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Premiere Pro CC impressions

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Andy Field
Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 3:15:32 pm

If you liked FCP 7...you will love Premiere Pro CC -- everything that didn't work quite right in CS6 is fixed in this release. Yes FCP X users, please hold off on the flames...this isn't a slam on that program (we use it for it's terrific multicam when that comes up)......but this is the OR NOT part of this forum and for people still looking for a replacement NLE -- if you are comfortable in FCP 7..you'll be right at home in PP CC

The good

Titles, no trans-coding anything....all of the functionality you liked in FCP is there - paste attributes...a useable keyframeable audio mixer...tracks you can layout as you please.....dynamic linking to After Effects, Photoshop, Audition....you can even use all the keyboard shortcuts you know in FCP (there's a set you can select) If you're coming from AVID -- you can select those keyboard shortcuts instead. Superior motion keyframe control...adjustment layers.....if you know FCP 7...you can be up to speed with PP CC in less than an hour.

Yes, there are scores of people ticked off about the subscription model - i'd prefer perpetual license...but the cost per month is miniscule compared to the time saved and money made from this program. Adobe hit a home run with this.


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Chuck Pelini
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 3:20:40 pm

Meh


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Andy Field
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 3:35:47 pm

and the first thoughtful reply arrives

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Chris Harlan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 4:15:53 pm

Hey, look. Chuck has spoken. Its time to move on.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 3:45:07 pm

[Andy Field] "If you liked FCP 7...you will love Premiere Pro CC -- everything that didn't work quite right in CS6 is fixed in this release. Yes FCP X users, please hold off on the flames...this isn't a slam on that program (we use it for it's terrific multicam when that comes up)"

For someone who cuts multicam all the time this, more than the hated subscription, is the deal breaker. It's amazing how Adobe can be blind to certain things - it took them almost 8 years to get stereo vs mono audio done correctly and they still can't seem to figure out multicam, even though proper models abound (Avid, FCP7, FCPX). As much as I would like to use PPro for so many reasons, Adobe keeps finding ways to shut me out.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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alban egger
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 1:00:31 pm

[Herb Sevush] "For someone who cuts multicam all the time this, more than the hated subscription, is the deal breaker. "

Did you watch this multicam demo:







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Herb Sevush
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 2:12:01 pm

[alban egger] "Did you watch this multicam demo: "

I hadn't seen it before, so thank you. I didn't need to see it to know that X's multicam feature is the best that currently exists.

Unfortunately this demo, like most multicam demos, uses a live performance piece as the example, and live performance cutting is the most rudimentary form of multicam editing. The demo guy was ohhing and ahhing over stuff, like sliding edits and overlapping audio, that any multicam ever created could do.

On the other hand the angle editor's ability to handle discontinuous shooting within an angle makes my mouth water. I'm still considering X for my future work precisely for this reason, even though the magnetic timeline is totally anathema to my way of working (auditions and compound clips excluded).

10.1 and the pricing of the new MacPro will have a big influence on that decision.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 3:59:53 pm

Andy,

I think you forgot to post the second part of your impressions:

The bad

(-:

- Ronny


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Morten Ranmar
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 4:20:20 pm

Yes it is true it has nice features, and we use it. But it is very buggy, and the 3way color corrector is almost useless.

- No Parking Production -

2 x Finalcut Studio3, 2 x Prod. bundle CS6, 2 x MacPro, 2 x ioHD, Ethernet File Server w. X-Raid.... and FCPX on trial


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Chris Harlan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 4:31:42 pm

[Morten Ranmar] "But it is very buggy"

I'm experiencing this, as well.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 4:30:52 pm

[Andy Field] "Adobe hit a home run with this.
"


For me, yeah. I like it. I don't do multicam often, and the subscription doesn't bother me terribly. I did find that, with the particular blend of speed changes and gfx I was using on my last project, I was crashing a lot. Recover was swift, and I seldom lost anything.

I do enjoy working with it. Its got the flexibility that FCP7 had in terms of arranging bins and multiple time lines, and the pliancy of interface, once you get used to it, is very impressive. I think Avid is still, marginally, a better cutter, though I haven't completely plumbed this version of Pr, so I can't say for sure.

Right now, I'm working Pr, MC, and FCP7, though I'm very close to letting FCP7 go for my own uses.


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Andy Field
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 5:19:31 pm

As for crashing, we've experienced very few if any - and they are always related to an add on plug in.....

and have you tried their new multicam in this version? It is much improved and I think will sync on sound

the Bad?

a few minor things -- one I'd like them to fix is being able to cut and paste transitions...this doesn't seem possible now

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Shane Ross
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 5:56:30 pm

Working native is fine in some instances, and I love it for that. But transcoding to good, solid, workable codecs is a necessity in many cases. ProRes is far easier to edit than AVCHD, even with CUDA and RAM.

BAD: Media Management still needs a lot of work. But that's a drawback to working native...tracking media. And doing things like managing a sequence to only reference the footage used in the cut...PPro can't do that. And built in color correction isn't there yet either, I still rely on Colorista 2...which is great. Speedgrade...can't monitor out via AJA or BMD yet, so it's useless.

I love a lot about this version...And would totally use it given the chance to use anything I want on a project (currently working on client systems...Avid)...except the subscription ONLY model stops me dead in my tracks. I'll never support that model. GREAT app, horrid distribution method. Good thing is that I have other options...

But I do like the PPRO CC 7.0.1 a lot. Dammit.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:22:07 pm

I agree about transcoding - I'm loving Adobe Media Encoder for batching tons of files using a custom preset - easier and faster than Compressor or you can use Prelude if you want to change file names, metadata etc.

Yeah I find the 3-way corrector in CC completely useless, I use the Fast Corrector for quick scoping of levels and saturation but no one has been able to create a simple yet powerful 3 way corrector like we had in FCP 7. Colorista is great but I find i don't get very good real-time performance out of any of the Red Giant tools even though I like them.

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Downtown Long Beach, California
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1680680/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1


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Walter Soyka
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:34:13 pm

[Shane Ross] "BAD: Media Management still needs a lot of work. But that's a drawback to working native...tracking media. And doing things like managing a sequence to only reference the footage used in the cut...PPro can't do that. And built in color correction isn't there yet either, I still rely on Colorista 2...which is great. Speedgrade...can't monitor out via AJA or BMD yet, so it's useless."

I'd agree that media management does still seem a bit weak.

The new Pr CC relink window is miles better than the CS6 relink hell.

Pr's Project Manager can trim projects [link], but not for long-GOP formats.

I'm still a bit of a novice at SpeedGrade, but I had been using a calibration LUT for my profiled 10-bit HP monitor for accurate color on CS6 without the NVIDIA SDI daughter card. CC added support for supported AJA and Matrox cards via Mercury Transmit (though I have no idea which ones).

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Steve Connor
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:50:53 pm

[Walter Soyka] "I'm still a bit of a novice at SpeedGrade,"

Proper round tripping to Speedgrade would at least make up for the poor CC tools in PPro, I would imagine this would be added at some point.

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Walter Soyka
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 8:04:06 pm

[Steve Connor] "Proper round tripping to Speedgrade would at least make up for the poor CC tools in PPro, I would imagine this would be added at some point."

I've filed my feature request.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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John Pale
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 3:37:12 am

[Shane Ross] "Speedgrade...can't monitor out via AJA or BMD yet, so it's useless."

This is not correct. Speedgrade now uses Mercury Transmit in Adobe CC. I use it over my Kona 3 just fine.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:08:44 pm

[Andy Field] " one I'd like them to fix is being able to cut and paste transitions...this doesn't seem possible now"

But, you can! Put your cursor over the trans., select the trans., copy the trans. Put you cursor over the cut where you want to paste, select it, make sure the track is selected, paste.


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Andy Field
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 10:11:36 pm

tried it - didn't work

on timline - a wipe transition --

I select the transition (there's no control click copy - you have to go to edit menu and copy)

go to new transition point (that track IS SELECTED AS WELL AS TARGETED)

Put cursor on transition point - it selects - go to paste - only option is PASTE INSERT - and it just inserts last viewer clip

What am i doing wrong?

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Chris Harlan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 11:15:06 pm

[Andy Field] "What am i doing wrong?"

I believe I can tell you exactly, because it is the same thing the flummoxed me at first. Make sure the track your are pasting to is selected, and then regular paste will suddenly be available in the menu.


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Matt Galuszewski
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 30, 2013 at 12:24:19 am

It works on a Mac here.

I select the transition and press COMMAND C to copy

I then position the CTI over the cut and target the tracks I want to apply the transition to.

I then press COMMAND V to paste



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Herb Sevush
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:14:06 pm

[Andy Field] "have you tried their new multicam in this version? It is much improved and I think will sync on sound"

Anyone can sync on sound using Plural Eyes. It's nice to have it as part of the internal ap, but most of my work is in studio where Time Code sync is expected, so that feature is not such a big deal in my situation.

I tried the new multicam when Adobe first posted it on the cloud and it still sucked - I've heard that they have since added the missing match back features in later updates, so that's an improvement. But they still don't seem to comprehend that it is essential to create a multicam clip that can be manipulated exactly as any other clip but with the added feature of having multiple angles. They still seem to think of multicam as some sort of filter instead of as an object in itself. The fact that at this point in time their multicam implementation still can't handle discontinuous shooting just shows how little they understand the needs of a multicam editor. They need to take a serious look at the FCPX multicam feature and understand that they have to at least come up to that level, if not exceed it. It can't be that hard, discreet *edit could do this sort of stuff 10 years ago.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:14:26 pm

Yeah I don't think I've crashed once since June, maybe because I'm running it on Win 7 Pro?

I do agree, Option dragging transitions was a staple for me in FCP 7, needs to be added to CC for sure.

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Downtown Long Beach, California
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1680680/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1


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Justin Ferar
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 12:02:51 am

4 projects in (coming from FCP7) I cannot make Premiere CC crash- even if I try. This on a MacPro.

To my astonishment it even plays back some of my Motion projects in realtime right in the timeline.

Audio Clip Mixer is great except the last key frame doesn't stay where you left the fader. It snaps back to the point where you first touched the fader- this is plain old dumb.

True- no transcoding if you don't want to but snappiness lags and then you have super long transcodes at the end if you want edited masters (and who doesn't ?). But that's what Media Encoder is for and it works well in the background.

For God's sake you can finally adjust the volume of a clip in the source window so you don't get blown out of the edit chair on playback.

Bad: You still have to select the tracks in the timeline before you do the "add edit" command. This is also just dumb. You should be able to just lasso the clips in the timeline and then add edit.

Very BAD: I haven't figured out a way to select a group or batch of commonly used effects and then drop them onto a clip. Even if you've created a preset folder you can't just grab the folder and drop it on the clip. You have to shift click each one and then drag and drop. Stupid.

Bottom line for me is that FCPX is not an option until GenArts brings Sapphire to the table.



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Kevin Monahan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 12:21:46 am

[Justin Ferar] "Bad: You still have to select the tracks in the timeline before you do the "add edit" command. "

Justin,
You might try "Add Edit to All Tracks." It will place an Add Edit without track selection. However, it will place an add edit where you might not want one. Make a feature request if you like.

If you want to save multiple effects as a single preset, make a feature request. That would be a good one: http://www.adobe.com/go/wish

Thanks,
Kevin

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe Systems, Inc.
Follow Me on Twitter!


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Justin Ferar
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 4:58:17 pm

Thanks kevin- already made the request twice. Once for cs6 and for cc.

Paul answered the problem regarding adding multiple effects- something I didn't know PP could do!



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Paul Neumann
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 3:28:43 am

Re: Very BAD

You can save any number of effects as a single preset that can be applied to multiple clips. So say you put a scale, transparency/blend, ccr, blur and audio EQ on a clip you can then highlight them (command click) in the effects control panel, right click and save the preset. It will save all of them together as one preset.


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Justin Ferar
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 4:53:34 pm

Paul- you are the man! Although it seems funny that one can't just grab the folder with stacked effects and drag it over to a clip.

Thanks for the tip though. This will make me sleep better at night.



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Andy Field
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 30, 2013 at 8:00:20 pm

Outstanding tip - thanks!

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Kevin Monahan
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 31, 2013 at 1:38:19 am

The cool thing is that in Premiere Pro, the effects retain the same stacking order that you saved them in. In FCP filter packs, the filters would reorganize according to alpha numeric order when you save them as Favorites. You would have to rename them alpha numerically to make them stay in the same order, if I recall correctly. As most of you know, when your effects/filters are out of order, you can get a wildly different effect.

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe Systems, Inc.
Follow Me on Twitter!


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Iain Anderson
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Dec 4, 2013 at 1:07:59 pm

GenArts already makes Sapphire for FCP X:

http://www.genarts.com/software/sapphire-edge/final-cut

Free trial if you want to give it a go?


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Justin Ferar
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Dec 4, 2013 at 3:58:38 pm

Hi Lain,

You are referring to "Sapphire Edge" which is not even close to the full Sapphire suite. $400 vs $2400. It's just a bunch of barely customizable quick pre-sets.

I asked GenArts if they plan on supporting X with the full suite and they basically said no current plans.



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Iain Anderson
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Dec 4, 2013 at 11:37:05 pm

Ah, got it. I guess if you're really happy with the plug-ins you'd want to keep using them, but from the outside, them seem expensive for what you get. Clearly I'm biased, as I create promo and tutorial videos for CoreMelt, but CoreMelt Complete looks like it overlaps quite a bit. If you really can't find what you're looking for, the ability to roll-your-own FCP X effects/transitions/titles in Motion is incredibly helpful.


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alban egger
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 11:11:47 am

[Andy Field] "If you liked FCP 7...you will love Premiere Pro CC -- everything that didn't work quite right in CS6 is fixed in this release. Yes FCP X users, please hold off on the flames...this isn't a slam on that program (we use it for it's terrific multicam when that comes up)......but this is the OR NOT part of this forum and for people still looking for a replacement NLE -- if you are comfortable in FCP 7..you'll be right at home in PP CC"

First of all: I have asked to change the name of the forum, because it has turned into an Adobe PR tool long ago. FCPX has not much to do with it.

Second: If you are comfortable in FCP7.....you will feel right at home in Edius or Media100 or SpeedRazor....because they have tracks. Heck, Edius5 already blew FCP7 out of the water in basically every regard you mention (as long as you don´t directlink to AE or don´t need too many effects and plugins).

If you use FCPX you wonder how you ever could feel comfortable in FCP7...it is extremely clumsy, slow and dumb (you need to tell it constantly what you want to do by toggling stuff on/off). So feeling comfortable in FCP has nothing to do which NLE you will want to use in 5 years. To go that route, "just because" you are in your comfort zone, is very shortsighted as a business and professional.

I am also a cameraman and I played with an early Nikon SLR that shot film (terrible quality) in 2007 I believe. That was way out of the comfortzone as a film production: wacky codec, soft image, basically impossible to judge focus, no audio sync...even the picture didn´t have a constant framerate. But you know what....I knew this was where the puck went. And in 2008 Canon came and we all know every camera now got its path paved by the DSLR revolution.

If you "go where the puck is"...then PP CC might still be your choice, because of certain aspects like tracks, or rather more the direct link to other programs (which we REALLY miss in FCPX), but "feel right at home.....bad argument. IMO FCPX is going where the puck goes. And Apple leads the way. They are following the trend of tapeless, metadata-based production and they do it with a modular package starting below $ 300, so even kids have it for their GoPro films while I can mix GoPro-drone shots with RedRAW images in a 4K timeline. So the entry-level is low financial and in terms of learning curve. And that will help Apple to get into the market as well, because nowadays films are not only edited in studios, but in basically every marketing office. And to be afraid of that as an editor or to say it can´t be professional then is nothing else than being arrogant and unrealistic. They will still hire us for the bigger jobs, but they will cut their Twitter and Facebook clips in telephones and on office-iMacs. So the sheer marketpenetration of FCPX will overwhelm the competitors very fast.

Does this help us professionals? Not necessarily....I agree. But the modular design will allow Apple and developers to give us all we need.



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Bernard Newnham
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 12:00:21 pm

[alban egger] "If you "go where the puck is"...then PP CC might still be your choice, because of certain aspects like tracks, or rather more the direct link to other programs (which we REALLY miss in FCPX), but "feel right at home.....bad argument. IMO FCPX is going where the puck goes. And Apple leads the way. They are following the trend of tapeless, metadata-based production and they do it with a modular package starting below $ 300, "


I think a really good way to tell "where the puck is" is to go to the exhibitions. Walk round IBC or NAB and see what the stands who are selling something else are using as an editor. A few years ago it was all FCP. Now - difficult to say from BVS in London. Perhaps someone going to IBC in Amsterdam will offer some insight, though I think it might still turn out to be fragmented.

Bernie


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Herb Sevush
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 12:16:51 pm

[alban egger] "First of all: I have asked to change the name of the forum, because it has turned into an Adobe PR tool long ago. FCPX has not much to do with it."

It is no more an Adobe PR tool than it is an Apple PR tool. As for the forum name, well you can ask, and you can be heard, but sometimes the answer is still no.

[alban egger] "you will feel right at home in Edius or Media100 or SpeedRazor....because they have tracks. Heck, Edius5 already blew FCP7 out of the water in basically every regard you mention (as long as you don´t directlink to AE or don´t need too many effects and plugins)."

Yes, they are the same as long as you don't need anything - Media 100 and Speed Razor are EOL, Edius is PC only with limited multicam, plug-ins and no direct link to AE - yes they are all quite similar to PPro.

[alban egger] "So the entry-level is low financial and in terms of learning curve. And that will help Apple to get into the market as well, because nowadays films are not only edited in studios, but in basically every marketing office. And to be afraid of that as an editor or to say it can´t be professional then is nothing else than being arrogant and unrealistic. "

The only person on this thread talking about X being unprofessional is you.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Andy Field
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 29, 2013 at 3:29:34 pm

Alban, thanks for refraining from the expected flame

[ALBAN EDGAR]"To go that route, "just because" you are in your comfort zone, is very shortsighted as a business and professional.

Why do you need to denigrate other opinions to feel good about your choosing FCP X -- my note said not a single disparaging remark about X....yet instead of acknowledging that someone might have a different opinion...you chose to shoot it down.

Enjoy your NLE....have fun skating to your puck.....some of us simply need to hit the puck that's in front of us.

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Oliver Peters
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 30, 2013 at 12:20:23 am

For some recent reviews of mine - Premiere Pro CC and Media Composer 7:

http://www.creativeplanetnetwork.com/2-pop/news/inside-creative-cloud-postp...

http://www.creativeplanetnetwork.com/2-pop/news/avid-evolves-its-nonlinear-...

FWIW - these are not intended to represent "better than" or "worse than" in comparison to FCP X or anything else. Just the current state of things and how they apply for those who like or are interested in these applications.

I like them both, but personally I'm still on FCP X for everything I'm currently doing.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Cameron Clendaniel
Re: Premiere Pro CC impressions
on Aug 30, 2013 at 3:25:01 pm

I have some small (but annoying) gripes (ie. fades to black when using GPU hardware acceleration are not smooth), but on the whole it's a great NLE. Fast, flexible, and stable on a MacPro 5,1. Love the UI. Monitoring using Kona LHi is smooth. I've been using the DNxHD 220x sequence preset for all edits. No transcoding of media. Render then export using sequence settings using preview render files to an MXF file and it FLIES. AME is also very fast compressing the MXF to MP4, etc.

Cameron Clendaniel
Film Editor, NYC
718-254-8027
cam@camclendaniel.com
http://www.camclendaniel.com



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