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FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?

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Walter Soyka
FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 4, 2012 at 7:55:56 pm

Any NAB-goers from this forum interested in meeting up?

With all the evening events dominating people's schedules, perhaps a morning or afternoon get together might be easier (unless perhaps everyone is going to MMB or SuperMeet).

Any takers for coffee on Tuesday or Wednesday?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Andrew Richards
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 4, 2012 at 8:20:39 pm

If only I were going....

Best,
Andy


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moody glasgow
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 4, 2012 at 10:25:17 pm

I'll show up if I can. I'll be in Vegas from Sunday night till Weds morning.

moody glasgow
smoke/flame
http://www.thereelthinginc.com


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Dennis Radeke
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 4, 2012 at 10:48:54 pm

I will certainly be at the Supermeet and hope that many of you will come up and find the tall guy (I'm 6'5") and introduce yourselves! Always happy to chat if you've got questions.

Dennis


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 4, 2012 at 11:24:26 pm

Since the very first Supermeet, (and actually, some of the initial meetings of the LAFCPUG before that) I've historically helped with the "behind the scenes" aspects of the meetings as well as the endless zillion dollar raffles that are a big part of them.

So while I'll be certainly be there - I'm not going to have too much time at the event itself for quality "talk time."

So I'd personally prefer Walter's idea of a dedicated meet-up.

How about Monday late afternoon - or Wed lunchtime?

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 12:21:02 am

well sure, maybe try and keep an eye out for the john cleese scale person bearing hopefully glad tidings..

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos
http://www.ogallchoir.net
promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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TImothy Auld
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 1:54:06 am

I am still in the process of scheduling an upcoming job and trying to figure out if I can actually go to the show. But if I'm able to get there then I'd very much enjoy the opportunity to meet and discuss the state of things.

Tim


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Rich Rubasch
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 1:59:11 am

I'm in. I arrive Saturday Morning. I am attending the opening session Monday morning but I can be flexible with whatever you guys work out.

Glad to hang with anyone from the "herd" and talk shop.

Rich Rubasch
Tilt Media Inc.
Video Production, Post, Studio Sound Stage
Founder/President/Editor/Designer/Animator
http://www.tiltmedia.com


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tony west
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 4:14:02 am

I wish I could Walter, that would be awesome.

I can't wait to hear all your updates from out there.


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 6:11:47 am

Just saw Walter's post suggesting that I "guide" this.

HA!

Still, as a veteran of probably the past 20+ NABs I guess I'm as qualified as the next guy.

So here's where I think we are.

I like Walter's idea of something early. That way we don't conflict with the NAB evening social whirl.

I think it would be nice if we can find a locale thats less then four football fields distant from the nearest Monorail station. Which, now that I think about it, surprisingly leaves out about 80% of the hotels and explains why so many at the show are in business suits and tennis shoes - but I digress.

I'll even volunteer to show up a bit early to block out some seats somewhere.
(I'm not 6'5 like Denis, but he's only got 3 inches on me, so I can probably hold a few chairs against the coffee starved multitudes 'til the stragglers show up.)

Anyone here know Vegas well enough to know if there's a good place where could score space for a small group before the show that doesn't require a dedicated cab ride?

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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moody glasgow
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 4:33:33 pm

[Bill Davis] "Anyone here know Vegas well enough to know if there's a good place where could score space for a small group before the show that doesn't require a dedicated cab ride?
"


I usually stay at the MGM which has a convient monorail stop, but I don't know a good spot off the top of my head.

moody glasgow
smoke/flame
http://www.thereelthinginc.com


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Walter Soyka
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 4:54:10 pm

[moody glasgow] "I usually stay at the MGM which has a convient monorail stop, but I don't know a good spot off the top of my head."

I'll be at the MGM, too. I think the Starbucks in the West Wing has a seating area which may accommodate us. (We'll just have to be very clear on where we are; there are three Starbuckses (!) at the MGM Grand, but only one offers a "comfortable coffee-shop setting.")

Bill proposed Monday afternoon or Wednesday morning. Any preferences among those?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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moody glasgow
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 5:04:52 pm

I have to fly back early (8AM) Wednesday morning, so I wouldn't be able to make it if it is on Wednesday.

moody glasgow
smoke/flame
http://www.thereelthinginc.com


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Walter Soyka
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 5:15:02 pm

[moody glasgow] "I have to fly back early (8AM) Wednesday morning, so I wouldn't be able to make it if it is on Wednesday."

Ok, then Monday afternoon it is.

I'll see if I can find someplace closer to the convention center. MGM is at the other end of the monorail line.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Greg Andonian
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 6:27:10 am

If anyone from Apple tries to hijack this meet-up of yours, don't let them... ;)

______________________________________________
"THAT'S our fail-safe point. Up until here, we still have enough track to stop the locomotive before it plunges into the ravine... But after this windmill it's the future or bust."


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 6:42:51 pm

[Greg Andonian] "If anyone from Apple tries to hijack this meet-up of yours, don't let them... ;)

Let us not forget that before this, while, Mike and Dan were arguably in the process of "re-branding" the event as the more platform agnostic Supermeet. (and thus de-emphasizing it's Apple/FCP orientation) - for the nine years prior, it was exactly that - the FCPUG Super Meet.

So I think the expectation that a brand new Final Cut Pro being debuted for the first time ever in a public forum being the thing that best served the needs of the attending audience was pretty universal and rational.

Did Apple "big foot" things a bit. Sure. But so what? They were ready to release the "next big thing" that was the whole reason this meeting grew to be important to FCP users.

So for me, it to say that the meeting was "hijacked" - while technically accurate, I guess - is a little like coming home late to tell you wife that your tardiness was the result of being distracted by a broken down motorist who needed assistance - and to have her learn later that the culprit was a well known super-model. It kinda changes the narrative a bit.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Bill Hall
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 12:40:27 pm

I wish I was there this year.

This could be the best or worst idea ever though. Either we will see a lively discussion or a fist fight.


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Gary Huff
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 2:01:47 pm

[Bill Hall] Either we will see a lively discussion or a fist fight.

Probably more along the lines of "eye rolling" than "fist fight".


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Herb Sevush
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 2:54:47 pm

[Bill Hall] "Either we will see a lively discussion or a fist fight."

Like the Hekawis of "F-Troop" fame, we are lovers, not fighters.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Andy Field
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 6:00:42 pm

F-Troop fans will remember that the Hakawi tribe was originally called the Fugawi tribe until network censors figured that out...of course when the F-Troopers ask the Indians who they were they replied "We're the Fugawi" Which is appropriate and the question most FCP editors are asking a year after FCP X rode into town

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 7:38:45 pm

[Herb Sevush] "Like the Hekawis of "F-Troop" fame, we are lovers, not fighters."

And even more important than that - we're grown ups. (presumptively)

Grown ups argue - even get passionate - but are also presumed to already understand the lessons of sports - compete hard - but when you're not competing - shake hands and get over it.

That's precisely what I expect in Vegas.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Andy Field
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 5, 2012 at 8:26:16 pm

What no cage match????

Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852


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Lance Bachelder
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 6, 2012 at 4:37:39 am

Love to be in the cage - I'll be in the AJA booth Mon. afternoon working. Have a great meeting!

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California



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Walter Soyka
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 6, 2012 at 5:16:17 pm

How about 3:00pm on Monday, April 16th at the Fortuna cafe at LVH (adjoining the convention center)?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 6, 2012 at 6:06:22 pm

Well done, Walter.

I'm in.

I'll try to arrive at 2:45 and secure table space.

Hope to see lots of you there.

Hope the facility doesn't boom "O Fortuna" loudly all day long - that would make our get-together WAY too dramatic. ; )

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Walter Soyka
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 6, 2012 at 6:37:30 pm

[Bill Davis] "Well done, Walter. I'm in. I'll try to arrive at 2:45 and secure table space. Hope to see lots of you there."

You'll all be able to recognize Bill. He'll be the guy grinning whilst zipping with ease through client videos on his laptop with FCPX. I'll be the guy next to him, straining to stand up straight with a monster sizzle core workstation strapped to my back.

If all else fails, I'm sure we can recognize each other by our dashing good looks from our forum avatars.

I'd suggest that anybody interested in showing up could informally RSVP here or keep subscribed to this thread in case there are any last-minute changes.

Thanks, all, and I do look forward to meeting you!

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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TImothy Auld
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 6, 2012 at 8:29:06 pm

That's a perfect place, and if I'm going to be there it's going to be early in the week. I'll let you know for sure. And thanks Bill for volunteering to be the advance guard.

Tim


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 1:31:10 am

Happy to help.

I actually don't arrive in Vegas until noon Monday - so depending on check in and the shuttle/cab/monorail situation, I'm hoping that 3 hrs is enough - it should be fine.

Now all I need is Craig to show up for moral support. Craig? Dude? are you going to be at NAB?

I know a lot of folks at PetSmart in the Corporate headquarters. I can probably score some free cat toys for you. Just sayin'

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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TImothy Auld
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 3:01:20 pm

Sadly there's just no way I'm going to get there on Monday (maybe not at all.) I'll be sorry to miss it. Have fun and please solve all our problems. Thanks.

Tim


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David Roth Weiss
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 7:21:10 pm

[TImothy Auld] "Have fun and please solve all our problems."

Having fun is easy in Las Vegas Tim, but solving all the problems Apple has created is well beyond the scope of this group. :)

However, I do hear that the kind folks at Adobe have tried very hard to make "real" FCP users more happy and more secure.

And, for those wondering what constitutes a "real" FCP user in my opinion, I mean those who use and demand non-magnetic timelines, a Viewer and a Canvas, and XML (not FCPXML). :)

Okay, let the flaming begin... :)

David Roth Weiss
ProMax Systems
Burbank
DRW@ProMax.com
http://www.ProMax.com
Sales | Integration | Support


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Steve Connor
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 7:49:59 pm

[David Roth Weiss] "And, for those wondering what constitutes a "real" FCP user in my opinion, I mean those who use and demand non-magnetic timelines, a Viewer and a Canvas, and XML (not FCPXML). :)
"


I'm devastated - I'm clearly not a "real" FCP user!

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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TImothy Auld
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 7:59:53 pm

You will be grandfathered in.

Tim


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David Roth Weiss
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 12:01:28 am

[Steve Connor] "I'm devastated - I'm clearly not a "real" FCP user!"

You were Steve, but but you've abandoned ship and taken-up with the "unreal" impostor to the throne. :(

It doesn't make you any less of an editor by any stroke of the imagination. In fact, I admire you're sticktuitiveness (if that's a word).

David Roth Weiss
ProMax Systems
Burbank
DRW@ProMax.com
http://www.ProMax.com
Sales | Integration | Support


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 9:08:30 pm

[David Roth Weiss] "And, for those wondering what constitutes a "real" FCP user in my opinion, I mean those who use and demand non-magnetic timelines, a Viewer and a Canvas, and XML (not FCPXML). :)

Okay, let the flaming begin... :)
"


No flaming at all - just observation.

I guess since you're posting here under both your personal name and your corporate affiliation, means that neither you nor ProMax cares about those of us who don't directly share your views.

Fair enough.

But it strikes me that your company founder, the late (and much missed) Charles McConathy never expressed these kinds of insular and exclusionary views - at least not to me in our NAB chats when I had the privilege of sitting down with him to shared a few after hours drinks and learn from his almost inexhaustible knowledge of hard drive sub-systems.

I always found him to represent the polar opposite of that kind of thinking - welcoming even small time guys like me into the fold and shipping ProMax systems anywhere and to anyone who needed them (including me in the Wilds of Arizona) - rather than separating us into "worthy" and "clearly not-worthy" customer groups.

But then times move on, and companies obviously come to reflect the people who represent them in each new era.

Such is life.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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David Roth Weiss
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 10:43:31 pm

My opinions are just mine, and no one else's. Nor do they constitute or represent the opinions and/or beliefs of the company I work for, or those of Creative Cow.

Furthermore, the vast number of people around the world whom I have assisted and advised throughout the years on Creative Cow are testament to the fact that I bring much more to the table than just my opinions.

And finally, by stranding its highest level pro apps customers by abandoning FCS, and now possibly its MacPro line of professional workstations, Apple has created havoc throughout the industry I love for the majority of the colleagues and professionals I have supported throughout the years. And, while I do not speak for Charles or ProMAX in this regard, I'm certain he too preferred the Apple run by hippies in their garage, rather than the Apple of today, driven by corporate greed and animosity to the cares and needs of many of its best and most supportive longtime customers and facilities, who built their hopes, dreams, and aspirations on FCS and the Mac platform.

David Roth Weiss
ProMax Systems
Burbank
DRW@ProMax.com
http://www.ProMax.com
Sales | Integration | Support


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Steve Connor
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 11:17:21 pm

"hopes dreams and aspirations?" and now the nasty corporation has taken those away, let's put our faith in businesses that really care for us artists like HP perhaps, who nearly dropped their PC line entirely or Avid who spent so many years sucking money out of facilities with their grossly inflated prices.

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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Jim Giberti
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 1:48:00 am

[Steve Connor] ""hopes dreams and aspirations?" and now the nasty corporation has taken those away, let's put our faith in businesses that really care for us artists like HP perhaps, who nearly dropped their PC line entirely or Avid who spent so many years sucking money out of facilities with their grossly inflated prices."

Holy shnikeys, editing has become a dark art.
I'm gonna stab myself with my magic mouse.


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 1:41:08 am

[David Roth Weiss] "Apple has created havoc throughout the industry I love for the majority of the colleagues and professionals I have supported throughout the years"

Please. I don't know what your day is like, but mine is singularly "havoc free." In fact I don't know a single editor anywhere who expresses the view that the current editing world is in "havoc" except you.

It's editing software, David. Not religion.

If what X actually is - in its new incarnation - doesn't work for you, leave it for a while. If and when it's new path coincides with what you might need in the future, come back.

David, Apple didn't go out to hurt YOU any more than they went out to make ME happy. We're neither of us particularly important in the great scheme of things.

This squabble is also getting old and tiring. It contributes nothing to anyones understanding of the reality of the new software or it's possibilities.

That's the real problem here. I see your original post here as largely unsubstantiated broad opinion.

If, as you contend, there's "havoc" surrounding this. Tell us about it. Tell us what companies are at risk of going under because X supplanted Legacy. Why? Why wouldn't anything else work for them.

I don't stand against differing opinions. I enjoy them. I stand against broad assertions without foundation. So provide some. Then we can talk about them.

Impersonally and logically. You seem to "hate" magnetism. OK. How much do you use it? What makes you so angry about it. Why can't you just work in "position" mode and avoid it. Does it NEVER work for you under ANY circumstances? Editors here would probably find that both revealing and interesting.

I've noted that for me, it was "odd" for about a week of solid use - then it became nothing more or less than "normal." I stopped fighting it - in fact I largely stopped even thinking about it kinda like a properly learned keyboard shortcut. Now for me it's simply how things work.

I'm not a particularly gifted editor. Why does it work for me and not for you? Wouldn't that be a more productive discussion than just popping up and crying "havoc!" in order to let slip the dogs of NLE war? (couldn't resist, sorry. )

And I'm curious as to why you're still ranting against it. (Didn't someone here say that some new version of Premier has some form of "magnetism" inside it?) if magnetism is ipso-facto useless - or just useless in X? And if so, why?

These are more interesting discussions, I believe, than the mindless "it's crap because I allege so" rants.

On either side.

As a gesture of truce, If you're coming to the meet-up in NAB, I'm hereby volunteering to stand your first round at the Fortuna - in the hopes that it will let us shake hands and allow you to simply settle down and stop seeing me - and the others who enjoy working with FCP-X - as some kind of "evil minions" that must be fought at all costs.

We're all just editors who are discussing our tools. Nothing more or less.

FWIW.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Tim Wilson
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 1:55:04 am

"....gesture of truce...."

An overture to make up?

I hereby promise one (1) real pony to anyone who can provide a picture of these two kissing. Whatever happens in Vegas....could be worth a real pony to you.

I'm just saying.


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 2:12:20 am

[Tim Wilson] ""....gesture of truce...."

An overture to make up?

I hereby promise one (1) real pony to anyone who can provide a picture of these two kissing. Whatever happens in Vegas....could be worth a real pony to you.

I'm just saying."


Tim, you're getting yourself in serious trouble here.

You're probably not aware that I live on a horse property in Scottsdale and that my studio is in a converted hay barn...?

Heck, I'd probably kiss not just just David, but David, Herb, and and Andreas for half the hammer price of a decent pony.

So stop tempting me - vegas is nothing if not expensive - and as a sole proprietor, I have to pay my own way every damn year!

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 7, 2012 at 11:32:45 pm

[Bill Davis] "I guess since you're posting here under both your personal name and [love the walloping emphasis there by the way] your corporate affiliation, means that neither you nor ProMax cares about those of us who don't directly share your views.

Fair enough.

But it strikes me that your company founder, the late (and much missed) Charles McConathy never expressed these kinds of insular and exclusionary views - "


...and well, the rampant personal invective just keeps right on going after that.



come on bill - would you take it easy? this was that rare unicorn of a matey joshing thread on this forum - david was surely well within team bounds in some gentle broad xml etc jibing no?

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos
http://www.ogallchoir.net
promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 2:23:47 am

[Aindreas Gallagher] "personal name and [love the walloping emphasis there by the way] your corporate affiliation"

Gosh darnit Aindreas, you've got me confused again.

Back when I was using ALL CAPS for emphasis, I was criticized. So I taught myself to use the Bold and the Italics conventions here.

Now you're telling me that I've' achieved not emphasis, but some form of annoying "walloping emphasis" - a convention that I had absolutely no clue even existed.

Can somebody please (praying that by using italics I'm not somehow signaling condescending annoyance or something worse) tell me the rules for proper expression here?

Is there a universal style "ladder of emotive word stress" in play here that I simply don't understand???

Or must I allow Aindreas to interpret my text stylings in any fashion he likes, rendering it impossible to ever write with anything other than drone-like expository levelness here.

I'm so confused.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Chris Harlan
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 4:24:29 am

[Bill Davis] "I'm so confused."

I think what Aindreas was referring to was that whole "so this is how you reflect on your employer" meme you were embarking on. That's certainly what caught my eye as being a bit over the top.


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 8:18:58 am

Yep Chris, that I certainly was. I actually found that post verging on nasty.

Still, let's brace ourselves for the fifteen paragraph response with, yes thats right, it's a classic: closing judicial quotes on civil discourse.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos
http://www.ogallchoir.net
promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 5:23:26 pm

Here's a tip.

I enjoy writing.

Anyone who doesn't enjoy reading what I write has an instant cure at hand.

Stop reading.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Chris Harlan
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 6:21:04 pm

[Bill Davis] "Here's a tip.

I enjoy writing.

Anyone who doesn't enjoy reading what I write has an instant cure at hand.

Stop reading.
"


This is where you want to go with this? Wow.


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TImothy Auld
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 7:56:36 pm

I suppose one other option would be that you could write, but not post. Or you could write, post, but warn people in the subject line that they might not want to read. Or you could write, post, and then not respond any parries. Or, as you have done, tell people not to pay any attention to what you post. So many possibilities...

Tim


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Steve Connor
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 8:03:15 pm

The COW team were apparently working on an "ignore" button, this would be useful for those who don't like Bill's posts. Personally I never use them on other forums though.

Steve Connor
"FCPX Professional"
Adrenalin Television


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TImothy Auld
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 8, 2012 at 8:42:48 pm

No, I don't use them either. But the "take my posts and don't bother to comment if you don't agree" attitude - especially when followed by an admonition on civil discourse -is hard not to comment upon.

Tim


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Chris Harlan
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 12:23:52 am

[TImothy Auld] "No, I don't use them either. But the "take my posts and don't bother to comment if you don't agree" attitude - especially when followed by an admonition on civil discourse -is hard not to comment upon.

Tim
"


I know, huh?


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 6:14:29 am

Look,

I've been posting here practically since this part of the Cow was introduced. Everyone knows my positions and the kind of arguments I make. They know I tend to be kinda long winded when I'm putting down my thoughts. But so what?

I was dead serious about this. If someone feels I'm so off base - or my arguments makes them feel uncomfortable, or they just feel that my observations and arguments aren't worth their time - its not like each and every one of my posts don't come per-billboarded with my name. So what's the big deal?

Just don't open them. Problem solved. Nobody is forcing you to read them.

But if the best you can come up with in terms of criticism is that they're "too long" -wow.

Maybe you can see it this way. Every time you don't read a post of mine, your saving yourself more time than you would by not reading someone else's posts! It's a bigger win for you that way!

That help?

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Chris Harlan
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 7:48:14 am

[Bill Davis] "Look,

I've been posting here practically since this part of the Cow was introduced. Everyone knows my positions and the kind of arguments I make. They know I tend to be kinda long winded when I'm putting down my thoughts. But so what?

I was dead serious about this. If someone feels I'm so off base - or my arguments makes them feel uncomfortable, or they just feel that my observations and arguments aren't worth their time - its not like each and every one of my posts don't come per-billboarded with my name. So what's the big deal?

Just don't open them. Problem solved. Nobody is forcing you to read them.

But if the best you can come up with in terms of criticism is that they're "too long" -wow.

Maybe you can see it this way. Every time you don't read a post of mine, your saving yourself more time than you would by not reading someone else's posts! It's a bigger win for you that way!

That help?
"


Its not about "long-winded," Bill. Its about passive-aggresive threats--more aggressive than passive-- regarding David's employer. And, if you can't see that, you need to re-read the post in question. You don't get to make those kind of assertions and then pretend you don't know what other people are talking about.


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Aindreas Gallagher
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 9, 2012 at 12:21:21 pm

Exactly right.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos
http://www.ogallchoir.net
promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Bill Davis
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 10, 2012 at 2:31:41 am

No, exactly wrong.

The "aggression" such as is was was nearly exclusively contained in David's initial post, IMO.

[David Roth Weiss] "And, for those wondering what constitutes a "real" FCP user in my opinion, I mean those who use and demand non-magnetic timelines, a Viewer and a Canvas, and XML (not FCPXML). :)

Okay, let the flaming begin... :)
"


You might agree with his view. But that don't mean it wasn't an aggressive attack on anyone who's expressed appreciation for the list of things he called out by name.

And I'm as firmly in that group as anyone who's been reading here for long will certainly agree.

Maybe you don't read that as "aggressive. I do.

I'm not quite sure how he justifies that view when the fact of the matter is that he's bucketing all "real" FCP users as those who base their practice on discontinued software - but his language is crystal clear.

What you've called my "passive-aggressive" response started with the words:

No flaming at all - just observation.

Then I pointed out that my experience with ProMax years ago was one of a company that welcomed all users, no matter their experience level and their NLE preferences, I think that was on-point.

Maybe something that I wrote could be taken as "passive aggressive" if read with a particular tone or slant, but it certainly was not meant that way.

I was once again using a personal anecdote to make a point. I"v been slammed for using analogy.

Oh gosh.

Am I missing the larger point here.

Is there a movement afloat to deny me the use of ANY writing device that starts with the letter A?

I got hammered for analogy.

Now I'm taken to task for aggression (albeit in the passive variety)

Dammit, that totally blows my master plan for a massive post rife with alliteration.

The last thing I want is to continue to make Chris and Aindreas even snippier by pure accident.

; )

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Chaz Wren
Re: FCPX or Not -- mini-meetup at NAB?
on Apr 15, 2012 at 10:25:28 pm

When did this stop being about making videos? telling stories and so forth...


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