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Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?

COW Forums : Apple Final Cut Pro X Debates

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Fiona Fuchs
Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 2:16:44 pm

So I have been super busy being an Editor and have largely had to ignore the great debate because I am making good money doing fun projects on FCP7 - none of my clients have upgraded (some of them use Premiere Pro in tandem) so I haven't had to worry.

BUT I find myself with time this week and feel like I should be keeping my tools sharp.

SO which way to go? X - Premiere - Avid?

I'm not sure I've ever seen a job advertised for an X editor, but then again same goes for Premiere.

I'm used to working on many different sets as I'm a freelancer so it's imperative that I keep current - but what is current?

I know this has been going around - but has the dust settled?


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Oliver Peters
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 3:06:36 pm

[Fiona Fuchs] "SO which way to go? X - Premiere - Avid?"

All of the above.

Seems a bit market-dependent. I'm in Cen Fl and most of the production companies and agencies moving away from FCP are switching to Premiere (and the rest of the Cloud). Only a few individual users of X. Avid for the shops still using Avid and still a lot of FCP6/7 around. Clearly Adobe has the momentum for folks not turned off by the subscription business model.

OTOH, if you are in NYC or LA, then it's still largely Avid at bigger places.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:28:03 pm

That's what's happening here in Amsterdam too. I mostly work with agencies so I need to follow suit, but I want the tools to keep up with the post houses.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 3:33:57 pm

[Fiona Fuchs] "BUT I find myself with time this week and feel like I should be keeping my tools sharp."

On the one hand I could suggest reading a good book, for the sharpest tool you will surely need is your mind. I'd recommend anything by J.M. Coetze or Philip K Dick for starters, but I'm sure you have your own favorites to pursue.

As for NLE's, the most logical choice for any FCP editor is Avid if your interested in marketing yourself as a freelance editor. It might be a boring answer but it's true.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:30:11 pm

Not boring - but tricky as many agencies (usually my direct clients) don't have avid in-house. You've convinced me though - I'm finally going to do it.


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Mark Dobson
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 3:55:41 pm

[Fiona Fuchs] "I'm not sure I've ever seen a job advertised for an X editor, but then again same goes for Premiere."

Strangely enough there was an advertisement for a FCPX editor to work on a photo montage sequence for a major awards party after Wimbledon 2 weeks ago.
They were offering £250 (plus expenses I think) So whilst not top rates for a days work not the national minimum wage either.

And a while back Wired Sussex posted a job for a FCPX editor. So there are some opportunities for those with FCPX under their belts.

If I were a freelance editor I would definitely take time out to learn FCPX - and it is deceptively difficult to learn.

But Herb and Oliver's advice is sound - learn the lot and especially Avid.

For myself FCPX is just fine, I'm used to awkward workarounds and I could not live without skimming, compound clips, the event library and even . . . . the magnetic timeline.

Apple have done a great unfinished job and were it not for the carcrash of a launch many more people would be using it.

It's time is yet to come, and it will.


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 4:24:00 pm

In our company and in some other broadcast houses I know in Europe you don't get a job unless you know FCPX. But as a freelancer it's Avid for sure.



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Nicholas Zimmerman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 6:16:48 pm

Here in Dallas it's still a crapshot between FCP7, Premiere, and FCPX. Avid's gained some popularity here, but what's really surprising is how big FCPX has become. The Dallas Observer, The Dallas Morning News, and our ABC affiliate WFAA have all jumped in head first with FCPX. I've seen a really surprising number of web and broadcast jobs the last six months for FCPX. Our local FCPUG has 80%+ switched to X.

--------------------------
Avid MC, PPro CS6, FCP7 - wasting away on my SSD.
I just can't quit X.
--------------------------


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Oliver Peters
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 6:19:52 pm

[Nicholas Zimmerman] "The Dallas Observer, The Dallas Morning News, and our ABC affiliate WFAA have all jumped in head first with FCPX"

If you analyze how X is designed and built, it excels at fast-turnaround, news-oriented productions. So broadcast news and web extensions for print operations seem like a natural.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Rich Rubasch
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 6:34:30 pm

"If you analyze how X is designed and built, it excels at fast-turnaround, news-oriented productions. So broadcast news and web extensions for print operations seem like a natural."

Interesting, because the Newscutter was Avid's bread and butter....was Apple being simply genius by secretly going after the news guys (lower cost than AVID and perhaps less headaches) all along?

Here we've been bashing or applauding Apple for this new tool that wasn't meant for any of us really..but rather the news outlets...not that would move some product if it took off. Every producer and editor at a news outlet would have a copy.

Ker-ching.

Rich Rubasch
Tilt Media Inc.
Video Production, Post, Studio Sound Stage
Founder/President/Editor/Designer/Animator
http://www.tiltmedia.com


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Nicholas Zimmerman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 6:46:29 pm

I would say for Doc and News work there isn't anything better at the moment than FCPX. The keywording and skimming are incredibly powerful for ripping through hours of footage in little to no time, and with Motion's integrated lower thirds, the editor has fast access to customizable mograph.

I also think the commercial workflow is really nice in FCPX, using Auditions to test multiple versions of the same cuts.

My favorite things I've cut in X haven't fallen into either of those categories though, they've been narrative shorts. I've cut two so far in X and both went very smoothly. They went to Pro Tools for audio sweetening and Resolve for color without any issues. What I'm trying to get at, is that at the moment, X seems to be pretty versatile. I'd say it's ready to do the heavy lifting, just not many are really using it for that yet.

--------------------------
Avid MC, PPro CS6, FCP7 - wasting away on my SSD.
I just can't quit X.
--------------------------


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Oliver Peters
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 6:47:32 pm

[Rich Rubasch] "was Apple being simply genius by secretly going after the news guys (lower cost than AVID and perhaps less headaches) all along"

I'm not sure Apple had any plan for a specific market. They designed a tool that they felt worked for modern file-based production. It just happens that this aligns with certain types of operations.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:37:12 pm

I can see how the X workflow makes total sense in some ways - but I felt they were arrogant and stole my tools. From one day to the next no support was available. I was on the first day of a job in London and they needed FCP7 for the prores capabilities, and they just couldn't get it, from one day to the next.



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Craig Seeman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 8:14:45 pm

[Oliver Peters] "I'm not sure Apple had any plan for a specific market. "

Although considering Motion's rigging and publishing it "almost" seems like a conscious feature decision for work environments with enforced style guides. That that was prioritized over round tripping (granted there may other reasons for that) can cause one to think that a station news environment or corporate environment might have been a consideration.



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Walter Soyka
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 8:55:15 pm

[Craig Seeman] "Although considering Motion's rigging and publishing it "almost" seems like a conscious feature decision for work environments with enforced style guides. That that was prioritized over round tripping (granted there may other reasons for that) can cause one to think that a station news environment or corporate environment might have been a consideration."

Is anybody here actually using this in production? I have yet to run across this in the real world, and it'd be nice for some of the work I do.

I looked into rigging an animated identity/branding set [link] earlier this year, but we ended up going with Ae instead of Motion for other reasons.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Nicholas Zimmerman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:18:45 pm

I love the rigging and publishing aspects and use it all the time. My buddies will call me and ask if I know of a plugin to do XYZ, and if I don't know of a free one I'll just make one in motion and email it to them.

--------------------------
Avid MC, PPro CS6, FCP7 - wasting away on my SSD.
I just can't quit X.
--------------------------


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Walter Soyka
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 10:33:05 pm

[Nicholas Zimmerman] "I love the rigging and publishing aspects and use it all the time. My buddies will call me and ask if I know of a plugin to do XYZ, and if I don't know of a free one I'll just make one in motion and email it to them."

No doubt, rigging/publishing is a brilliant feature with immensely powerful possibilities.

I wasn't asking about using it to make quick freebie plugins, though, but rather extensive design systems for branding. As Craig points out, this would be a natural use for rigging/publishing, but I haven't seen it in the wild yet in my little corner of the world and I'm curious to hear if there are any other designers on board with M5.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 25, 2013 at 9:04:09 pm

[Walter Soyka] "extensive design systems for branding."

I remember us talking about that a bit back - controlled brand deployment to third parties really does seem like a natural use case for rigging and publishing. same here tho, I've actually never seen motion in the wild over here.

the closest I've seen is the brand toolkit for Price Waterhouse Cooper, you get all their master files - I mucked around with all their mograph assets doing a job recently - but it was, of course, AE stuff with colour coded locked layers. I duly set about unlocking them... mwaa ha ha ha...

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Charlie Austin
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:26:53 pm

[Oliver Peters] "f you analyze how X is designed and built, it excels at fast-turnaround, news-oriented productions."

It excels at fast-turnaround anything really. Cutting trailers and TV spots for features really is great in X. I guess I'm in the 2% subset of the "Hollywood 2%" Shane references above that actually prefers cutting in X.

Forgive my rant but... The silly thing here in my little Hollywood niche is how misinformed people still are regarding X. Here's what it can't do yet: Allow multiple users to share Events/Projects concurrently. If you need that use MC. There's this popular belief that X can't share projects at all though. But X can do sneakernet project/event sharing like FCP 7/Pr quite easily. It requires about 3 extra steps compared to the "old" way, but it's easy.

I'm not gonna say X is perfect, it isn't. But most everything, as far as getting your cut done, really does work the same once you get used to it, which isn't instantaneous. :-) X does need 3'rd party apps if you need EDL's/ AAF's. A little digression...

X2Pro's Role handling has made getting elements to a mix so much easier than it ever was in track based NLE's. I know this doesn't apply to everyone, but I need to work fast. Pre-X, in FCP 7 or whatever, I'm not spending time when I cut to make sure all my "tracks" are perfectly organized... I'm just trying to make them fit in the timeline so I can see them, complete the cut, and get it to the client. I'm not finishing spots for air/exhibition in X, though lots of people do... As a result, when it's time for finishing, I need to go back through and spend the time to split everything out nicely. In FCP X, spend 2 seconds assigning Roles to clips when initially importing them, and X2Pro does it with a button click. Still blows my mind. ;-) And EDL-X let's you edit the source table for the list. That's huge, particularly when you're cutting from 5 different versions of a feature with 6 reels in each version and someone forgot to assign reel names to 3 of those features. Not having 001 as the source for 2/3's of the cut make online editors happy.

Anyway... I think the biggest sticking point to X in "Hollywood" is still the timeline, and all the self-reinforcing company town negativity. I see it right here in my office. I've been cutting in X, and loving it, for over a year. Yet some editors here still repeat the "everyone hates it" mantra. And they're too freaking lazy to spend the time to learn how to cut in X. It's ridiculous. It's all the same crap we wen't through when people started switching to the original FCP. Except there were tracks in everything. People are terrified of the magnetic timeline. But they can't admit that, so they call it names. lol :-)

There certainly are some gigs for which X isn't currently the best choice, just like it was for FCP 7. But I really believe that a lot of the resistance to X in some circles is just the fact that it isn't the same as everything that came before it. I've been editing for almost 2 decades, and was a Post Audio Mixer for years before I started with picture. I've worked "professionally" with MC, FCP Classic, ProTools, AudioVision (remember that?), and dabbled in countless other random NLE's and DAW's. (I include PPRo here, as I've used it, but not for paying work...) I like cutting Video and Audio in FCP X, warts and all, better than any of them. Yes, Clip Connections do require workarounds sometimes in a complex timeline, but it's no big deal really, and Apple is addressing that stuff.

Back to the original point, use whatever tool suits the gig, and as a freelancer, you really should be able to use them all. But, IMO, aside from some valid technical issues here and there, most of the resistance to FCP X is just stupid.

-------------------------------------------------------------


~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:52:03 pm

Thankyou - a lot of food for thought. All very interesting.

I will learn all of the packages to a basic extent - BUT I want to be an expert in one, because as an offline editor, my editor is as good as my fingers - I don't want to think for that nth of a second longer, I want to be able to think and react seamlessly. Probably just a kink in me, but I do get hired on my creative abilities rather than technical in the sort of work I specialize in.

Most of my clients expect me to work on their systems so their people can do versioning and adaptations long after I'm gone. So it will be interesting to see what happens, where I am - it seems like everything has frozen in time.


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Andy Dadekian
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 26, 2013 at 12:30:10 am

Good stuff. I totally agree with you.- too much negativity! I'm taking FCP X for a test drive and I was wondering if you could answer a couple of questions:
1.) I've been trying to figure out a way to make a dialogue breakdown for an entire feature. Do you have a method for that? In FCP 7 i would mark in's and out's then type the dialogue in the "Name" column. Time consuming but effective when searching for words.
2.) You mentioned that multiple users can't use it concurrently but (assuming all the media is shared) can i transfer a sequence to someone else on another computer so they can make changes to it?


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Charlie Austin
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 26, 2013 at 2:02:03 am

[Andy Dadekian] "1.) I've been trying to figure out a way to make a dialogue breakdown for an entire feature. Do you have a method for that? In FCP 7 i would mark in's and out's then type the dialogue in the "Name" column. Time consuming but effective when searching for words."

Boris Soundbite. ;-) Apart from that... similar way to do it mark in's and outs, hit F (favorite) and then rename it in the list with your dialog. Personally I just make a "Good Dialog" keyword, assign it to a number key, then it's just 3 keystrokes, "I-O-number" and they all show up in a keyword collection that I can just scroll through. You could do that, and then go back to each range and either do the favorite thing in the KW range, or type the dialog in the notes column. I'm sure there are other methods, maybe someone else will chime in.

[Andy Dadekian] "2.) You mentioned that multiple users can't use it concurrently but (assuming all the media is shared) can i transfer a sequence to someone else on another computer so they can make changes to it?"

Yep. There are a couple ways. If both you and the other person have an event with the same media, you can just essentially give them the project folder. They'll need to change the event reference when they open it, but it's one click. There's a good write up here:

http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/tutorials/1056-sharing-final-cut-pro-x-proj...

Or this.. easier:

http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/tutorials/872-sharing-projects-in-final-cut...

The other way is to select the Project (sequence) in the library, CMD-D to duplicate it, and choose "Duplicate Project + Used Clips" It'll make a copy of the cut, and a new Event with all the clips. (make real sure you've not copied clips to your Event originally, 'cuz it'll try and copy all the media if you did) Then open the duplicated sequence in the timeline, select it all and click OPT-G to make it a compound clip. Make sure it's being put in the New Event that just got created. Then just give the other editor that Event Folder from your drive. You can then trash the new event and the duplicate sequence (from within X, not in the Finder!) if you want.

It sounds more complicated than it is... it's really only about 3 keystrokes... And once it's done, you can just take back the Event with the cut in a Compound Clip. Or, If the other editor makes a new project with you cut, they can just give you that change the event references back and relink anything new they added, and off you go. Again, not quite as bonehead proof as FCP 7 or something, but really easy.

There are a bunch of other ways, using Disk images and stuff... again, maybe someone will pipe in...

-------------------------------------------------------------


~"It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools."~
~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Andy Dadekian
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 31, 2013 at 12:28:06 am

Thanks, this is helpful! I'll post if i find any new ways of creating a list.


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:34:12 pm

Interesting!


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:33:17 pm

Where are you based? Also where in Europe are you talking? I'm in Amsterdam and I haven't seen it around the traps.


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:18:26 pm

I'm in Brussels. I run a fairly large post house here and we also have an affiliate in Paris (15+ seats). We use FCPX exclusively, teamed with Resolve and Smoke. I see FCPX gradually being adopted in many larger facilities I know. Don't know about Holland though, guess many are still on FCP7 or Avid there. But Media College Leiden now teach their film students FCPX, so does Broadcast College in Brussels. It is rapidly gaining ground. If you are a creative editor you will simply enjoy working with this app. I know I do.



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Nicholas Zimmerman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:21:24 pm

I think colleges are going to make the biggest difference in the long run. As their graduates mix into the field, they can squash a lot of the misinformation out there about X.

--------------------------
Avid MC, PPro CS6, FCP7 - wasting away on my SSD.
I just can't quit X.
--------------------------


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:25:02 pm

Can I ask what sort of editing your house specializes in? Curious to see who uses what.


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 25, 2013 at 11:49:09 am

Broadcast dept. does TVC, trailers, episodic, long-form doc and narrative post for national broadcast. Plus a lot of in-depth sport and cultural programs (no news). Our other post dept. does subtitling and dubbing for the European market (cinema and television).



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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:32:39 pm

[Ronny Courtens] "If you are a creative editor you will simply enjoy working with this app."

that's.. kind of open to debate Ronny.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Ronny Courtens
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 25, 2013 at 11:36:29 am

Absolutely, Aindreas, but this is a debate forum after all (-:



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Richard Herd
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 27, 2013 at 12:38:17 am

X proved recently to be a pain in the ass. It was a simple job: just cut some graduation footage as a pop tune played it's catchy chorus. I wanted to simply drop edited footage into the chorus, at minute 1 or so. Not perfect editing conditions. In tracks based editing it's simple as can be. Even cutting film is straightforward there. You clip out the feet you want for the chorus and you save it over there in that bin, right there, that you can touch and pick up and tape when you're ready. So that's what I did sorta; I used key words and had to make a compound...it was weird. In tracks, I mark where the chorus begins and ends, and I cut a bit, and then put it on track 1 or maybe track 2 or maybe 99 -- who cares! Then I can 4-point edit stuff as I need. X is definitely for me at its best cutting narrative. J-cuts and L-cuts are so fast as to be mesmerizingly simple. But simple montage--a real pain, for me. I must be doing something wrong here.


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David Eaks
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 27, 2013 at 1:17:14 am

Hi Richard,

I'm trying to figure out what exactly about FCPX made this project a pain for you. There are lots of ways to work, I'm sure we can figure out a workflow that suits your needs, for use in future projects.

I figure if you are cutting to the music, as many others have suggested in the past, place the audio on the primary. Edit in video as connected clips. Use secondary storylines to group sections of connected clips which will all stay together, anchored to a specific point in the audio. Or even make one big secondary as a "Track V2".

Or if you want to stick with video in the primary, you can add a small gap clip to the start of the timeline to act as an anchor point, connect the audio to that. This way the audio is not attached to any of your video clips and it will stay put throughout the edit.

Sorry if I'm off track from what your saying.


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Richard Herd
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 31, 2013 at 3:58:54 am

[David Eaks] "Sorry if I'm off track from what your saying."

This is trackless. (drum roll crash cymbal)

Thanks for the tip. I tried that, actually. It was weird. I'll try it again with a bit more gusto.


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 7:32:25 pm

Yeah - that's my fear - I stick to the tools that are most like the ones I know - and all the young buffs get dextrous in X making me a dinosaur :)


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Bernard Newnham
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:39:11 pm

[Nicholas Zimmerman] "I think colleges are going to make the biggest difference in the long run. As their graduates mix into the field, they can squash a lot of the misinformation out there about X.
"


The one I work for is pretty much completely Adobe, because they got a deal years ago which included the whole Master Collection. It means that all kinds of courses can be covered using the same software set. I don't know how CC will affect them, but I think they might be ok, given that I've just been given the whole lot for free on some related deal.

For students, learning one NLE is much like learning another if they are starting from scratch. For the university, they need to keep their costs down, so PCs and Adobe it is - for now.

Bernie


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:50:12 pm

I still don't get why everyone is so scared of CC - aren't adobe offering an 'or buy the suite' option too? ~Isn't CC just supposed to be for convenient safeguarding?

Call me naive - but that's what I'm hearing


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Nicholas Zimmerman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 9:51:01 pm

No they aren't, it's Cloud or nothing from now on.

--------------------------
Avid MC, PPro CS6, FCP7 - wasting away on my SSD.
I just can't quit X.
--------------------------


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Fiona Fuchs
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 10:06:03 pm

I guess I got confused when I read price comparisons.
I don't buy nesspresso because I hate having to 'subscribe' to the coffee capsules- will be interesting to see how everyone reacts.


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Craig Seeman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 10:06:30 pm

I'm not sure where the "hearing" is being done but it's nothing coming from Adobe.
Subscribe for ever or lose your programs.

Some are buying CS6 and hanging on to it for life (or is it dear life).



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Walter Soyka
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 10:14:12 pm

[Craig Seeman] "Subscribe for ever or lose your programs."

Or pay as you go, renting either individual apps or the whole collection month-to-month, as necessary.

But yes, you must pay to play.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Craig Seeman
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 24, 2013 at 10:09:32 pm

[Bernard Newnham] " PCs and Adobe it is - for now."

That's not what I see posted by people in the Educational market if it's CC. Apparently it's a major cost compared to CS. PCs I can believe but I suspect many are waiting to make an "elsewhere" decision unless Adobe rethinks their educational pricing for educational institutions.



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Bernard Newnham
Re: Come on! Debate away... Where do I go from here?
on Jul 25, 2013 at 9:01:34 am

Indeed. Nothing is forever, and I'm sure if they found a cheaper or more efficient alternative they'd take it. When FCP looked like the future, there was much thought on getting together the cash to buy Macs for just that, but that whole scene has gone away now.

For editing Edius is standing in the wings being much promoted by a part time lecturer who also does work for Grass Valley. It's an excellent low cost editing system which is the standard in some countries. If I didn't have to major on PPro, that's the one I'd be using.

B

Bernie


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