checked this... you are just writing it out of passion and disappointment.


whether i feel the product is complete, adequate or currently usable in a professional environment does not mean i will stop what i do for a living (partly) and refuse to properly learn it, and offer the best training i can to others who want to as well.

and i will not teach anything that is not true about it...

your comment, and this thread... and some other recent threads in this room
have a mob/posse attitude



[Andree Franks] "Oh one thing I don#t like about some leaders and users here is the arrogance and how rude they are! :p
got to go..."


as long as you are just saying it without valid examples and links... your comment is rude and even a little stupid.




peace and love


hector

Hector Berrebi
prePost Consulting


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Andree Franks
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 10:37:27 pm

Here you go: http://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/335/6038
lol



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Scott Sheriff
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 8:14:39 pm

Ron,
I would agree with what you said. At least 99%/ I'm not sure if you read my 'mommy bloggers rules' thread.
Every product has some spokesperson. Many are paid, some are getting in-kind, or comps. There is no shame in any of that, and it doesn't necessarily invalidate their opinion. But disclosing those relationships, not matter how small gives the rest of us a baseline to go by.
There is a local political talk show host here that always tells the callers "Tell me where you sit, before you tell me where you stand". I like this philosophy.

Scott Sheriff
Director
http://www.sstdigitalmedia.com

I have a system, it has stuff in it, and stuff hooked to it. I have a camera, it can record stuff. I read the manuals, and know how to use this stuff and lots of other stuff too.
You should be suitably impressed...

"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." ---Red Adair


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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 5:50:12 pm

[Scott Sheriff] "Every product has some spokesperson. Many are paid, some are getting in-kind, or comps. There is no shame in any of that, and it doesn't necessarily invalidate their opinion. But disclosing those relationships, not matter how small gives the rest of us a baseline to go by."


We agree, Scott. So much so that in the next issue of Creative COW Magazine we asked every writer to tell us their affiliations, paid relationships, free gear, etc., so that we could ascertain their prejudice in what they were saying. We disclosed it.

We are talking about extending this to the web and making sure that our sponsors and participating companies who have forums here, know that they must tell us who they are "seeding" with gear, etc., so that we can keep things balanced and ethical here at the COW.

Over the years we have done a very good job of this but as markets get more and more desperate, we have seen a few companies use some very clandestine methods to try to get themselves some extra advantage. We have warned them and we plan to get even more aggressive in the days ahead.

People trust the COW and we want to keep it that way.

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Scott Sheriff
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 10:32:41 pm

[Ronald Lindeboom] "Over the years we have done a very good job of this but as markets get more and more desperate, we have seen a few companies use some very clandestine methods to try to get themselves some extra advantage. We have warned them and we plan to get even more aggressive in the days ahead."

That is great. Thanks for keeping it real, as they say.

Scott Sheriff
Director
http://www.sstdigitalmedia.com

I have a system, it has stuff in it, and stuff hooked to it. I have a camera, it can record stuff. I read the manuals, and know how to use this stuff and lots of other stuff too.
You should be suitably impressed...

"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." ---Red Adair


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Sohrab Sandhu
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 9:36:15 pm

[Ronald Lindeboom] "A healthy dairy farm, as I learned growing up on one, is made up of Holsteins, Guernseys, Brown Swiss, Jerseys, Ayrshires, and a few others that strengthen the overall herd as they swap genes, bringing their best characteristics to the whole. You often start with pure breds, but you build your dairy with them to insure that the "destination" of the herd is one in which the gene pool is diverse and strong, protecting it from becoming merely a bunch of sickly in-bred "pure breds.""

Brilliant writing! Very impressed. Reassured too, that i am in safe hands as far as COW is concerend.

Proud to saw COW has been my Godfather in the industry or should it be Godmother? ;-)



Sohrab

2.66 GHz 8-core, ATI Radeon HD 4870,
FCS 3, AJA Kona Lhi



"The creative person wants to be a know-it-all. He wants to know about all kinds of things: ancient history, nineteenth-century mathematics, current manufacturing techniques, flower arranging, and hog futures. Because he never knows when these ideas might come together to form a new idea. It may happen six minutes later or six months, or six years down the road. But he has faith that it will happen." -- Carl Ally


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 12:17:23 am

as one who rants here, and hopefully to god occasionally says something vaguely useful - I trust the cow completely and implicitly; the management of, and voices expressed on, this forum are those of a true town hall.

As far as I can tell, the quoted public discussion of FCPX is, in large part, the discussions and leader pieces taking place on the cow -
god bless this place frankly.

http://www.ogallchoir.net
promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 8:54:14 pm

[Micajah Smithson] "Apple just opened them up to a lot more potential purchasers of their training"

You better believe it - Larry Jordan proudly boasted of the 1.2 million hits ot his website within the first three hours of the release. Can you even begin to imagine how much money that will translate into in earnings for him?

Of course, he's going to be positive - he's just found his goldmine. Doesn't matter what he thinks about the actual product, he's just gonna keep on a-smilin' all the way to the bank!

I can't quite indentify why but I don't like that particular state of affairs.

Simon Ubsdell
Director/Editor/Writer
http://www.tokyo-uk.com


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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 9:30:21 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "You better believe it - Larry Jordan proudly boasted of the 1.2 million hits ot his website within the first three hours of the release. Can you even begin to imagine how much money that will translate into in earnings for him?"


Only 1.2 million "hits" in 3 hours??? We do that kind of traffic in minutes here at the COW, Simon. "Hits" do not mean anything, as a hit can be a page load or any graphic, video, file or anything else on a page (which can be hundreds on a page) -- and most advertising agencies and ad buyers will NOT buy a thing from you based on "hits."

It is a meaningless and totally arbitrary metric that is so outside the realm of quantification that it holds no relevance to people who work in advertising.

Now, "unique visitors," now there's a metric that people will buy and pay for.

All kinds of claims can be made when they are outside 3rd party verification, and that's why I love Google, Alexa and Quantcast, etc.

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Simon Ubsdell
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 9:34:44 pm

[Ronald Lindeboom] "It is a meaningless and totally arbitrary metric"

I think you'll find, Ron, that (aware as I am of the limitations of the indicator) I was speaking rhetorically without due regard for numerical accuracy. What struck me about this story of the 1.2 million hits was Larry's typically self-aggrandizing boasting about it!

Suffice it to say, that whichever way you cut it, Larry (along with the other lucky "trainers" who got advance copies) is going to be making a ton of money out of Apple's decision to create a brand new product ex nihilo.

Simon Ubsdell
Director/Editor/Writer
http://www.tokyo-uk.com


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Craig Shields
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 25, 2011 at 11:18:10 pm

I didn't perceive it that way at all. Jordan was saying that there were more people curious about FCPX than he anticipated. There are a lot who are remaining quite and learning the program before they rush to judgement.



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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 12:22:02 am

yep. you were at the london supermeet? - that man was glowing with financial opportunity.

(I was the one who shouted at him to explain eye matching shots with one viewer - when he was going to drop the question request card referring to it. I'm not proud of it, but that solution he produced was balls.)

http://www.ogallchoir.net
promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Andree Franks
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 1:06:05 am

What was the solution that he produced Aindreas Gallagher?
Just curies...



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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 5:01:09 pm

[Simon Ubsdell] "Suffice it to say, that whichever way you cut it, Larry (along with the other lucky "trainers" who got advance copies) is going to be making a ton of money out of Apple's decision to create a brand new product ex nihilo."

That I agree with, to a point. To be quite honest, people are becoming less and less willing by the day to pay for training. Why? They can use as-I-need-it training from Google for free.

Companies like Total Training, Lynda, Ripple Training, Larry Jordan -- yes, the Creative COW Master Series also -- are finding it harder and harder to sell training. Conferences in industry events also report the same phenomenon.

Last year, thanks to Google searches, we had over 18 million unique people log-in over the year. Most came looking for an answer, found it, and moved on.

This is "training in the cloud." Why buy a disc when the cloud updates daily?

This is the future and people who are professional trainers are going to find it harder and harder to make a living in the days ahead.

And yes, Simon, I agree with you about people posing with the self-aggrandized preening as the unequaled authority on FCP. Some do that, but the smart ones -- like Gary Adcock, Walter Biscardi, Richard Harrington, etc. -- know that as much as they know in this area or that, they are also likely to be found holding hands with another area in which they can learn from an expert with an adjacent area of expertise. No one knows everything about anything, especially in a world that is moving at today's breakneck speed of change.

Thank you for clarifying, Simon. It is appreciated. I'm sorry to have misunderstood your intent.

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Andree Franks
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 6:38:31 pm

I am still a big believer in full training then google knowledge. Like they Jack in all trades Master of none.

Will be starting check out some FCPX training next so I will see how well this new kid is. :D



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Ronald Lindeboom
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 7:53:12 pm

[Andree Franks] "I am still more of a believer in full training than Google knowledge -- the Jack of All Trades, Master of None."

I am, too.

(Though I feel that I must disclose that we sell training tools in the Creative COW Master Series and so my opinion is hardly one without prejudice.) ;)

But as always, it is a case of Different Strokes for Different Folks and from surveys that we have done, it is clear that many people are regularly using "Google training." Partly because it's free, and partly because it's convenient -- but most importantly, it solves the problem at hand for many busy working people.

In that world, it is "good enough."

Best regards,

Ronald Lindeboom
CEO, Creative COW LLC
Publisher, Creative COW Magazine

Creativity is a process wherein the student and the teacher are located in the same individual.

"Incompetence has never prevented me from plunging in with enthusiasm."
- Woody Allen


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Richard Harrington
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 7:57:57 pm

Beautifully said Ron. You make me proud to be a member of this community

Richard M. Harrington, PMP

Author: From Still to Motion, Video Made on a Mac, Photoshop for Video, Understanding Adobe Photoshop, Final Cut Studio On the Spot and Motion Graphics with Adobe Creative Suite 5 Studio Techniques


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Dan Wright
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 26, 2011 at 8:14:11 am

How many jobs do you turn down because you don't believe in it?


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Lucas Werneck
Re: Why most of the the "Trainers" are so positive about X-FCP
on Jun 27, 2011 at 2:22:25 am

Hi folks,
I'm an ACT and participate in many apple trainer forums. I can assure you many like me didn't like this move from apple, and like you we're in the dark.
The thing is that probably the 50million iMovie users that would be transitioning will not "need" training because for iMovie person it's seamless.
The new ones will not have any problem using it for the first time.
Our students were in majority employees and freelancers for companies, production houses and etc. Those will not need a training (at least not many of them) because where they work will not adopt FCPX. I don't think that every trainer is liking this.


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