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Apple In Action Le Mans

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Oliver Peters
Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 12:10:42 am

http://www.apple.com/finalcutpro/in-action/le-mans/

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Bill Davis
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 3:49:31 am

With all the stuff everyone keeps saying is still "missing" in the professional X workflow, I wonder what sorcery they used to get their HD Program onto the XDCAM HD disk and off to air that fast?

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Gary Huff
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 10:22:41 am

[Bill Davis] "With all the stuff everyone keeps saying is still "missing" in the professional X workflow, I wonder what sorcery they used to get their HD Program onto the XDCAM HD disk and off to air that fast?"

Probably via Compressor...but then we're just guessing because (a) we don't know fast "that fast" is, and (b) it doesn't say anything about getting it into XDCAM HD, it's just a blurb on the side.

I don't think there's an "innovative" SEND TO XDCAM HD DISK function.


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Steve Connor
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 10:26:57 am

[Gary Huff] "I don't think there's an "innovative" SEND TO XDCAM HD DISK function."

I believe that deserves what young people call a "LOL"

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Bill Davis
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 2:58:49 pm

Well, if I'm not mistaken, I think the article indicated that they shot the prep, the pits, the race and various and sundry B-roll stuff with multiple camera crews - and had the finished full hour program ready for air the day after the race concluded.

Which would imply a less than 24 hour "wrap to air" turnaround. Sure sports does similar things all the time. But historically with with a bunch of trucks and a legion of people. Looked to me from the photos like this team did it with a small handfull of production people - and a modest sized room with an iMac and a few laptops running X.

The point was really that X handled the crucial extremely fast turn world class sporting event for broadcast (and for theatrical distribution, later!) with aplomb,

"iMovie Pro" is doing pretty nice work, don't you think?

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Sandeep Sajeev
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 5:17:08 pm

Who is still calling it iMovie Pro? No one credible is.

I've been using it for quick turnaround stuff without any issues. There is still resistance to X, but Apple can do more than just occasionally throw out an addition to their In Action page. Look at how Autodesk has marketed and supported Smoke in the last year. Lot's of evangelism, high quality free production based training, active forums etc. They're out there showing off the software with high end demos at every event, just tune in to IBC to see the kind of spots that are getting broken down.

Apple's we're too cool to communicate with the plebs strategy is complete BS.


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Bill Davis
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 7:16:50 pm

[Sandeep Sajeev] "Apple's we're too cool to communicate with the plebs strategy is complete BS."

Well, that's your opinion.

Mine is that Apple's systemic corporate obsession with keeping their development efforts under tight wraps has yielded almost unimaginable value to the company's marketing efforts.

With the added benefit as a publicly traded company, of keeping the SEC happy since their reputation for discretion makes it much harder to accuse them of stock manipulation via selective leaking of market effecting data.

Nothing drives more human interest than three being something the people want to know about - but can't.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Sandeep Sajeev
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 7:35:39 pm

[Bill Davis] "Apple's systemic corporate obsession with keeping their development efforts under tight wraps has yielded almost unimaginable value to the company's marketing efforts."

Yes, we're seeing this unimaginable value play out exactly as planned with the perception around FCPX. You're right, their strategy is working, what they need are more Bill Davis's willing to fight the good fight on their behalf.

I get that you love the software. I do too. It's an Apple product, why not show it some marketing love? How much does it cost to have a presence at some Industry events? It's a drop in the ocean - even in their shrinking proverbial pool of cash. Why don't you fly out users who are passionate about the software to demo their workflows and in doing so debunk some of the myths that still remain? What are you afraid off? Why are you not bothered?

Instead of giving us 2 pages of Tsui Hark's thoughts, why don't you arrange a sit down with him and his editor and have them actually talk about the benefits of using X on their monster feature film. How cool would it be to show the naysayers who moan about not being able to use it to cut whatever it is they're cutting, how Asian cinemas's biggest Action filmmaker is using it to cut his film. We'd get to see the interface loaded up with footage from the film, see the timelines, the keywords, the way they interact with their assists and vfx, and how metadata stays 'pure' through an actual feature pipeline.

That sort of thing would be way more effective than a little blurb on the MacPro page saying a New Version is coming. We know it is, show us why we should care.


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Bill Davis
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 9:17:42 pm

[Sandeep Sajeev] "nstead of giving us 2 pages of Tsui Hark's thoughts, why don't you arrange a sit down with him and his editor and have them actually talk about the benefits of using X on their monster feature film. How cool would it be to show the naysayers who moan about not being able to use it to cut whatever it is they're cutting, how Asian cinemas's biggest Action filmmaker is using it to cut his film. We'd get to see the interface loaded up with footage from the film, see the timelines, the keywords, the way they interact with their assists and vfx, and how metadata stays 'pure' through an actual feature pipeline.
"


Sure that's what YOU want. And it's what maybe I want. But how exactly does that benefit the team making the movie? Or is your idea of modern business that if you figure out how to do something and therefore get a lead on your competitors, the "proper" thing to do is to invite the entire world inside your workflow and therefore save them the time of having to do as much hard work as YOU did, so that they can better compete for the same jobs - but easier!!!

That's a wonderful idea. I'm sure it will catch on fast!

I struggle with this all the time in running my small local FCP-X users group. I try to thread the needle of being helpful and sharing my expertise with my membership - but, I have looked around and seen the SAME people I was helping to learn FCP-X a year ago - now going after the same clients I am.

I'm odd in that I truly enjoy teaching and figure that the karma is worth the risk, but OTOH, let me ask you and all the lurkers here this simple question ... you want all the expertise you can grab from here... but what are you putting BACK into the group? Who have you trained or shared with or helped to overcome their problems with X? Or is your brand going to be simply "show you what you know so I can take that and make things better for myself?"

It's the public forum/users group conundrum.

Everyone wants the people who know MORE than they do to share and share and share - but when it comes time to do the sharing and spread THEIR expertise... well...

Worth thinking about.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Sandeep Sajeev
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 13, 2013 at 9:44:59 pm

How does talking about their workflow harm Tsui Hark and his team? They talk about it on the In Action page. I'm not sure what you mean, unless you're referring to something proprietary, that gives them some hidden earth shattering advantage. Given that Tsui has been making films for donkeys years, using everything from analog editors to Avids, and has always been willing to chat about anything, I'd say it was an opportunity missed.

Anyway, here's something to think about as well: if you pick up the Criterion Collection DVD of Kieslowski's Three Colours : Red, there is a segment which shows him sitting with his editor, the wonderful Jacques Witta, and actually editing the scene in the film where Irene Jacob's character first meets the sick dog, that eventually leads to her meeting the judge. They run the footage through the Steenbeck, backwards and forwards, discussing where to make the actual cut, and the impact that choice would have on the sequence that will follow.

It was fascinating, two master filmmakers at work, talking about something they love.

Flash forward to today at IBC, at the Autodesk booth, 3 Post Production companies showed off their work on high end commercial spots through Autodesk Technical Specialists. They shared production footage, discussed the briefs, walked us through how they pulled off incredibly complex shots, even to the extent of showing and discussing Compositing setups - actual button pushing.

They aren't afraid to share. Autodesk reaches out to them, and they come willingly to demo their work. In fact one guy who spoke today mentioned that on one of his recent jobs he used a technique he'd picked up by watching some one else's demo on the Autodesk site. And these are companies like The Mill, Carbon VFX, Brand New School etc.

Now to respond to your comment about my level of input here on the Cow: I may not be as prolific as you, but I do help out when I can. For what it's worth, X is not the only tool I use, I work in Smoke mainly, and a lot of my posting happens on the Autodesk forums (on their site). I also try and pop in to the Motion forum regularly. Having said that, I'm sorry if you feel my lower post count invalidates my opinion, it's a pity but I guess it is what it is.

Best,
Sandeep.


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Marcus Moore
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 14, 2013 at 1:00:31 am

I have to say I agree with Sandeep on this. Apple is selling a moving picture tool- these In Action stories, exactly as they are, would be INFINITELY more effective with Apple's Video Team's particular verve and style. You know, like the old ones with the Cohen Bros or David Fincher.

Unlike some people who scoffed at some of the In Action subjects, I think they're all very valid case studies in the varied outlets for video production. But as anyone who uses and likes it knows, FCPX demos best when you can see it working, and that you can't do in a text article, no matter how deftly written.

I know from reliable people that the FCPX dev team IS engaging people in LA, testing workflows... But those don't help public perception because people don't know about it. Apple doesn't demo development.

IF FCPX 10.1 is a big update in the software, I hope Apple takes it as a fresh start to engage the public. I've long said the perception of deficiencies in the software will LONG outlast the point where those criticisms are valid. If the software is up to it, even if Apple does nothing that will change, but it would happen a lot quicker if they were more active in engaging the audience.



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Rafael Amador
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 14, 2013 at 3:43:45 am

[Bill Davis] "Sure that's what YOU want. And it's what maybe I want. But how exactly does that benefit the team making the movie? Or is your idea of modern business that if you figure out how to do something and therefore get a lead on your competitors, the "proper" thing to do is to invite the entire world inside your workflow and therefore save them the time of having to do as much hard work as YOU did, so that they can better compete for the same jobs - but easier!!! "
This is what people have been doing at The COW for years.
rafael


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 14, 2013 at 4:29:34 am

[Bill Davis] "Sure that's what YOU want. And it's what maybe I want. But how exactly does that benefit the team making the movie? Or is your idea of modern business that if you figure out how to do something and therefore get a lead on your competitors, the "proper" thing to do is to invite the entire world inside your workflow and therefore save them the time of having to do as much hard work as YOU did, so that they can better compete for the same jobs - but easier!!! "

But this goes on all the time. I have a shelf full of books and DVDs that are all about editing or aspects of post production (some conceptual in nature and others more nuts & bolts) and sites like Video Copilot (or various YouTube channels) give away vast amounts of knowledge with their free tutorials.

Me, personally, I'm an open book. I've informally taught dozens of other editors in person and I'll talk about things like workflow development, asset management, etc., until the cows come home if you let me. Online I contribute to a variety of different forums and I'm working on a blog that will be partly about workflow development and nuts & bolts aspects of post. I guess I don't fear giving away my 'secret sauce' because my secret sauce is my experience, ever-expanding-knowledge, resourcefulness and adaptability.

For example, just because I tell someone exactly how I developed a workflow for situation X doesn't mean it will work for situation Y or Z. New software comes down the pipe, codecs change, there are always new variables and people that just glean knowledge from others (as opposed to thinking critically and building their own knowledge base) will always end up behind because they can't adapt. They can mimic what they've been shown but toss a new variable in their way and the wheels fall off the bus.

I won't develop a workflow for someone else for free, but I have no problems fielding questions or detailing things I've done in the past. Hell, I tell other editors about jobs I find even if I'm applying for them myself (let the best person win!).




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Bill Davis
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 14, 2013 at 10:16:22 am

Look, I'm not taking anyone to task here and definitely not Sandeep. The very fact that he's posting here already puts him in the typical 1% of forum participants who do more than just lurk.

And I, for one, am delighted to spar with people who think I've got it all wrong. I've noted before that it's harder to learn and grow if one is surrounded by people who dont challenge assumptions and all think alike.

So maybe saying stuff like this will plant the seed for more people to be more active?

If you come here regularly to learn - think also about whether or not you also have something to share.

Sure we get testy and debate everything. But that's part of the fun!

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Walter Soyka
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 14, 2013 at 10:50:54 am

[Andrew Kimery] " I'm working on a blog that will be partly about workflow development and nuts & bolts aspects of post."

Looking forward to this! I've been developing something similar in my spare time, though more focused on compositing. Maybe we should talk.


[Andrew Kimery] "I guess I don't fear giving away my 'secret sauce' because my secret sauce is my experience, ever-expanding-knowledge, resourcefulness and adaptability."

+1.

Like you, my value comes from figuring out solutions for the present problem at hand, not having figured out one problem some time ago. What I did yesterday is not what I'll do tomorrow. Anybody can execute canned solutions, but it's worth a lot more to be able to figure out what to do in a new situation.

I am not worried about running out of new problems.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Oliver Peters
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 15, 2013 at 4:46:32 pm

One thing that didn't dawn on me until just now, is that this "In Action" story was specifically timed to coincide with IBC. It's a European story intended to speak to editors beyond just a US focus. Since Apple has no official IBC presence, this is in a sense, their substitute.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 16, 2013 at 3:03:59 pm

Yes, they do this every year. As FCPX is clearly catching on over here we will probably see many more of these testimonies, and not only coinciding with events.

- Ronny


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Andrew Kimery
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 16, 2013 at 8:12:22 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Looking forward to this! I've been developing something similar in my spare time, though more focused on compositing. Maybe we should talk."

I'll make a blog entry titled "The Best Workflow for Compositing" and it will just be a link to your blog!

It's weird I've actually been writing the blog on and off for a couple of years but I haven't gotten to the point where I feel comfortable presenting it to the world. I think I'm getting close though and I'm trying to pre-write more posts so that even when I'm swamped with work I can update the blog with evergreen content.

[Walter Soyka] "I am not worried about running out of new problems."

On some gigs I wish I could run out of problems. lol




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al ellis
Re: Apple In Action Le Mans
on Sep 16, 2013 at 2:05:50 pm

And it'd all be faster sagain on an evs.


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