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Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.

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Walter Soyka
Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:18:35 pm

"Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything." That's Autodesk's NAB promotion [link]. Sounds like Smoke 2013 will be a significant release, but no word on whether it will be either awesome or jaw-dropping.

There's been a little bit of noise about it [link] on Autodesk's Smoke on Mac forum, though they could learn an awful lot about the art of uninformed speculation from us!

I have no idea what they will announce (my wishlist: Batch, bundled Lustre, more competitive pricing in an effort to grab more market share, maybe Windows support), but I'll be stopping by the Autodesk booth to check it out.

I don't know how much interest there is in Smoke here, but the fact that they're evoking FCPX's marketing so heavily is fascinating. I'd argue that Smoke has quite a bit in common with FCP7 -- it's a solid product built on an aging infrastructure with a loyal user base.

It should be interesting to see what Autodesk will release after raising expectations so high, and where a changed Smoke will fit in the new post-production landscape.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:26:18 pm

Smoke is something I would definitely take a look at.

We can't look at it for the price right now, it's simply out of our league.

Curious to see what they come up with.

Jeremy


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David Lawrence
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:41:13 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "We can't look at it for the price right now, it's simply out of our league."

Yep, that's a big one. If they make the price more affordable it gets a lot more interesting. What'll you think they'll drop it to? $999 would be sweet...

_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
twitter.com/dhl


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:46:35 pm

[David Lawrence] "Yep, that's a big one. If they make the price more affordable it gets a lot more interesting. What'll you think they'll drop it to? $999 would be sweet..."

I doubt it they'd go that low, but in this day and age, who knows.

Somewhere in the 2-5k range would do some damage, I'd imagine.

Jeremy


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:31:18 pm

Yeah the price tag has always been the big turnoff for me, although I know it's got an insane feature list. Maybe they're doing a scaled down version for editors? Those who don't need all the uber compositing features? I got an invite to a Autodesk editing focus group at NAB but can't attend due to AJA booth schedule but anxious to see what the announce!

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:32:52 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Smoke is something I would definitely take a look at."

Let me know if you have any questions you'd like me to ask. I assume you're interested in support for P2 metadata -- anything else?

How would you see yourself using it? Finishing only, or would you see starting editorial in Smoke, too?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:45:56 pm

[Walter Soyka] "How would you see yourself using it? Finishing only, or would you see starting editorial in Smoke, too?"

Definitely editorial, and the ability to cut on a laptop and move to a desktop for more heavy duty work.

Yes, for finishing/color. Very light roto/paint/masks. Green screen, and the horsepower needed to run all these things.

P2 metadata (and other format support) would be very sweet. Curious on what an offline/online would be like and how it easy it is to get there from tapeless sources (and tape too, but really mostly tapeless sources, with tape style layoffs/masters).

I just got a tweet from AJA, and they highlight autodesk as one of things to see along with new "products in action":

"Be one of the first to see new AJA products in action at #NABShow, in conjunction with partner companies @Avid @Autodesk, @Adobe +. Lots..."

My guess is that it has to be a price change, right? What else could it be?


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:50:31 pm

By the way, thanks, Walter.

I was one of the ones who really did want an all in one "Final Cut Extreme".

I understand the want and need for separate applications, but I would like an honest attempt at an all in one, with (of course) decent interchange options to get in and out if need be.

Oh, and how well or not does it work with metaSAN?

Jeremy


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Chris Harlan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:04:42 pm

[Walter Soyka] " don't know how much interest there is in Smoke here, but the fact that they're evoking FCPX's marketing so heavily is fascinating. "

If you mean by "here" our forum, then, yeah, I'm quite interested. Gab away.


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Alan Okey
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:35:33 pm

Very interested here to find out what they announce...


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Michael Gissing
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 11:41:08 pm

Hmmm. Watching closely... So far patience has paid off


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Brian Mulligan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 12:34:36 am

Trust me... This will be a big announcement. That's all I can say. I have been editing, ,actual editing on Smoke for years. So it's very much an editor as well as a finishing system.

Brian Mulligan
Senior Editor - Autodesk Smoke
WTHR-TV Indianapolis,IN, USA
Twitter: @bkmeditor


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 1:12:38 am

Thanks, Brian.

I'm curious about it. Glad NAB is only a week away.

Hope it has to do with the MacOS, or excuse me, OSX.

Jeremy


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Michael Horton
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:59:03 am

I've also had the pleasure of seeing it. It really does change everything. It's no hype. It will be shown at the SuperMeet as well as on show floor.

Michael Horton
lafcpug
http://www.lafcpug.org


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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 5:56:49 pm

[Michael Horton] "I've also had the pleasure of seeing it. It really does change everything. It's no hype. It will be shown at the SuperMeet as well as on show floor."

For anyone attending NAB and interested in seeing Smoke at the SuperMeet, there are only about a hundred tickets left. Get 'em before they're gone.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Herb Sevush
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 6:52:35 pm

[Walter Soyka] "For anyone attending NAB and interested in seeing Smoke at the SuperMeet, there are only about a hundred tickets left. Get 'em before they're gone."

As someone who owned Discreet products in the past (edit* & combustion) I would like to state for the record that in my opinion Discreet / Audtodesk is the most dishonorable, disingenuous, disagreeable and disloyal company I have ever dealt with. The way you can know whether they're lying or not is if you can hear them talking. They are the Goldman Sachs of the video industry; they will not hesitate to screw their own customers to make a buck, and they'll laugh about it later. I am not saying their products are worthless, I'm saying their management is. If you are going to do business with them, I suggest you wear a rubber.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Alan Okey
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 7:31:44 pm

[Herb Sevush] "As someone who owned Discreet products in the past (edit* & combustion) I would like to state for the record that in my opinion Discreet / Audtodesk is the most dishonorable, disingenuous, disagreeable and disloyal company I have ever dealt with."

I agree completely.

Great products, great developers, despicable management. They make Apple look like an amateur when it comes to abandoning or killing great software.


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David Jahns
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 7:37:08 pm

[Alan Okey] ""As someone who owned Discreet products in the past (edit* & combustion) I would like to state for the record that in my opinion Discreet / Audtodesk is the most dishonorable, disingenuous, disagreeable and disloyal company I have ever dealt with.""

Wow - you sure you guys aren't talking about Avid in the 90's? ;-)

Granted, I'm new to the Autodesk scene, but in the 6 months I've been using Smoke on Mac, I've been quite happy with them. They've helped with extended trial periods, tech support, training, etc...

This certainly doesn't address issues with product lifecycles and other big picture issues, of course...

Avid certainly has gotten better in the last few years - now my biggest beef is with Apple. Who would have thought that, just a short time ago?

David Jahns
---
Joint Editorial
Portland, OR


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Alan Okey
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 8:23:07 pm

[David Jahns] "Granted, I'm new to the Autodesk scene, but in the 6 months I've been using Smoke on Mac, I've been quite happy with them. They've helped with extended trial periods, tech support, training, etc..."

There's a veritable world of difference between Autodesk Media & Entertainment's (formerly Discreet's) "desktop" and "systems" products. The "systems" products are the big-ticket products like FFI (Flint, Flame and Inferno) and Smoke. Support for the systems products has always been excellent.

The people who got screwed were mostly those who purchased the products that mere mortals could afford, like *edit or Combustion.


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Steve Connor
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 8:57:33 am

[Brian Mulligan] "Trust me... This will be a big announcement. That's all I can say. I have been editing, ,actual editing on Smoke for years. So it's very much an editor as well as a finishing system.
"


Care to share some thoughts on Smoke as an editor? What are it's strengths, what is it's media management and edit toolset like?

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Brian Mulligan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 11:23:26 am

[Steve Connor] "Care to share some thoughts on Smoke as an editor? What are it's strengths, what is it's media management and edit toolset like?"

See this is the problem that I hope this announcement will fix. No one really knows what Smoke is. It has always been a finishing system, but always had a good basis in editorial. It's just that it's cost and placement in the post production world narrowed it's role to being a great finishing suite. But I have been editing on Smoke for 6 years in a broadcast station environment cutting promos, commercials, graphics, and long form.

The editing tools set works just like any other, track based, trim, ripple, slide, slips. But Smoke has a set of deep and powerful tools for color grading, stabilization and 3D compositing. And many of these are available via the timeline as soft effects. And it's speed in processing and processing at high quality 16bit 4:4:4 at every turn.

As far as media management goes. It just works. Smoke is designed as a finishing system, so it accepts EDL, AAF, XML, and anything from h.264 to .r3d. You can edit natively, or you can transcode, or a mixture of both. You can change a transcoded clip to a native clip and back again easily. The transcoded clip retains the original metadata of the clips path, and you can see it via the clip properties in the timeline.

Everything I have said here is nothing new, it's all in the current version of Smoke. So I can't wait to see what is coming.. or changing.... for the better. Cost is the main issue right now for Smoke for Mac. So hopefully this will be addressed as well.

Here is a new reel I put together. It's a bit graphics heavy...







Brian Mulligan
Senior Editor - Autodesk Smoke
WTHR-TV Indianapolis,IN, USA
Twitter: @bkmeditor


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Steve Connor
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 11:35:16 am

[Brian Mulligan] "See this is the problem that I hope this announcement will fix."

Nice reel Brian, thanks for the thoughts. I never considered Smoke because of cost and the impression that it was primarily an incredible finishing tool with an edit capability.

If they are releasing an edit-centric version at a lower price, then as they say it really will change everything.

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 3:51:34 pm

[Brian Mulligan] "Here is a new reel I put together. It's a bit graphics heavy..."

Nice work, Brian.

Was this all done in Smoke?


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Brian Mulligan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:13:05 pm

Of course. That's the point. Only ting from our art dept (C4D) would have been the flipping 13 logo.

Brian Mulligan
Senior Editor - Autodesk Smoke
WTHR-TV Indianapolis,IN, USA
Twitter: @bkmeditor


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:19:18 pm

[Brian Mulligan] "Of course. That's the point. "

Just curious. There were a few graphic elements that I was wondering if they were created in Smoke, and not just composited in Smoke. That's all.

Again, nice work!

Jeremy


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Dan Stewart
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 12, 2012 at 3:02:04 pm

Nice. But..
Simply Amish..?!



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Thomas Frank
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 11:53:24 pm

Maybe we will see lite version called fog?



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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 9, 2012 at 11:55:29 pm

Or Kindle?


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Don Walker
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 1:41:47 am

Maybe they should go with a different naming convention, something elegant and simple like....... EDIT.... yeah that's sounds good!

don walker
texarkana, texas

John 3:16


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Chris Harlan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 1:54:52 am

[Don Walker] "Maybe they should go with a different naming convention, something elegant and simple like....... EDIT.... yeah that's sounds good!
"


Okay. That's funny.


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:00:47 am

Lol... EDIT XI

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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João Manuel Tocha
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 7:41:16 am

The $999 price tag for EDIT X :-) would be great!



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Herb Sevush
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 4:32:59 pm

[Chris Harlan] "That's funny."

Not so funny from my point of view. If those pr*cks at Autodesk wanted an affordable editor/finishing platform they had the basis for one 8 years ago - edit* + combustion. They threw it away then because they didn't know how to market to the masses, I doubt they're any smarter about that market now. I also like the irony of them unveiling a new "Smoke" for Mac just as Apple discontinues the MacPro line.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 4:54:20 pm

They don't even mention "Mac" in the announcement. Maybe that is part of the big news?

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:10:20 pm

[Lance Bachelder] "They don't even mention "Mac" in the announcement. Maybe that is part of the big news?"

Windows support is on my wish list.

That said, Smoke is currently available for both Linux (as Smoke Advanced) and Mac (as Smoke on Mac), so they may just be making a global announcement about the existing family.

5 days to go...

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:17:06 pm

[Lance Bachelder] "They don't even mention "Mac" in the announcement. Maybe that is part of the big news?"

Yeah could be.

Smoke is mainly a Linux beast, so I am sure they aren't just catering to fools like me (us?) on the OSX side.

If only it wasn't $15k. Seriously, it seems to be all I ever wanted. Although, it doesn't look like an intuitive interface, but whatever, I can handle it!

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/limage?siteID=123112&imageID=18560040&...

Jeremy


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Joe Murray
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 9:13:38 pm

"Although, it doesn't look like an intuitive interface, but whatever, I can handle it!"

It's not something you can just noodle around in and figure out completely on your own without reading the manual or working through some tutorials or training, but once you learn the interface, it's very efficient and artist-oriented. Light-years ahead of FCP, Premiere or Avid in terms of interface design, with gestural controls and contextual menu panels all over the place that make floating windows and multiple screens unnecessary. I loved working on it when it was only available on Unix, and would certainly consider it if it became affordable.

Unfortunately none of my clients would pay more to work on a $15k platform vs the combo of FCP and After Effects, otherwise I would have made the leap sooner.

Joe Murray
Edit at Joe's
Charlotte, NC


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 9:26:37 pm

[Joe Murray] "It's not something you can just noodle around in and figure out completely on your own without reading the manual"

What? Manual? It has a manual? That's so 1999.

Just kidding.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Jeremy


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Joe Murray
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 9:40:40 pm

[Joe Murray] "It's not something you can just noodle around in and figure out completely on your own without reading the manual"

"What? Manual? It has a manual? That's so 1999.

Just kidding.

With great power comes great responsibility."

Actually, I never read the manual either, but you're right it was 1999! When I worked on Smoke they flew a nice French Canadian fellow in from Montreal for a week to train me. That was included in the $350,000 pricetag I guess. How things change. I'm assuming I would be forced to read the manual this time around.

Joe Murray
Edit at Joe's
Charlotte, NC


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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 9:45:48 pm

[Joe Murray] "Actually, I never read the manual either, but you're right it was 1999! When I worked on Smoke they flew a nice French Canadian fellow in from Montreal for a week to train me. That was included in the $350,000 pricetag I guess. How things change. I'm assuming I would be forced to read the manual this time around."

The manual is a 2500-page slog.

Grant Kay has some introductory material available at The Area, and Brian Mulligan (frequent poster here) has led a few good classes with FXPHD.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Thomas Frank
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:20:08 pm

Where did you get that Info that Apple is discontinuing the Mac Pro?
Like to see the valid source.



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Steve Connor
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:21:50 pm

[Thomas Frank] "Where did you get that Info that Apple is discontinuing the Mac Pro?
Like to see the valid source."


Shane Ross got it from his "sources"

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Thomas Frank
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:34:36 pm

What source is that?
Like to see read the source myself.



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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:38:09 pm

[Thomas Frank] "What source is that? Like to see read the source myself."

The original thread is here:
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/335/29895

Shane has not revealed the identify of his sources.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Herb Sevush
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:27:03 pm

[Thomas Frank] "Where did you get that Info that Apple is discontinuing the Mac Pro? Like to see the valid source."

No valid source, just assumptions based on evidence. I would love to be proven wrong.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Thomas Frank
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:37:20 pm

That is the point I don't see any evidence only one I see (if you want to compare with the past) the Mac Pro is still ticking.
It seems Nvidia is planning for a major card update on the Mac.



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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:39:06 pm

[Thomas Frank] "That is the point I don't see any evidence only one I see (if you want to compare with the past) the Mac Pro is still ticking. It seems Nvidia is planning for a major card update on the Mac."

Did you just refute a rumor with another rumor?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Herb Sevush
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 5:44:27 pm

[Thomas Frank] " I don't see any evidence"

It was long presumed that the only reason the MacPro line has not been refreshed in over 18 months was the delay in releasing the new Xeons. The Xeons were released over a month ago, many other competitors have announced new releases (see HP Z820) and Apple is sphinx like. At the time of the Intel release many were guessing that new MacPros would be out by mid April. The clock is ticking.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Chris Harlan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 6:22:45 pm

[Herb Sevush] "If those pr*cks at Autodesk wanted an affordable editor/finishing platform they had the basis for one 8 years ago - edit* + combustion."

Yeah, I used to use it when it was D/Vision before Discreet Logic ate it. Back when Crystal Flying Fonts was considered an ace gfx package.

[Herb Sevush] "They threw it away then because they didn't know how to market to the masses, I doubt they're any smarter about that market now."

You would obviously know better, but my impression at the time was they purposely hobbled and then killed it because it offered to much competition to their precious IRIX line, specifically to Smoke.

[Herb Sevush] "I also like the irony of them unveiling a new "Smoke" for Mac just as Apple discontinues the MacPro line"
[Herb Sevush] "[Chris Harlan] "That's funny."
Not so funny from my point of view."


Then how about an iRonic Sequel--That's Funny2: Smoke gets in your i.

Cue The Platters:





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Herb Sevush
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 6:29:48 pm

[Chris Harlan] "my impression at the time was they purposely hobbled and then killed it because it offered to much competition to their precious IRIX line, specifically to Smoke. "

It was a combination of the two, inability to market a low cost editor along with fear of the low cost editor eating into sales of it's more profitable siblings. Along with gross stupidity off course - starting with the albatross of it's new name - *edit. I can't begin to tell you how many Abott and Costello "who's on first" routines that name caused it's users.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Chris Harlan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 6:58:43 pm

[Herb Sevush] "It was a combination of the two, inability to market a low cost editor along with fear of the low cost editor eating into sales of it's more profitable siblings. Along with gross stupidity off course"

I remember thinking how weirdly unaware they were (or at least pretended to be ) that the SGI speed/power kingdom was being overtaken by mass-produced dual Pentiums and the rapid development of cheap, advanced gfx cards to feed a hoard of hungry gamers. I felt that they actually NEEDED something like that on the NT platform to take advantage of that surge. Hey, maybe the announcement will be Smoke for Windows NT!


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Chris Harlan
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 8:35:56 pm

[Chris Harlan] "Hey, maybe the announcement will be Smoke for Windows NT!"

And, if they do, they apparently still have another whole two years on the platform. Apparently MS just announced that they will be ending all XP support on April 8, 2014.

http://www.infoworld.com/d/microsoft-windows/microsoft-starts-xp-retirement...


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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 2:11:01 pm

There's a little more teaser information available at http://www.smokeischanging.com [link] (shamelessly boosted from a new thread on the COW's Smoke forum [link]):

“This version of Smoke is disruptive… to take a visual effects product and make it non-linear editing centric? We’ve all wanted some software to come along and be the super app… this is what we’ve all been waiting for.”
Evan Schechtman, CTO and Industry Evangelist

At this exclusive event, Autodesk will unveil the next generation of Smoke, a revolutionary new solution that connects effects and editing like never before.


Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 2:40:07 pm

Oh well. This makes me think the price won't come down.

"Exclusive" and "effects" does not an affordable (my level of affordable) product make.

That's alright. If one can afford it, I'm sure it's worth every penny and I'm sure it's a steal for the value in the circles that use it.

There used to be this smoke demo video for a Mitsubishi (?) commercial. It's old now (probably 8 or 10 years), but the capabilities were sweet. It was mostly VFX that were made to patch things up and enhance (rig removal, skyline replacements, tracking, keying, stabilization, etc, all stuff right up my alley as I need to do this on small levels) and not so much motion graphics or cg effects. It was a kick ass demo and sticks with me today. It was set to Big Audio Dynamite, "Rush". I can't find it anymore.

Jeremy


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 2:46:05 pm

By the power of Grayskull, here's the spot:







Jeremy


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Steve Connor
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 2:59:11 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "By the power of Grayskull, here's the spot:
"


Nice spot and great track!

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Alan Okey
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 2:59:24 pm

I've shown about 20 people the exact same video over the past few years. It's always a crowd pleaser...


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 3:17:19 pm

Yes. It's a very well done spot.

There used to be tutorials on how it was done. Those demos were great, just too rich for my blood, unfortunately.

Still, they were inspiring on a professional level.

This was before Smoke on a Mac, too, so it was even more out of reach for us mere mortals.

Great capabilities though, maybe some day. ;)

Jeremy


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Alan Okey
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 3:48:56 pm

I just realized that the video you posted is just the spot, not the behind-the-scenes smoke discussion/tutorial. Looks like it's no longer on the Autodesk site, unfortunately. It really highlighted the power of having all of smoke's tools available during editorial.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 3:55:37 pm

[Alan Okey] "I just realized that the video you posted is just the spot, not the behind-the-scenes smoke discussion/tutorial. Looks like it's no longer on the Autodesk site, unfortunately. It really highlighted the power of having all of smoke's tools available during editorial."

Yeah, that's where the eye opening really happened for me. I can't find them either.

I need more power from Grayskull, but apparently the generators aren't running at full capacity today.


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 4:35:39 pm

Thanks for the post - I'll be there! NAB 2012 a year to remember?

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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David Jahns
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 7:08:28 pm

funny - I started this same thread on the Smoke forum and only got one comment - should have known this would be the place for speculation and chatter! ;-)

I've been using Smoke-Mac for about 6 months as a Color/Finish tool in a shop with 10 edit rooms (currently Avid 5 and FCP 7 - hoping CS6 is great), and I've gotta say that the learning curve for Smoke is pretty steep. It's quite a reminder of how similar most Mac/Windows programs are - the metaphors and organization Autodesk uses are completely different than what you're used to. Once you get it, it's pretty awesome/powerful, (and could be even more awesome with some improvements) but the idea of switching a facility to Smoke as a primary editing tool?

It would need a MAJOR overhaul to fit that bill - interface, cost, SAN architecture, etc...

Well, let's see what the big news is - but I doubt it would make sense for most places. With the XML/AAF conform, why do you need to edit in the same tool as you finish?

For short projects with a quick turnaround, it might make sense to skip the conform step, but I can't imagine doing a large project, and sorting through hours and hours of footage and with Smoke would be more efficient than an Avid/FCP 7.

Just not sure "more editing centric" is good enough for most editors to make such a major switch...

Personally, I would love to see

1) some Lustre integration (or at least g-masks in the Color Warper secondaries!),
2) Are re-think of the Editdesk/Library relationship, and of course,
3) we'd all love Batch FX... (or at least Batch Export from the Library)

We'll see on Sunday!

(at least the speculation is only going on for a few days, as opposed to the endless months of spilled in over FCP-X...)

David Jahns
---
Joint Editorial
Portland, OR


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Lance Bachelder
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 10, 2012 at 7:38:20 pm

Everyone on the Cow knows - if you want to introduce/update/evangelize for any NLE other than FCPX, this is yer forum ;)

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Ben Rojas
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 11, 2012 at 10:54:09 pm

well, all my connections are under non-disclosures, but I've pieced together some things that I'll add to the discussion. I've been on Smoke for 12 yrs. with a 2yr hiatus on Avid DS. Smoke is truly an amazing Finishing/Compositing sys. My only complaint, it's always been cumbersome and not very conducive to "rapid fire" creative editorial type editing. It's gotten better through the years; especially audio, but it's never felt right. Not so much the physical cutting, you get used to anything, but media management, bin layout, etc... Everything we're accustomed to in Avid and FCP. I agree w/those w/respect to Edit/Combustion getting killed off because the big bros were taking a hit. I'm sure I wasn't the only Editor/Smoke Artist heading home at night, popping open a laptop and cutting w/Avid Express and Composting w/Combustion. That was truly a WTF moment for me. But I digress, so what in my talks have I pieced together and why. First the why. Our facility, like many out there, is transitioning to another NLE. Our 2 choices, Avid or Adobe. Avid, tried and true. It's like getting back together w/an old girlfriend ;o) Adobe, especially if they hit us w/Speedgrade, is looking damn good. But in the end, we're still finishing in Smoke. I've brought it up time and time again w/resellers, reps and others in the know and just last week I was wink winked that my wish is coming true. Well, that wish was/is a FCP/Avid style UI w/a powerful timeline compositor, which we have now, but the continued options to pop into the DVE, oooops, I mean Action, CC, Keyer, etc. My other hope, and not a wish because the drop to 15K was a wish come true a few years ago, a reduction in price to actually have more than one in the shop. That being said, I'm still in the dark w/oh so many questions and chomping at the bit to see this "game changer". No ones calling it that, but considering how many folks are in the same position as us, if the price is right, Avid & Adobe might be left wondering what just happen here.

Cheers mates, great discussion.
Ben

Ben Rojas
Editor|Artist|Dir. of Post Production
KSC KREATE
3850 N 28th Ter. Ste. 101
Hollywood, FL. 33020
P. 954.326.7600
F. 954.326.7766
C. 305.301.2771
E. ben.rojas@ksckreate.com
http://www.ksckreate.com


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Walter Soyka
Re: Autodesk Smoke is changing. Everything.
on Apr 13, 2012 at 8:07:31 am

Walter Biscardi seems quite excited about the new Smoke release.

His word? "Wow."

http://blogs.creativecow.net/blog/11402/smoke-is-changing-is-not-a-marketin...

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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