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Would this work?

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David Powell
Would this work?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 9:07:02 pm

I heard X mixes frame rates well. I by mistake cut a protest transcoded sequence at 29.97 No big deal.I'll just copy it into a 23.98 sequence. This didn't work. Everything goes out of sync and the footage goes crazy and or disappears. I'm wondering if using X to pro and bringing the sequence into X then back into GDP would fix this? On a side note, the answer to the ultimate question is "whatever the client pays you to do." I personally hate using legacy having been cutting on avid for the last year, but work forces me there and I'm getting a nice rate. And if someone pays enough and demands the project be cut on X then I'll have to learn that as well.


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TImothy Auld
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 9:13:46 pm

Is this an Avid project you're working on

Tim


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TImothy Auld
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 9:16:00 pm

And, if so, what version of Avid?

Tim


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TImothy Auld
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 9:18:57 pm

And, as a general observation, I don't know of any NLE that mixes frames rates well. The longer a project gets the worse the problems become.

Tim


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David Powell
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 1:38:33 am

No I'm in FCP 7. The truth is though. I'm not actually mixing frame rates. The footage is 23.98, but was edited in a 29.97 timeline. So if was going to screw up, it should've done so in the 29.97 TL no? Im just copying the 23.98 footage that was edited in a 29.97 TL back to a 23.98 TL.


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Bret Williams
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 1:44:15 am

Any decent NLE should be able to mix certain frame rates. Adding 24p into a 29.97 interlaced sequence should be child's play for any NLE. It's simply adding pulldown to the 24p footage. X does this just fine. Unfortunately Legacy is unable to do this.

But putting 29.97 into 24p, especially if it's interlaced, is a mess. You're losing 20% of your temporal data. Frames have to be removed or somehow blended to cram that data into the 24p space.

IMO you only shoot and edit 24p if you're going to completely edit 24p. Otherwise there's not much point. If you add any 29.97 footage, you should be editing in a 29.97i (60i) timeline so your 24p looks smooth with pulldown. But the two won't look the same.


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David Powell
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 5:37:03 am

Yes the fact that the sequence was set to 29.97 was a mistake. The thing is the original footage is 23.98 and i'm pasting it back into a 23.98 timebase, so it should work perfect. I don't get it.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:04:16 am

[David Powell] "The thing is the original footage is 23.98 and i'm pasting it back into a 23.98 timebase, so it should work perfect. I don't get it."

Once its in the other time line, it has taken on the other attributes, and there is some sort hierarchical metadata tangle. Its been a long time since I've gotten snarled up in something like this, but try disconnecting all the media in the old time line, then paste the framework into the new timeline, save, and then re-attach to the source material. I can't remember if that worked, or if I hand to hand replace, but it might be worth a try for you. You might also try exporting a simple .edl of the corrected timeline, import the .edl,, and that will save you some work in rebuilding. Break a leg.


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Shane Ross
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 2:56:02 am

Avid MC5, 5.5 and MC6 mixes frame rates VERY well. FCP 7...not well at all.

And if you copy and paste from one timebase to another, things will go way out of whack, and you will need to manually fix this shot by shot.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Chris Harlan
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 7:53:01 am

[Shane Ross] "Avid MC5, 5.5 and MC6 mixes frame rates VERY well. FCP 7...not well at all.
"


I've cut a number of Sizzles where I was able to quite successfully mix PAL and NTSC on an NTSC timeline. Of course, they are all very short shots, and generally not only do they not need to match, but actually need to stand apart from each other. On the other hand, going from NTSC to PAL in FCP 7 is almost always a train wreck. Hardware is still the best for that, and even that looks crappy.


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TImothy Auld
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 12:48:27 pm

Recent Avid's do handle this quite well and though I did run into a problem doing this on a long form project that may well have been due to my own legendary stupidity. And unpleasant as this may sound the one time I made this mistake with FCP 7 the only solution was, just as Shane said, to go in and fix it shot by shot.

Tim


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Oliver Peters
Re: Would this work?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 1:41:57 pm

If you want to fix this, the right place to get back to a 23.98 timeline is in FCP 7. Copy and paste your timeline clips to a 23.98 timeline and then go through all the cuts and fix any trim errors, like 1frame gaps. Once you have a proper 23.98 timeline using the original 23.98 media in FCP 7, then you can go to any other NLE. If you are trying to deliver the edited 23.98 cut as a 29.97 file for broadcast, FCP X will add the proper 3:2 cadence. FCP 7 won't. However, I almost always use AE for such conversions.

Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com


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