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The Mac Pro we dream about?

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Lance Bachelder
The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 6:11:45 pm

Man Apple is blowing it! I figure if they don't have some new uber hardware out by WWDC in June my Mac future may be dwindling...

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/topic.aspx/global/products/video/en/prec...

These new Dell workstation look great and are exactly what we need from Apple: http://www.dell.com/precision

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Paul Jay
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 7:05:18 pm

Does it have 4 Thunderbolt ports and osx running?

Ill wait.


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Joseph W. Bourke
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 7:13:23 pm

No, but it has a magical little one-button mouse and thousands of apps.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tim Wilson
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 7:20:07 pm

Bob Zelin has already said the same thing about the HP Z820, which we'll be publishing soon. As he puts it, "OH MY GOD! This is the machine that Apple should build...but never will."

He's also fond enough of the ProMAX ONE to call it the Windows machine he'll buy if he has to.

We'll be able to do a better comparison that includes Dell when there's more information available, but this is what it's like to live in a world with true competition: people pushing each other to make better stuff.

I know that the HP Z1 has gotten grief because it looks like an iMac, but it's also the iMac Pro that people have talked about...but more muscular than Apple will pull off. To start with, its stock config supports BILLIONS of colors, when Apple's top of the line standalone display only does millions.

It also holds twice as much RAM as the top of the line iMac can(FOUR times as much as the entry-level one can hold), has multiple drive bays (want an SSD RAID? No worries - buy cheap drives, pop them in with no tools), and much more.

Fully loaded it ain't cheap (about $4K), but it really is a workstation, and not a pretty box that's being pressed into service that it was never intended for.

My feeling about Thunderbolt is that, as cool as it is, it's also a workaround for a problem that none of these machines have. Just like FireWire, everybody will have it eventually...but seriously, if you have a Thunderbolt device that you hafta hafta hafta use today, plenty of adapters...but also seriously, for the stuff most pros own, problem solved with loads of the slots you need until T-bolt comes along....

Tim Wilson
Associate Publisher, Editor-in-Chief
Creative COW Magazine
Twitter: timdoubleyou



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Lance Bachelder
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 7:30:17 pm

I'd love it if we start seeing Thunderbolt ports and PCIe cards for PC's - it's a great technology.

The thing I like about the Dell over the HP etc is the actual design of the T7600 - for the first time EVER Dell will actually have a nice looking box.



Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Kevin Patrick
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 9:12:54 pm

I stopped by Intel's booth at NAB. They were showing I believe a Lenovo laptop with Thunderbolt. I thought the Intel person said that this was the first Windows product that will ship with Thunderbolt, with coming later this year.

Kevin


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Chris Harlan
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 11, 2012 at 2:13:03 am

[Lance Bachelder] "The thing I like about the Dell over the HP etc is the actual design of the T7600 - for the first time EVER Dell will actually have a nice looking box."

Dang. That is a nice looking box.


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Craig Seeman
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 8:17:44 pm

In a world of diminishing budgets the ability to turn it up to 11 has a steep price. Granted sometimes you MUST be able to turn it up to 11 but the relative portion of the market that needs that is decreasing (operative word is relative, not absolute).

Thunderbolt is another one of those budget conscious solutions. It's 4xPCIe that's movable and daisy chainable (depending on the device). You can move your Thunderbolt "whatever" from machine to machine as needed as opposed to buying the "whatever" for each machine. Of course some want a "whatever" for each machine . . . but budgets are declining. And as optical Thunderbolt happens down the road, the market may shift further.



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Walter Soyka
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 7:54:55 pm

[Paul Jay] "Does it have 4 Thunderbolt ports and osx running? Ill wait."

Why are these your criteria? Do you need Thunderbolt, or do you need fast expansion? Do you need OS X, or do you need application support?

If you're going to run FCPX or Smoke on Mac, you can't buy a Dell. Or an HP. Or a ProMax. Or a BOXX. Or a Lenovo. Or an ADK. Or a Safe Harbor. Or the parts you need to build one from scratch. You have to buy from Apple.

For other apps, like Adobe Creative Suite, why not buy a PC? I'm running PCs and Macs side by side, and it really works well.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Lance Bachelder
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 8:08:01 pm

Concur Walter - I'm running 2 Mac Pro's and 2 Win7 workstations at my home office so I always have the best tool available for each job...

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Michael Sanders
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 8:12:52 pm

Sorry but I don't get it...

Thunderbolt was designed to bring PCIe connectivity to computers that don't have room for PCIe cards like laptops.

The whole point about about a tower is that it has, well room for expansion.

For a start are we going to see graphics and display card manufactures to incorporate thunderbolt connections which will only work on a hand full of monitors?

Michael Sanders
London Based DP/Editor


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Craig Seeman
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 8:25:55 pm

[Michael Sanders] "The whole point about about a tower is that it has, well room for expansion."

And one can argue that the point of Thunderbolt is that you can move a device from one computer to another rather than have a card anchored internally. One might have Video I/O that you can move to the computer that needs it rather than have one in every computer.

It's a variation on the facility debate in the early days of NLEs where the discussions I was involved in was, do we want a VTR next to every Avid, fewer VTRs on carts, a centralized machine room so each NLE would be patched according to its momentary need.



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Jim Giberti
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 8:52:09 pm

The more I work in Motion 5 and FCPX, the more I believe Apple is going to evolve the Mac line and not end it...and soon.

There's too much potential in these 64 bit apps they just released to relegate them to an amorphous hardware future.

Like they're obviously not immune to criticism regarding their choices with the FCPX release, they're not deaf regarding their hardware development. I don't think they're going to sit back let this thing atrophy.

I think you'll see a pretty defined view of their creative apps in concert with a new Mac line to support it.

Not that the direction will follow the heavy iron model that a lot of pros still want, but it won't be a retreat either. These apps are simply too powerful in their potential to be developed and then left on some barren Hackintosh landscape.


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Craig Seeman
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 9:02:55 pm

[Jim Giberti] "The more I work in Motion 5 and FCPX, the more I believe Apple is going to evolve the Mac line and not end it...and soon."

They are resource hogs and, given Apple uses software to sell hardware, you're going to want a hogzilla. The hog doesn't have to be a tower though.



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Jim Giberti
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 9:08:06 pm

[Craig Seeman] "They are resource hogs and, given Apple uses software to sell hardware, you're going to want a hogzilla. The hog doesn't have to be a tower though."

Zactly, it's not going to be a surprise to anyone familiar with these Apple people that the future is not going to be based around a decade old design.


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Tangier Clarke
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 9:34:34 pm

Jim I agree with you. What's strange to me is how people seem surprised by the way Apple does things. If you've been using their products for a while, then any of the steps (and missteps) shouldn't be a surprise. And believe me, I get sooo frustrated with Apple sometimes. Though too often I realize (in hind site too) that Apple change the way we do things rather than stick with the status quo. In doing so they create new markets, new followers, new [business] opportunities, and foster new ways of thinking of how we interact with our technology. That is their hallmark I believe.

There's so much they've been doing over the years that points to some amazing things to come; some amazing OS X technologies, database implementations, hardware and software workflow features. ya know, Leopard to Snow Leopard was a lot about cleaning-house - streamlining code, reducing instructions, optimization, etc. I think that this extends into their post apps. though we're all upset over many of their recent decisions (FCP X, Shake, Soundtrack), I've been following the breadth of their work (Quicktime X (AV foundation) being a massive undertaking by the way that is yet finished) and think we're in for some really nice surprises.

I will say when the G5/Mac Pro body came about I was pretty disappointed. I thought if anyone can fit all of that muscle and upgradeability in a box the size of the old G4's, Apple could.

Still waiting.

I'm thinking an Apple Cube 2 with thunderbolt and built in projector like those snazzy smart phones. Ok, maybe that's a bit much.

Tangier


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Tim Wilson
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 9:56:48 pm

[Tangier Clarke] "I'm thinking an Apple Cube 2 with thunderbolt"



I loved the Cube!!! But a perfect example of designing by "we think it's cool" rather than "people can really use this." We'll call it "form over function" and be generous. More like "form stole function's lunch money, pulled down its pants and shoved it in the girls locker room."

BTW, I was in the press pit no more than 30 feet from Steve when he unveiled it at MacWorld NY in 2000. It looked like something that had come down from heaven. The only time since then that I've seen so many people gawking at a device MAY be the Blackmagic Cinema Camera...but I'm actually not sure I've ever seen so many people so enthralled.

But it appeared to crack almost immediately. (Apple swore that they weren't cracks - just LOOKED like cracks, but, as Steve said at the time, "You're looking at it wrong." He didn't really, but he might as well have.) Put a CD in, and it sounded like a rocket about to take off. Power supply problems, hard drive problems, boot problems....lotta problems.

Sales were so far below expectations that, when the report came out, Apple stock lost nearly 50% of its value in a matter of hours. Of course, the stock was at $50 at the time, so dropping to $26 overnight is what we call "a buying opportunity."

One lesson learned is that people using lower-end iMacs didn't step up to the G4 cube. G4 tower owners stepped down. While I continue to maintain that a new Mac Pro is coming...someday...I can easily imagine a nifty new form factor that allows Apple to all but crater its existing customer base and their needs for something that's much more modern, while pushing the price for the new "pro" option way down to create something that will appeal to a potentially exponentially bigger audience.

Insert punchline here.

Tim Wilson
Associate Publisher, Editor-in-Chief
Creative COW Magazine
Twitter: timdoubleyou



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Michael Aranyshev
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 10, 2012 at 11:27:42 am

[Walter Soyka] "Do you need OS X, or do you need application support?"

I need things like QuickLook plugin for DPX and ARRIRAW files and the ability to search for timecode in them in Spotlight


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Thomas Frank
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 9, 2012 at 8:48:31 pm

Dell... lol hp over Dell anyday... but you know what. Wouldn't be funny if everybody is riding this Workstation thing and Apple release the killer Workstation that is going in a totally different direction.
Like the iPhone syndrome. Just guessing but would be funny right?



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Keith Moreau
Re: The Mac Pro we dream about?
on May 11, 2012 at 1:35:43 pm

Every time I use my MacPro 2008 8 Core for intense tasks, like video editing using Premier Pro CS5.5 with native AVCHD files, I wish Apple would release a new Mac Pro. I'm willing to plunk down big bucks for a modern Mac Pro. It doesn't have to be in a new chassis, it would be nice if it had Thunderbolt and if Apple does release a new Mac Pro, it will.

I am hopeful that Apple's delay in producing a Mac Pro is the need to be able to run the newest modern server-class Intel CPUs, the Xeon E5-2600 server class chips that can be chained together in dual CPU mode. From the very beginning the Mac Pro line's mid to higher end models had dual-cpu capability.

It is hopeful to me that even Dell and HP have not yet produced towers with these dual CPU chips yet, this means that Apple might be in the same situation, having just received the first shipments of these in March or perhaps prototypes prior to that, even if they had pre-designed new Mac Pros for these chips based on specs, they still needed to install them and test them and manufacture new Mac Pros. Who knows what issues these new chips introduced and had to be worked out by all the manufactures that use them.

What is a bit frustrating is that Apple, at least on the Mac Pro line, has been silent as to their plans. They seem to be occasionally willing to 'pre announce' devices in their iOS line, such as new iPads, iPhones but not their computers, never have, and probably never will.

So I, and probably thousands, or tens of thousands of people like me, are patiently waiting for Apple to come out with their new Mac Pro line. I am hoping Apple is waiting for actual releases of the Dell T7600 and similar PCs from other manufacturers to announce shipping of Mac Pros, this would be a shrewd business strategy, considering their enmity since Michael Dell said that the best thing Apple could do for their shareholders would be to sell cash in Apple and return the money to investors. Releasing a new ultra Mac Pro would really undercut other PC manufacturers. When Apple releases new models of Mac Pros they tend to be a pretty good deal and quite powerful relative to PCs of the same build. It is just a bit perplexing why Apple didn't release interim Mac Pro's for the past 2 years, as chips have gotten a bit faster and better. That part is disturbing.

Anyway, this is my last hope for a Mac Pro an if they don't come out with one in the next couple of months my next Mac pro might be a (perish the thought...) PC!


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