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It's official! New Mac Pro

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Chris Lehmann
It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 6:07:39 pm

The relevant bits from Macrumor's live blog:

Processor, graphics and memory are inside. New generation Intel Xeon.

Double the CPU performance of the previous generation. 1766MHz DDR3, 60GBps bandwidth memory.

Flash internal storage. New Flash PCIe-based. 1.25GBps read, 1.0GBps write. 10x faster than any hard drive put in a Mac Pro.

All expansion is external. (NOTE: Get out the popcorn.)

Supports 4K displays. Multiple streams. 3 4K displays on built-in dual workstation graphics.

Graphics: First Mac ever to include dual workstation GPUs. AMD FirePro Graphics.
7 teraflops over OpenCL. 528GBps total bandwidth.

Final Cut Pro X will support performance and graphics capabilities of the new machine.

Uses Thunderbolt 2, 20Gbps throughput, 6 devices per port, backwards compatible. 2x of industry leading Thunderbolt 1.

Audio, 4 USB 3.0 ports, 6 Thunderbolt 2 ports, Gigabit ethernet, HDMI out, and motion sensor that lights up the back panel when its turned.

Is only 1/8th the volume of the old generation Mac Pro.


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Bob Woodhead
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 6:51:43 pm

Sorta reminds me of the old SGI O2 desktop.

Unless maybe it's like those hand towels that expand when you get 'em wet.... HEY PHIL!.... do we dunk it water to turn it into a real workstation?


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Clint Wardlow
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:08:22 pm

[Bob Woodhead] "Sorta reminds me of the old SGI O2 desktop.

Unless maybe it's like those hand towels that expand when you get 'em wet.... HEY PHIL!.... do we dunk it water to turn it into a real workstation?"


Probably won't feel quite as small when you have all of those Thuderbolt devices you need for expandability hooked up. Instead of one honking tower that rises like a skyscraper, you will have a veritable city of small boxes surrounding your workspace.


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:10:50 pm

There have been a number of cylindrical computers manufactured since as far back as 2005 (the Tube comes to mind, from 2008), the Mitra, which could be powered in the field by a hand crank, and had a built-in projector, and several others, including the Sony TP-1, laughed out of existence because it looked like a roll of toilet paper (or a Roomba). A bad naming choice...

While the new Mac "Pro" looks more like a suppository than anything else, I can't malign the power inside. What bothers me is what the video card options will be, plus the fact that there will be no user serviceable parts inside - the Apple Computer meets the Apple Phone. And the fact that the ports light up when you spin it around is just laughable to me - pick it up - it's small - way too small...calling anything slightly larger than a beer can "Pro" smacks of arrogance.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Frank Gothmann
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:24:42 pm

"Up to 12 cores" means it's a single cpu machine. And the rest... fail.
Have fun rackmounting it. And I thought they couldn't get any whackier but that thing... is... wow...
They really have lost it. Feel like cuddeling my HPs right now. So glad you're there, buddy.

------
"You also agree that you will not use these products for... the development, design, manufacture or production of nuclear, missiles, or chemical or biological weapons."
iTunes End User Licence Agreement


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:28:04 pm

Frank - wait a second! You can rack mount it using a series of cup holders. Once again, Apple's "industrial design" runs roughshod over practicality and standards. But you know this opens up a whole slew of "only could be designed by Apple" accessories to make this fit into a pro environment...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Ricardo Marty
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 9:06:07 pm

You can use one of those toilet paper holder too!Or a bount roll holder The cabinet type.

Ricardo


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Andy Neil
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:25:31 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "it's small - way too small...calling anything slightly larger than a beer can "Pro" smacks of arrogance."

Why does something have to be big to be considered "pro"?

Andy

http://www.timesavertutorials.com


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Lance Moody
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:28:14 pm

Love seeing the naysayers and I am reminded of this quote:

"They have no taste. And I mean that in an important way."



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Julian Smith
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:30:11 pm

I'd certainly get it.. The specs sound very impressive.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:30:32 pm

Can't you just put these on a tray in a rack mount like some people do Mac Minis?




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Julian Smith
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:32:13 pm

At least it won't take up much room.


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Ricardo Marty
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 9:09:03 pm

Well you can also use it as a paper weight.

Ricardo


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Frank Gothmann
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:37:23 pm

[Lance Moody] "Love seeing the naysayers (still lamenting their loss of floppies) and I am reminded of this quote:

"They have no taste. And I mean that in an important way."
"


It's supposed to be a workstation. Taste, design, looks - utterly irrelevant to me and a lot of people buying these types of machine. They are sitting under the desk or in a machine room. Sacrificing a ton of functionality for looks and design - what a marvelous idea.
Show me a construction company that chooses its excavator based on taste and looks.
Ridiculous machine.

------
"You also agree that you will not use these products for... the development, design, manufacture or production of nuclear, missiles, or chemical or biological weapons."
iTunes End User Licence Agreement


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Steve Connor
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:38:41 pm

[Frank Gothmann] "Show me a construction company that chooses its excavator based on taste and looks.
Ridiculous machine.
"


Go and Cuddle your HP's that'll make you feel better

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Julian Smith
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:44:12 pm

Frank, this is the way forward..

It's not stone tools and animal skins any more.


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larry towers
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:00:13 pm

No this is the way backwards. This isn't stone tools and animal skins. It's an xacto knife and spandex.
How is being limited to a single processor moving forward? Tundebolt 2.0 is NOT NOT NOT fast enough for high speed expansion for graphics or processing.



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Jim Wiseman
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:31:21 pm

12 cores of Xeon isn't enough? Should do for me.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.3, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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larry towers
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:46:04 pm

Those of us that would like to purchased 24 cores would disagree. A core is not the direct equivalent of a processor.



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Walter Soyka
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 11:01:29 pm

[Jim Wiseman] "12 cores of Xeon isn't enough? Should do for me."

No, 12 cores are not enough.

This will be a great system for editorial, but anyone with CPU-bound processes in their pipeline like 3D rendering or compositing can max that out easily.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:33:19 pm

Oh...I don't know - expandability using standard components, rack mounting, things that make it work well within a professional environment. I have some very small pro audio equipment, but it's made to fit all of the standards - XLR, 1/4", tripod mounts, that sort of thing. I guess I wouldn't have been bothered by "not quite that small". Try and work on anything inside without tweezers - oh...that's been solved...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Julian Smith
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:35:43 pm

Things move on.. Nobody enjoys change, especially change that is so... different. But it happens, nowt you can really do.


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Armando Ciurana
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:37:11 pm

Just wait to see the new Harley Davidson "Scooters"

President
Ciurana Dussauge Films Mexico


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Jim Wiseman
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:33:41 pm

Harleys are too big. I like cafe racers, Ducatis, etc., myself. Look better too.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.3, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Andrew Kimery
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:39:40 pm

I'm shocked at your shock Joseph. :)

When was the last time Apple had a desktop that was rack mountable w/o a case mod? The G4 towers that had 'removable' ears and feet? Apple's long time goal has been to make computers into computing appliances and this is final nail in the coffin. All of Apple's devices are pretty much sealed units now I think.




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Steve Connor
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:40:28 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "Oh...I don't know - expandability using standard components, rack mounting, things that make it work well within a professional environment. I have some very small pro audio equipment, but it's made to fit all of the standards - XLR, 1/4", tripod mounts, that sort of thing. I guess I wouldn't have been bothered by "not quite that small". Try and work on anything inside without tweezers - oh...that's been solved..."

Expansion and Pro I/O is EXTERNAL, hopefully they'll be some nice big PRO boxes to add on

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Jim Wiseman
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:39:05 pm

With 6 Thunderbolt 20GB/sec ports, there will be externals for I/O, rack mountable perhaps as well. I'm just very happy to see a new Mac Pro that is powerful and not a d**n sealed iMac. Now that would be worth bitching about. Now I can stay on OSX. Not interested in a Hackintosh problem hobby and certainly not in Windows.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.3, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Andy Neil
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:40:46 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "Oh...I don't know - expandability using standard components, rack mounting, things that make it work well within a professional environment."

I work in a professional environment and I've never needed to have my "desktop" computer rack mounted. Sure it's great if you're running a server farm or you're an IT or network guy, but my edit bay doesn't have to have it. It's a MUCH smaller footprint which means it could be on top of my desk instead of under it, giving me access to the back panel for connections. And since it's expansion is all external, you can buy rack mountable chassis for your peripherals if you want.

Andy

http://www.timesavertutorials.com


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Julian Smith
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:42:18 pm

You can get your Thunderbolt drives, and other peripherals and rack them.. I think that is a good idea. I'm liking this new version


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Steve Connor
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:39:11 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "it's small - way too small...calling anything slightly larger than a beer can "Pro" smacks of arrogance.
"


What a very strange statement

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:46:23 pm

Steve -

You're absolutely correct - it is a strange comment - it was one of my first thoughts, and I should have left it on the table. I should have gone more with my "non-standard" feelings, rather than size. I see nothing wrong with industrial design which works hand in hand with the technology - I think that it's the self-containment and lack of user serviceable parts that bothers me the most. I sincerely hope that it works out for those here who've been waiting for a long time. It's certainly got power - but I think that the lack of the ability to upgrade the cpu and other components will make it an orphan sooner than you think.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Steve Connor
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:51:12 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "but I think that the lack of the ability to upgrade the cpu and other components will make it an orphan sooner than you think."

I disagree, I think Apple are targeting the Pros that don't like upgrading their machines and in my experience that's almost everyone I've met in my corner of the creative industry. The guys I know who really need the speed for things like serious 3D work abandoned Apple a long time ago.

This will fit a very nice niche for Apple just above a fully specced iMac and give them the visibility in a chunk of the "Pro" space

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Clint Wardlow
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:57:03 pm

[Steve Connor] "I disagree, I think Apple are targeting the Pros that don't like upgrading their machines and in my experience that's almost everyone I've met in my corner of the creative industry"

I don't know. A lot of folks I know, even if they upgraded nothing else, at least upgraded RAM. Apple was so pricey, and cheaper alternatives were out there.


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Steve Connor
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:59:41 pm

[Clint Wardlow] "I don't know. A lot of folks I know, even if they upgraded nothing else, at least upgraded RAM. Apple was so pricey, and cheaper alternatives were out there."

http://www.apple.com/mac-pro/

You can upgrade RAM I think

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Bill Davis
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:25:16 pm

This place is just so amazing. Are we all really this old and intolerant of change?

Apple addresses exactly what we've been looking for. A new Pro machine with lots of horsepower.

AND (and this is amazing!) they even took a significant chunk of the keynote and specifically told us that they're re-coding parts of FCP-X to works DIRECTLY with the new hardware design.

Unlike the others, they aren't elevating the needs of photo editors, or network administrators, or some other niche - nope, they're on-stage specifically talking about a machine designed to work for VIDEO .... IN THE FREEKING KEYNOTE!

And all anyone want's to do is bitch and whine about the possible shortcomings of a thing that's only been just previewed without anything but a cursory intro of design goals and capabilities.

This is certainly the crankiest place on the internet right now.

Oh well. At least the forum looks like it might be going two for two. X waa a disaster right up until everyone started realizing out it actually wasn't, at ALL.

Methinks, here we go again.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com - video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:37:51 pm

To be fair Bill, until we see real world performance we don't know how may horses this thing has. Yes, it's leaps and bounds better than the 2010 era Mac Pros that Apple is selling today, but that's not saying much.

Honestly, to your point Bill, I would've been surprised if Apple just released a tower w/upgraded guts. I know many people wanted that but it just doesn't jive with the direction Apple has been headed the last 7 or 8 years. I think Apple sees big desktops like that as being akin to the 'big iron' SGI machines from a decade ago. Apple wasn't in that market then and I don't think they want to be in it now.

Apple helped usher in 'desktop revolutions' for editing, publishing, music recording, color correction and DVD authoring at times when few 'serious pros' used off-the-shelf desktops for those tasks. The people that really need the most power will need to look elsewhere, but IMO that's always been the case w/Mac hardware.

I'll reserve judgment until price and real world performance is known, but for now, as someone that doesn't need best-of-the-best speed, I'm intrigued.




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Chris Jacek
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:39:40 pm

[Bill Davis] "Oh well. At least the forum looks like it might be going two for two. X waa a disaster right up until everyone started realizing out it actually wasn't, at ALL."

I think there is still a compelling argument that FCPX has been a disaster, especially when viewed as an overall event in the post-production industry. The software as it stands in its current state (still unacceptable to many of us) is only part of the equation. Much of the damage was done upon release, and at best, Apple is still playing catch-up in its effort to regain its position in the nonlinear space.

Professor, Producer, Editor
and former Apple Employee


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Clint Wardlow
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:55:53 pm

[Bill Davis] "This place is just so amazing. Are we all really this old and intolerant of change?"

I don't think it is necessarily being intolerant of change. It is change that doesn't fit in with their needs. I can see someone who was holding out for a machine that could be upgraded to something comparable to a high-dollar HP workstation might be disappointed.

Hey, the new mac pro could work for me. I am reserving judgement. But that is only me.

However, you have to admit, that for the user that needs high-end graphics cards or the ability to upgrade their system as they go, the new mac pro could leave something to be desired.


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Jim Wiseman
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 11:06:49 pm

RAM appears to be upgradeable. They show it removed in the exploded view. Should be third party available. I expect we'll be seeing some development in the area of 32GB RAM sticks. 32 total is plenty for my purposes. YMMV.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.3, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Chris Lehmann
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:02:42 pm

According to the animations on the apple site, the whole cylindrical case slides off once the locking tab on the back is released. RAM trays fold out and are user upgradable. The flash storage looks like it just clips in, so that should be user upgradable as well.

The graphics cards look like they might be on removable trays too, although the way they come out in the animation could just be to show how it all fits together. If they are upgradable, it looks like only special apple cards would work.

Over all it's pretty much what I expected, focus on GPU over CPU. More reliance on external thunderbolt technology and not a giant box.

I'll be curious to see what they cost and if it's time to replace my 2009 mac pro with this new one or a top of the line imac.


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Clint Wardlow
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:15:49 pm

[Chris Lehmann] "According to the animations on the apple site, the whole cylindrical case slides off once the locking tab on the back is released. RAM trays fold out and are user upgradable. The flash storage looks like it just clips in, so that should be user upgradable as well.

The graphics cards look like they might be on removable trays too, although the way they come out in the animation could just be to show how it all fits together. If they are upgradable, it looks like only special apple cards would work."


Well, guess that goers to show that "all" expandability might not be through Thunderbolt. It all depends on how you define expandable.

I'll wait until they come out and early adopters have run it through its paces before I decide. I mean I don't really like the concept of closed systems, however I have been using a 2010 imac and have been fairly happy with it.

Until I get the detailed specs and reports from a goodly amount of folks that have driven the mac pro around the block, I am not sure how I feel about it. Price will also be a big factor. I am just glad we finally have something tangible so we can start planning a yay or a nay on whether to continue on with Apple.


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Michael Hadley
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:48:36 pm

Man, tough crowd. At first blush, I think it looks like a vast improvement over current options. With no benchmarks, though, hard to say. But the specs quoted make it look pretty impressive. Plus, hub and spoke concept means you buy what you need. But for me, rack-mounting is not something I need or want.


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Andrew Kimery
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 7:56:01 pm

[Michael Hadley] "Man, tough crowd. At first blush, I think it looks like a vast improvement over current options. With no benchmarks, though, hard to say. But the specs quoted make it look pretty impressive. Plus, hub and spoke concept means you buy what you need. But for me, rack-mounting is not something I need or want."

Unfortunately the curent options are from 2010 so that's not much of a compliment. ;)


The hub and spoke model will be great for some and not great for others. Hopefully it will mean the base price is relatively low. If it's not the Tube will be the Cube 2.0.




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Lance Moody
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:03:33 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "but I think that the lack of the ability to upgrade the cpu and other components will make it an orphan sooner than you think."

You mean like you could upgrade all the previous pro machines? The ridiculous comments are facinating.



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Chris Jacek
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:10:58 pm

[Lance Moody] "[Joseph W. Bourke] "but I think that the lack of the ability to upgrade the cpu and other components will make it an orphan sooner than you think."

You mean like you could upgrade all the previous pro machines? The ridiculous comments are facinating."


Isn't this a bit of a ridiculous comment? Yes you COULD upgrade the previous pro machines in ways you cannot on this new machine. You could choose your graphics card, you could add internal hard drives, you could add optical drives. You cannot do any of that on this machine without external boxes and cables.

Professor, Producer, Editor
and former Apple Employee


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Lance Moody
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:16:59 pm

Actually the ridiculous quote mentions CPU. You don't yet know that you cant upgrade the graphics card and external storage is the main way that most actual real editors doing actual real work do things anyway.

Where are all of the idiots who were saying that there would not be a pro machine?

This forum is full of people who deserve Windows and always will deserve windows.

Lance



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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:20:53 pm

Thanks Lance - I've earned my living over many years in television and graphics, and used both Macs and PCs. It's a personal choice. If you're trying to say that one is superior over the other, you're just a fanboy who should be ignored in any intelligent conversation.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Chris Jacek
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:33:54 pm

[Lance Moody] "external storage is the main way that most actual real editors doing actual real work do things anyway."

So did you feel compelled to make a ridiculous statement just to support you claim of there being many ridiculous statements? Your assertion is absurd, condescending, and myopic.

I guess using internal drive arrays is the mark of an amateur? How naive of us resist additional cables that can short out, and don't want to spend extra money on enclosures.

Professor, Producer, Editor
and former Apple Employee


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larry towers
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:13:10 pm

Totally agree. Thunderbolt cables are an expensive ripoff.



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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:16:07 pm

No Lance - I mean compared to "real" workstations on any platform, where you can easily replace anything which needs replacement. What's fascinating is your lightning attack on anything that doesn't smack of fan-ism.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Lance Moody
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:19:03 pm

"No Lance - I mean compared to "real" workstations on any platform, where you can easily replace anything which needs replacement. What's fascinating is your lightning attack on anything that doesn't smack of fan-ism."


And which components have you confirmed can not be replaced?



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Jamie Franklin
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:19:57 pm

[Lance Moody] "
You mean like you could upgrade all the previous pro machines? The ridiculous comments are facinating."


What..?

Is this satire?


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Lance Moody
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:30:42 pm

An earlier poster mentioned CPU specifically as he struggled to think of a non issue, ANY non-issue to complain about. Hilariously, he first tendered the idea that the machine was "too small"!

The CPU has never been upgradable on the pro machines officially.



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Jamie Franklin
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:46:16 pm

"Officially", "unofficially"...it was possible.

Now it's neither.


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Steve Connor
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:55:07 pm

Don't forget it's got superfast wifi to get all your data to PRISM much quicker :)

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Jim Wiseman
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:41:23 pm

I really miss my 3 pound Motorola Cell phone.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.3, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Jim Giberti
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:20:25 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] " it's small - way too small...calling anything slightly larger than a beer can "Pro" smacks of arrogance."

Really?
What does size have to do with power and innovation? Of all the things to question, size seems a bit irrelevant in 2013.


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 8:24:55 pm

Hi Jim -

I retracted that statement quite a bit back in the thread as nonsensical. It was size as effects configurability that bothered me, and I wasn't clear in my statement.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Jim Giberti
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 9:34:46 pm

I saw that as I read down Joe.
After going to the site I have to say, it just screams Apple...as they've been since I've known them.

Obviously the proof will be in the performance, but I have to say, they continue to push boundaries in concept and design. I'm not weighing into the differences in components that others here are much more qualified to opine on, but from an overall approach, they've got my attention.

Here's my guess. They've been at this design and FCPX development in parallel. I think FCP 10.2 will have a lot of serious feature additions/refinements and that it will be promoted as fully optimized for the new MP architecture and that the new MP will be promoted the same way, re FCPX.

I think they plan to sell a lot of MPs specifically around FCPX, and probably Motion, and to use the MP as a "next generation computer for the new generation of professional editing". It's their MO. A lot of people will see the MP/FCPX/Motion combo as a really attractive creative environment. And others will see the more traditional, internally configurable tower as preferable and continue to move the other way.

I've got a number of maxed out iMacs running wonderfully here but this has definitely got my attention.


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Jim Wiseman
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 10:44:50 pm

You get a pass on that, Joe. Configurability is a design problem to be worked out. I'm sure it will be. Connector size is the issue there. But these things do change through the years. BNC's are a lot smaller than UHF's as I am sure you will remember.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1.3, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 11:12:47 pm

You're right Jim - but it still drives me crazy every time I have to use a 3.5mm TSR to do "pro" audio. It just doesn't have the feel (or the shielding) of a 1/4 inch or XLR cable. I guess I'm just an old f*rt. Funny...the first thing that came to mind when I saw the new Mac Pro was "cheesebox on a raft" - but I haven't been around since the Civil War, and of course there's no raft for the cheesebox to sit on...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Ricardo Marty
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 9:14:49 pm

Well maybe in computers it doesn't.

Ricardo


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Walter Soyka
Re: It's official! New Mac Pro
on Jun 10, 2013 at 9:23:56 pm

Some random thoughts from the resident sizzle-core beast aficionado.


THE GOOD

I'm glad to see a Xeon CPU with ECC RAM.

Dual GPUs is forward-looking. OpenCL will benefit from a good hard push in the marketplace. LOADS of VRAM available. The Mac has never had a workstation-class GPU like this before, let alone two of them in the same machine.

Thunderbolt the Second is fast enough on paper to handle a bunch of my objections against Thunderbolt the First. TB2 should handle "real" storage (like what needs a PCIe 8x card today).

Very clever-looking engineering. The size reduction will be important to some.

Presumably the awesome new fan carries no risk of accidental finger removal like the former Mac Pro.


THE BAD

A single socket for CPU is limiting. Likewise 4 slots for RAM.

The lack of internal storage and lack of internal expansion somewhat negates the "space" argument. You'll still need what you needed before, but now it will sit outside the box, and now it will require its own power supply.

I would have rather seen dual NVIDIA GPUs so CUDA could have been supported in addition to OpenCL.

The size reduction creates constraints.


THE UGLY

I find it very interesting that Apple carefully avoids the word "workstation" on their website. It's a "pro computer."

In other threads, I've described Motion as having a high floor and a low ceiling. My initial reaction to this hardware is the same. It's got a high floor -- it looks very nice compared to an iMac in terms of raw computational ability -- but with only a single CPU and limited RAM, there is a distinct ceiling on performance.

What saddens me about this machine is that it indicates there will be no good choice for CPU-intensive tasks from Apple. Apple is practically ceding the high end in 3D, advanced mograph and compositing, which will all (continue to) suffer on this machine versus higher-spec Windows or Linux boxes.


THE VERDICT

This will be a great machine for a lot of folks here, but for me personally, I think it's too soon to tell. I see two major factors that people in my situation may consider.

The first is the as-yet-unannounced pricing. This is not the workstation of my dreams, but I'll pick one up if the price is right as I'm pretty well committed to staying cross-platform and this will be my highest-performance Mac option. I do expect most of my daily work will stay on higher-spec PCs, but this could be a nice system for Smoke.

The second is what the developers will do with it. If Apple is actually making a commitment to what their pro hardware will look like in the future, developers can adapt. Applications that are totally CPU-bound today may make better use of OpenCL in the future, reducing the liability of the new Mac Pro's single-socket design.

Finally, a doff of the cap to my frequent sparring partner Craig Seeman, who correctly predicted what this system would be like ages ago -- even that they would come up with a whole new cooling system (though I reserve a little credit for myself for correctly predicting that any new Mac Pro would still obey the laws of physics). I hope this is the right box (I guess we can't call them that anymore, huh?) to replace your current Mac Pro.

Cheers,

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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