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Christopher Travis
Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 3:43:34 pm

Hello all,

I'm thinking about upgrading my home edit from a 2009(ish) iMac and I was wondering what everyone's thoughts were on whats available on the windows market these days. I know this is off-topic but I see a lot of discussion about hardware choices on this forum from people who seem to know their eggs so this looks like a good place to tap into the collective knowledge on the subject.

I am a freelance editor and most of my work is done away from home, but I like to have a setup at home for smaller side jobs and personal projects (in particular I am interested in cutting short films in my spare time). My first thought was to just get a new iMac but now that I am contemplating a switch of software to Premiere Pro and/or Avid MC it seems to make sense to consider if there are similarly priced windows solutions out there that may be better equipped in terms of GPU to take advantage of these program's 64bit architecture.

I'm not looking for an enterprise level workstation so if we take the price of a top-of-the-range iMac as a price guide could anyone point me in the direction of some good websites or manufacturers who could kit me out with a decent PP/MC setups (I'd like to keep my options as open as possible at this stage when it comes to software packages).


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Herb Sevush
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 4:18:04 pm

[Christopher Travis] "could anyone point me in the direction of some good websites or manufacturers who could kit me out with a decent PP/MC setups"

adkvideoediting.com

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Herb Sevush
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 4:37:08 pm

[Christopher Travis] "could anyone point me in the direction of some good websites or manufacturers who could kit me out with a decent PP/MC setups"

The other thing I should mention is the Videoguys DIY (do it yourself) build lists. Complete lists for high value / low cost systems. Even if you don't want to roll your own, the list is a great way to learn what you need to look for in a goold NLE box.

http://www.videoguys.com/Guide/Default.aspx

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Christopher Travis
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 5:32:04 pm

Thanks Herb,

I'm in the UK so can't but from either of these sites, but it's a great place to start looking at what I need.


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Richard Cardonna
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 6:04:38 pm

I am using a laptop with 27 inch external monitor and keyboard (shuttle) connected a raid and it works great ( I mostly work in avchd,hdv,dv) My camera is an af101.

I do events, and comerical, web and currently working on film for a local station. I chose the lap top because of its small footprint and portability (I can edit at the clients place or in the field.

Besides it saves a ton in power versus a desktop. Besides editing I do some compositing and color correction. I Have CS5.5 production premium and avid 6. For what I do both work great.

For this I have a sony vaio fx series 8 core i7 with 8 gbram. It has esata,firewire,usb 3 ans sd card slots.

Will be purchasing a matrox mini as soon as PPro gets it right.

Richard Cardonna


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Geoff Addis
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 8:29:25 pm

I would suggest that you contact DVC in brighton,http://www.dvc.uk.com, they are great guys to deal with and really know the business. I would also suggest that you look at Edius as it is a great real time performing and stable system.

Geoff


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Bernard Newnham
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 10:12:48 pm

I bought Edius from DVC the other week at half price.

I build my own PCs with parts that usually come from dabs.com, and my current one has a Core i5 2500, Asus P8Z68-V LE, GeForce 460 and 8Gb RAM. You'll see a lot of posts on here talking about Xeon this and that and chat about expensive workstations, but actually you don't need all that stuff to do most editing jobs. The thing I'm working on in Edius at the moment is big on effects, though only in SD, and it takes a lot of layers to need any rendering at all. I expect if I was doing this one in HD the machine go a bit slower, but thinking time is always good.

You'll also see a lot of stuff about the horrors of Windows, but I sit here switching back and forth between a Hackintosh running OSX and a W7 PC. Neither crashes, there are no BSODs on either machine, and people talk an awful lot of b****cks. I keep the Mac because I use Soundtrack pro and Motion.

Personally I prefer Windows because I like my applications to close when I close the window, I like to be able to delete things by pressing the delete key, I like Alt to be called Alt and not Option, and I like to be able to cut and paste as well as copy and paste. But that's just me.

Bernie


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Craig Seeman
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 11:32:27 pm

You can Bootcamp your 2009 iMac and run Windows 7 on it.
Granted it's still a 2009 iMac as far as technology but it would allow you to get going on Windows software and if you added Parallels you could move things back and forth.

If you're happy with iMacs (all in one) you could do that with a new iMac as well. As Thunderbolt support is about to commence on Windows it might allow you to move new peripherals between the OSs as well. The one downside is lack of CUDA if you move to software that can use it (PP for example).



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Christopher Travis
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:39:28 am

Thanks Craig,

I know about bootcamp, I also know I'm able to buy Mac versions of MC and/or PP. What I'm interested in is the improved realtime performance of these 2 programs when running on supported hardware. I think my experience in either PP or MC on my old iMac would probably be about the same as I am currently seeing in FCP7 (I just realised my iMac is 2007 not 2009).

Thanks everyone for the tips. I've been sniffing around the Zen and DVC sites and it looks like, for the price of a top range iMac (about £1,600) I could get a pretty tricked out windows box with more processing power and a better, CUDA enable GPU. I'm still very interested to hear about any custom builds people have made on here and their experiences with them.

Another question. When ordering MC6 and/or CS5.5 do you get different DVDs for Mac and Windows versions, or is it the same DVD?


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Mike Smith
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 9:55:23 am

Also consider

http://www.zenvideo.co.uk/

http://www.creativevideo.co.uk/


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Bernard Newnham
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 1:43:44 pm

They have a nice "making of" video here -
http://www.zenvideo.co.uk/pc_systems_for_video.htm
- thought their chipset recommendations lower down the page are already out of date.

Making a PC these days is a lot like Lego, and nearly as easy. Doesn't matter which operating system you load it with - W7, OSX, Ubuntu, whatever - the build is the same. And when it starts for the first time, it's a very satisfying moment.

B


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Steve Connor
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 1:52:05 pm

[Bernard Newnham] "And when it starts for the first time, it's a very satisfying moment."

That's true, before I moved to Mac I used to build my own and that first boot up is a great feeling!

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Jacob Lanum
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 4:14:38 pm

Avid's disc has mac & pc versions on it

Adobe is One or the other


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Steve Connor
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 4:18:33 pm

[Jacob Lanum] "Adobe is One or the other"

http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud.html

One thing to look at is Adobe Creative Cloud which is supposedly coming soon, this gives you ALL of Adobe's apps on both Mac and PC for quite a reasonable monthly cost

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Marvin Holdman
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 6:16:19 pm

Strange.....

No one recommends FCPX as a non-enterprise level editor of short movies at the house? What gives?

Despite all it's problems integrating into enterprise level environments, I honestly thought it might be worth considering for the house. Although the original poster didn't mention it as an option, I'm quite surprised that no one brought it up. I guess it's not been considered because we're talking about an experienced editor?

Non being sarcastic, or trying to stir it up, just wondering why it wouldn't be considered?

Marvin Holdman
Production Manager
Tourist Network
8317 Front Beach Rd, Suite 23
Panama City Beach, Fl
phone 850-234-2773 ext. 128
cell 850-585-9667
skype username - vidmarv


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Steve Connor
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 6:19:46 pm

[Marvin Holdman] "Non being sarcastic, or trying to stir it up, just wondering why it wouldn't be considered?"

The OP was asking what was available on the Windows Platform!

But don't let that put you off having a dig at FCPX

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Christopher Travis
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 6:27:45 pm

I suppose it was clear from my original post that I knew what software options are available to me and that I still intend to switch to Windows. Although I suppose it's still odd that no one has jumped in to remind me how great FCPX is and that I really oughta give it a try.

FFIW as a freelancer I go where the industry goes and in the places I work no one is even talking about FCPX. I'm the only person I know who takes even an academic interest in it.

Obviously FCPLegacy's days are numbered which is why I want to get myself setup at home on a windows machine running MC and/or PP (depending on which software I can buy/beg/borrow/steal) and get up to scratch in this environment on my own time while I run out the clock as a professional FCP editor so that I can start confidently applying for jobs on those platforms within a year.


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Steve Connor
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 6:38:43 pm

[Christopher Travis] "Although I suppose it's still odd that no one has jumped in to remind me how great FCPX is and that I really oughta give it a try."

As I said, it's because you asked about Windows, and for what it's worth FCPX IS very good but you really need a reason to invest the time required to learn it. If no clients of yours are using it then there's no point yet.

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Craig Seeman
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 6:41:37 pm

[Christopher Travis] "it's still odd that no one has jumped in to remind me how great FCPX is and that I really oughta give it a try."

FCPX is great and you really oughta give it a try. ;-)

[Christopher Travis] "FFIW as a freelancer I go where the industry goes and in the places I work no one is even talking about FCPX. "

That's the reality for the time being. It may still be worth learning because that day may come and those that have it mastered will be tops on the list. Even I don't think that'll be the case in the near future though. I think that may well hinge on what replaces the MacPro as well.

I did mention Bootcamp in my previous post. You may want to maintain fluency in both operating systems without having to get two computers.



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Christopher Travis
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:26:15 pm

In my humble opinion FCPX looks great but I also think that there are thousands of reasons why it will not be embraced by the broadcast industry in this country. At least not for a long while. These arguments have been made a lot better than I can make them elsewhere on this forum but here are a couple that I think get overlooked.

A lot of places had put off making purchasing decisions while waiting to see what Apple did with FCP and now they are forced to make those purchases. FCPX is not right for them at the moment. Maybe it can do everything the large broadcast post house needs but it is just too radical, I would never in a million years risk moving my workflow over to it at this stage. There is no trust. And so as the rest of the NLEs and hardware manufacturers move on, so everyone is forced to look elsewhere to remain both compatible and competitive with the rest of the industry. FCPX will probably get another shot in 3/4 years time when the next upgrades are being planned so let's see what they've done with it by then. Now that I think about it, the wait for FCPX has probably brought a lot of post-houses in line with each other in terms of upgrades, like when a bunch of women live together and start getting their "visits" at the same time. We might see upgrades happening in a more synchronised manner in future.

Also, as hinted at in my earlier post, in the broadcast world prod companies and freelancers are mutually dependent on each other. A freelancer needs to know how to use the software used by the prod companies, and the prod companies need to be able to draw from the largest talent pool possible. Rightly or wrongly, FCPX is an outsider and as such neither the freelancer nor the talent booker is likely to spend too much time worrying about it as it doesn't represent much of the work OR the talent in the market.

Obviously I may be completely wrong and in 12 months every decent broadcast job ad is asking for FCPX editors. In which case I'll kick myself. But based on ALL the evidence I see, I'm willing to take that chance. I need to prioritize my skills development and FCPX doesn't make sense for me right now.


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Craig Seeman
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:44:24 pm

My own guess is it could take the rest of this year for FCPX feature set to get to the level where it might be facility worthy (yet I do know of one not in the USA using it) and maybe another year before enough facilities begin to trust it again. This really depends on who features and reliability develop as well as what follows the MacPro. I think it'll move into the corporate market a bit more quickly. Just my opinion as I look into my crystal iBall.



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Christopher Travis
Re: Advice for a new home system?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 8:50:07 pm

Oh yes. No doubt it'll gain traction in the corporate/events world very soon. My friend runs a small corporate video company and I've been screaming at him to look into X. It makes all sorts of sense for that kind of work.


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