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Jeremy Garchow
Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 3:51:37 pm

What does the HDMI output send?

Can it be used as DVI with a cheap adaptor or are you stuck with video frame size and frame rates?

If I am going to have storage, SDI capture/output, and an adaptor or two on Thunderbolt, it'd be nice if the HDMI out could used as a GUI monitor.

Thanks for any insight.

Jeremy


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Steve Connor
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 5:30:40 pm

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/06/20/retina-macbook-pro-can-run-three-extern...

Is that enough screens?

Steve Connor
"The ripple command is just a workaround for not having a magnetic timelinel"
Adrenalin Television


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 5:57:28 pm

[Steve Connor] "Is that enough screens?"

MOAR! MOAR! MOAR!

Thanks, Steve. I was just wondering if that HDMI can be DVI as well, of it's 1920x1080 @ 60P only.

Jeremy


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David Cherniack
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 11:27:21 pm

uhh...note the image is the same on all 4 screens...ie cloned. I'd be impressed with its usefulness if it showed the desktop spanning all four. Of course if you have clients in 4 different rooms it makes sense.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 12:05:51 am

[David Cherniack] "uhh...note the image is the same on all 4 screens...ie cloned. I'd be impressed with its usefulness if it showed the desktop spanning all four. Of course if you have clients in 4 different rooms it makes sense."

I don't think it's cloned, they just have the same BG, note the desktop icons on the retina.

The comments seem to lead to discrete displays, and there's this: Moving images and media didn’t create any lag and we were able to play video on all four displays simultaneously.

Jeremy


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David Cherniack
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 12:28:01 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "The comments seem to lead to discrete displays, and there's this: Moving images and media didn’t create any lag and we were able to play video on all four displays simultaneously."

You can also read that as cloned. The 650M would have to support 4 spanned displays. I don't think it does.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 12:30:54 am

Well, it's the retina, the two thunderbolts, and an hdmi.

Perhaps the hdmi is running off of the integrated die.


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David Cherniack
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 11:35:00 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "Perhaps the hdmi is running off of the integrated die."

My guess: On the three external monitors it's the 2nd spanned display (the Tb's are its clones) because, as you say, thre's no desktop icons.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 3:02:18 pm

[David Cherniack] "My guess: On the three external monitors it's the 2nd spanned display (the Tb's are its clones) because, as you say, thre's no desktop icons."

You can already run two through TBolt before the retina, what's one more?

Here's some humor: http://www.onefoottsunami.com/2012/06/20/the-magsafe-to-magsafe-2-adapter/


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David Cherniack
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 11:19:28 pm

Hey Jeremy, I just heard the 600 series does support up to 4 displays. I assume that's also true of the 650M.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 11:31:34 pm

[David Cherniack] "Hey Jeremy, I just heard the 600 series does support up to 4 displays. I assume that's also true of the 650M."

Well, color me polka dot. I figured OWC wasn't trying to hoodwink anyone. They have been a reputable bunch with no reason to change now.

That setup will make a hell of a flight simulator and angry birds display, provided nothing melts in that little chassis.


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David Cherniack
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 22, 2012 at 12:15:14 pm

Personally I'd prefer a 690 which will blow the socks of of any M series chip and render with both GPUs in AE and soon, I expect, Premiere. 'Course the MP doesn't have any slots and TB at 4X PCIe is not nearly fast enough for my needs.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 22, 2012 at 1:49:27 pm

Yep. In a bout of self cynicism, I think:

Macs are terrible, Apple sucks, and life as we know it will belong to Microsoft.

Me being a silly Mac shlub will be left in a trail of multiple CUDA card dust while being dragged by my underperforming and paltry Thunderbolt connectors in ultra high resolution to NLE purgatory because life at 500MB/sec has no meaning.

A 4.5 pound laptop will never compete with the likes of an 80 pound ProMax One (how could it?), and for that it will make me a worse editor, green screen compositor, and story teller with no doors on anything because they have all been blown off.

At least I'll have 15 megapixels of screen real estate to watch this all go down in a furious seven hour battery session.


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David Cherniack
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 22, 2012 at 4:58:19 pm

Yup, bad karma sucks. On the bright side there's always your next life. And just think, this time around you coulda been born in a small village in Lower Silesia and never known another kind of windows than your neighbours new outhouse door, let alone that an apple wasn't only that red fruit you help yourself to from his tree when he's asleep.

Count your blessings, Jeremy. The world is wide. Window only pains in the mind.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 22, 2012 at 5:18:54 pm

[David Cherniack] "Window only pains in the mind."

Truer words have never been spoken. I guess I'll suffer with a small cuda in osx.


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Chris Kenny
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 5:44:50 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Can it be used as DVI with a cheap adaptor or are you stuck with video frame size and frame rates?"

You can use it with a DVI adaptor as a third general-pupose display output, yes.

--
Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.

You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 5:47:44 pm

[Chris Kenny] "You can use it with a DVI adaptor as a third general-pupose display output, yes."

at higher than 60Hz and 1080v?


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Andrew Richards
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 7:31:29 pm

OWC blog to the rescue!

Best,
Andy


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 7:41:23 pm

[Andrew Richards] "OWC blog to the rescue!"

Thanks, Andrew. Steve, I didn't click on all the links in your original post. My bad!

1900x1200 was what I was looking for.

This is great to know, and thanks everyone.

How is it that this Macbook Pro is both a marvel and a stumper all at the same time?

And why, oh why, do I need powerful portability in the very near future?

Is it silly to buy this thing or is it silly to buy an older 17"?

Or am I just being silly?


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Andrew Richards
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 8:10:19 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Is it silly to buy this thing or is it silly to buy an older 17"?"

I think it boils down to the GPUs and the ports. If you don't mind the older AMD GPU and you really want built-in GigE and FW800, get the refurb 17". If you'd rather have the new NVIDIA GPU and two Thunderbolt ports, get the Retina.

I suppose you can mod the 17" for more internal storage, but it won't be fast storage unless you pay a ton for a big SSD.

Not an easy decision.

Best,
Andy


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 8:18:44 pm

[Andrew Richards] "Not an easy decision."

I'm rather paralyzed.

It's not a cheap decision either.


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David Lawrence
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 8:37:57 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "I'm rather paralyzed.

It's not a cheap decision either."


Me too. I was really hoping to replace my aging unibody after WWDC but now I have no idea what to do.

One thought is to maybe just go with the new non-retina MBP as they seem to have the same CPU/GPU options. I mostly work in clamshell mode, attached to a cinema display so maybe the premium for the retina display would be a waste.

Still, when I'm dropping this amount of cash, I usually want the most state-of-the-art offering on the table.

Really unsure about this...

Jeremy, I presume you're thinking retina for field work? Do you work in clamshell mode very often?

_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 8:57:42 pm

[David Lawrence] "Jeremy, I presume you're thinking retina for field work? Do you work in clamshell mode very often?"

I do not. If using it in clamshell, then yeah, the retina might be overkill as long as you don't need the twin thunderbolts.

I have been a 17" since they started making them, so the form factor/loss of res is going to be a bit of a change.

I need a laptop as I will be away from the office for a little while, but still need to work.

There's going to be a big green screen project in there as well as some other straight forward editing/cc. I need as fast as I can get in a portable machine.

It's nice to know the HDMI will support a single link DVI monitor for GUI.

I will also probably buy the Sonnet ExpressCard Pro Thunderbolt thingy and be able to run my AJA ioExpress through it (hopefully) which will save dough on broadcast monitoring.

I will need thunderbolt storage, though. :(

[David Lawrence] "Still, when I'm dropping this amount of cash, I usually want the most state-of-the-art offering on the table. "

I feel the same way. Buying a 15" won't be the most state of the art, but the new RMBP is pretty bleeding edge. I usually get a long life/lots of use out of my laptops so buying the newest thing makes a lot of sense.

I have yet to make the time to go look at one in person, that will probably help make the decision.

She loves me, she loves me not.


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Andrew Richards
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 9:16:47 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "I will need thunderbolt storage, though. :("

What are you using now?

Best,
Andy


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 9:51:06 pm

[Andrew Richards] "What are you using now?"

For work away from the office, I use eSata.


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John Davidson
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 10:10:44 pm

I know lots of people who refused to get the macbook pros when they first came out and got the powerbook G5's. In retrospect they seriously regretted it.

You work in the biz, it's a totally mac-daddy write off, and a Pegasus is so good that it's worth it. Personally I'm ridiculously happy with my 11in air, but if I needed a powerful laptop, that's the only one I'd get.

John Davidson | President / Creative Director | Magic Feather Inc.


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David Lawrence
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 9:27:05 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "I do not. If using it in clamshell, then yeah, the retina might be overkill as long as you don't need the twin thunderbolts."

I wish it were that simple. I have the 24' LED display so twin thunderbolt would give me the option of keeping it.

Of course to really do this right I should probably sell that with the unibody and upgrade to the new 27" thunderbolt with all the ports. Ugh, this is getting expensive!


[Jeremy Garchow] "I have been a 17" since they started making them, so the form factor/loss of res is going to be a bit of a change."

I feel for you. Pixel density vs physical screen space is a tough call. I know my eyes aren't getting any better...


[Jeremy Garchow] "I feel the same way. Buying a 15" won't be the most state of the art, but the new RMBP is pretty bleeding edge. I usually get a long life/lots of use out of my laptops so buying the newest thing makes a lot of sense."

I got my late-2008 about a month after it was released. I was waiting for a major revision in the MBP line and this was it. I bought it CTO with the maxed-out CPU. I did the RAM and HD upgrades myself. Its had it's motherboard swapped twice, HD upgraded three times, its needed a new battery after the old one started swelling. I recently installed a new left fan using the iFixIt guide. I realize I'm a tiny minority, but I like knowing I can take care of some things myself.

It's served me well for close to four years now. Every major repair was covered free with AppleCare - the best warranty in the industry as far as I'm concerned. Apple always treated me well. I'm very happy with the service I've gotten from this laptop, but it's getting time to change. I wish I was as certain as I felt four years ago.


[Jeremy Garchow] "I have yet to make the time to go look at one in person, that will probably help make the decision."

Same here. My brother reported that the display seemed dimmer than the regular displays, but I want to see for myself.


[Jeremy Garchow] "She loves me, she loves me not."

Word.

_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 10:10:08 pm

[David Lawrence] "Of course to really do this right I should probably sell that with the unibody and upgrade to the new 27" thunderbolt with all the ports. Ugh, this is getting expensive!"

Yes, yes it is. The nice thing about that though is you will gain some ports on that monitor if you need them.

[David Lawrence] "I got my late-2008 about a month after it was released. I was waiting for a major revision in the MBP line and this was it. I bought it CTO with the maxed-out CPU. I did the RAM and HD upgrades myself. Its had it's motherboard swapped twice, HD upgraded three times, its needed a new battery after the old one started swelling. I recently installed a new left fan using the iFixIt guide. I realize I'm a tiny minority, but I like knowing I can take care of some things myself."

I'm with you. I've had a few swelling batteries and some hard drive upgrades as well all done by me (iFixit is awesome). I will certainly buy AppleCare on this Retina if that's the way to go.

At least the performance reports are coming back good, even with CS6/openCL.


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David Lawrence
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 12:59:06 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "At least the performance reports are coming back good, even with CS6/openCL."

Good news, that's what I'm looking for!

_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 22, 2012 at 5:23:26 pm

[David Lawrence] "I wish it were that simple. I have the 24' LED display so twin thunderbolt would give me the option of keeping it.

Of course to really do this right I should probably sell that with the unibody and upgrade to the new 27" thunderbolt with all the ports. Ugh, this is getting expensive!"


OK. I finally went to go see one.

I have to say, it's very nice.

I am not used to the 15" form factor and it will take some getting used to, but I'm sure it will be fine.

I put the resolution on 1920x1200 and while it's "smaller" due to the smaller screen size, it is razor sharp and very nice looking. I could dig it, no problem.

The glossiness of the screen is still kind of glossy, but when comparing to the regular MBP that was sitting next to it, there is a huge difference. You can still see some reflection, but the highlights are dramatically reduced and seem to not reflect back as much light, rather they are not quite diffused but rather look clipped. It is nowhere near as distracting as the regular glossy monitors, but it's also not a matte. I agree with the reports that say it looks more matte than glossy, it's a decent way to describe it. It would take some getting used to for me, as I really don't like glossy monitors as I sometimes feel like I'm looking in the mirror. The Retina isn't that bad, but I hope the performance will trump any distractions.

This one didn't have FCPX or CS installed on it, so I couldn't look at performance, unfortunately.

It was connected to a 27" Thunderbolt monitor. That one was super glossy, but holy moly is it sexy. Damn it, Apple. You'll probably get me on the Retina, and you almost had me at Thunderbolt display.


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Tim Wilson
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 23, 2012 at 7:30:18 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "I really don't like glossy monitors as I sometimes feel like I'm looking in the mirror."

I had never articulated it before but the light has dawned: I prefer glossy laptop monitors because I'd really rather be looking at the mirror than working anyway. Glossy monitors allow me to do a LITTLE more work before I stop to ONLY look in the mirror.

Tim Wilson
Associate Publisher, Editor-in-Chief
Creative COW Magazine
Twitter: timdoubleyou



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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 23, 2012 at 9:55:07 pm

[Tim Wilson] "Glossy monitors allow me to do a LITTLE more work before I stop to ONLY look in the mirror."

...which is just more work!

;)


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Rick Lang
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 4:28:34 am

Jeremy:
"I have been a 17" since they started making them, so the form factor/loss of res is going to be a bit of a change."

As you probably know you can use the retina display as a 1920x1200 virtual screen ('more space') and yet within that the viewer window in FCPX will display full 1920x1080 video pixel-for-pixel. Yes the physical dimensions are smaller than on the 17" but it's only an inconvenience as you travel and may not be as cramped as you fear. Try it out in the store if you can.

There's going to be a big green screen project in there as well as some other straight forward editing/cc. I need as fast as I can get in a portable machine."

If I remember the recent benchmarks show the fastest MacBook Pro Retina is overall faster than the fastest MacBook Pro 15". I'll check to verify that and get back if I'm wrong.

'She loves you!'

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 11:49:36 am

[Rick Lang] "As you probably know you can use the retina display as a 1920x1200 virtual screen ('more space') and yet within that the viewer window in FCPX will display full 1920x1080 video pixel-for-pixel. Yes the physical dimensions are smaller than on the 17" but it's only an inconvenience as you travel and may not be as cramped as you fear. Try it out in the store if you can. "

Thanks, Rick.

I was actually referring to the non retina MBP when I said "losing res".

The regular 15" is 1440xWhatever.

The retina will be a smaller screen, but higher res which I think I'm ok with. Have to check it out, though.

Jeremy


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Rick Lang
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 4:37:10 am

Jeremy:
""[David Lawrence] "Jeremy, I presume you're thinking retina for field work? Do you work in clamshell mode very often?"

I do not."

Sorry my eyes just skipped over this. So I see why the firm factor is a concern. I'd certainly recommend you just get yourself an early birthday present and consider a Thunderbolt display so you don't have to worry about only having the two TB ports on the laptop. It's so much more comfortable working on a big screen. It use that HDMI with a DVI adapter for your GUI as planned.

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB


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Richard Herd
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 8:19:13 pm

My silly test. I went to the mac store and opened up X on the Retina. Then I range selected some canned footage and I made it 50% slower, and used optical flow. See how long it felt. Not too bad. It seemed fast.

The Mac Pro across the room didn't have the footage.


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Nevin Styre
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 9:20:37 pm

"at higher than 60Hz and 1080v?"

that would require dual link DVI, HDMI doesn't support dual link DVI resolutions. You'd need to go from thunderbolt with an active miniDP->dual link DVI adapter.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 9:52:43 pm

[Nevin Styre] "that would require dual link DVI, HDMI doesn't support dual link DVI resolutions. You'd need to go from thunderbolt with an active miniDP->dual link DVI adapter."

From the blog post, it says it goes to 1200v. That's really what I was looking for.

Thanks!

Jeremy


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Nevin Styre
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 10:06:56 pm

that sounds right, for a 27" or 30" monitor with a higher res you will need the dual link DVI


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Michael Hadley
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 11:23:20 pm

What do you guys think about the using the 15" MBPr as your "broadcast" monitor (in FCPX anyway) and then using a larger LCD/CD for your workspace?


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Jason Jenkins
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 20, 2012 at 11:46:31 pm

[Michael Hadley] "What do you guys think about the using the 15" MBPr as your "broadcast" monitor (in FCPX anyway) and then using a larger LCD/CD for your workspace?"

That's what I've been doing with my 2011 Macbook Pro, but I don't do color critical work.

Jason Jenkins
Flowmotion Media
Video production... with style!

Check out my Mormon.org profile.


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Eric Santiago
Re: Anyone have a Retina MBP?
on Jun 21, 2012 at 11:31:48 am

Some folks are enjoying it:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?81179-New-15-quot-MacBook-Pro-P...


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