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New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)

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Mark Dobson
New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 2:41:12 pm

Just picked up on this from FCP.co.

Walter Murch ruminates on FCPX, the thoughts behind it's creation, the world it's designed for what he finds both promising and frustrating about the software.

http://www.macvideo.tv/editing/interviews/index.cfm?articleId=3316346


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Bill Davis
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 5:08:30 pm

This is precisely why Walter is such an icon in the editing world.
Unlike any amateur, if you ask him "why" about any part of his craft, you'll instantly grasp not only that he has a solid answer, but that he's come to his answer after measured reflection and openness to the entire scope of possibilities.
Thanks for this.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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David Roth Weiss
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 6:01:06 pm

[Bill Davis] "Unlike any amateur, if you ask him "why" about any part of his craft, you'll instantly grasp not only that he has a solid answer, but that he's come to his answer after measured reflection and openness to the entire scope of possibilities."

What has Walter Murch said in this video that many here, myself included, haven't been telling you all along right here?

Please, just name one thing?

However, if you can hear the words better, because they come from Murch's mouth, then so much the better.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

Don't miss my new Creative Cow Podcast: Bringing "The Whale" to the Big Screen:
http://library.creativecow.net/weiss_roth_david/Podcast-Series-2-MikeParfit...

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 6:04:48 pm

Thanks for posting this, Mark.

Jeremy


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 6:57:18 pm

[David Roth Weiss] "What has Walter Murch said in this video that many here, myself included, haven't been telling you all along right here?

Please, just name one thing?"


That he's optimistic. And seems to think that you will be able to make FCPX as pro as you need or want, and 3rd party support might be the way to get there.

There's a lot of people that seem not to think that this might be a possibility, from what I can read on these forums.

He calls film making pros "a pain in the ass".

Magnetic timelines, may be good, tracklessness may be good, his words.

He is missing the viewer/canvas, as am I the more I test FCPX.

He also can't use it today, (I can't either), but he certainly didn't say he won't use it. In my feeble mind, there's a huge difference.

Jeremy


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 7:04:56 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Magnetic timelines, may be good, tracklessness may be good, his words."

He also said that is not how he likes to work. "I don't need my hand held...is this the right thing to do...I'm not able to use FCX and make music" his words

[Jeremy Garchow] " He is missing the viewer/canvas, as am I the more I test FCPX."

Sounds like a dealbreaker the way he described it. "I depend on that" his words

[Jeremy Garchow] " He calls film making pros "a pain in the ass"."

Because they know what they want...and he unpacked this quite deliberately.

How is anything there different then what has been spelled out repeatedly here?


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 7:08:54 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "How is anything there different then what has been spelled out repeatedly here?"

Because he's a well respected professional and he's optimistic, rather than destitute of all possibilities.

Should I grab my helmet?


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Walter Soyka
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 7:17:06 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Should I grab my helmet?"

Have you actually taken it off?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 7:22:06 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Have you actually taken it off?"

Heh heh. Thanks for that one.


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David Roth Weiss
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 8:44:34 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Because he's a well respected professional and he's optimistic, rather than destitute of all possibilities."

Jeremy,

It seems you must have missed the end of the interview where Mr. Murch summarizes his position by closing with the following words, and I quote: "I hope I can use it, but we'll see."

Do you honestly characterize that as "optimism?"

Having produced, directed, and edited innumerable on-camera interviews, I have never once observed an interviewee contradicting his/her position in their summary at the very end of the interview. Instead, nearly all interviewees will "reiterate" their position in one concise sentence, which to them represents the very essence of everything they've earlier stated during the course of the interview.

Do you seriously believe your interpretation of Mr. Murch's position trumps his own?

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

Don't miss my new Creative Cow Podcast: Bringing "The Whale" to the Big Screen:
http://library.creativecow.net/weiss_roth_david/Podcast-Series-2-MikeParfit...

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 9:12:50 pm

[David Roth Weiss] "Jeremy,

It seems you must have missed the end of the interview where Mr. Murch summarizes his position by closing with the following words, and I quote: "I hope I can use it, but we'll see."

Do you honestly characterize that as "optimism?"

Having produced, directed, and edited innumerable on-camera interviews, I have never once observed an interviewee contradicting his/her position in their summary at the very end of the interview. Instead, nearly all interviewees will "reiterate" their position in one concise sentence, which to them represents the very essence of everything they've earlier stated during the course of the interview.

Do you seriously believe your interpretation of Mr. Murch's position trumps his own?"


Wow. Do you think your interpretation trumps his own? I think he is very balanced and realistic, and in his own words, optimistic.

Again, people hear what they want to hear.

You hear what reinforces your beliefs, and I hear what reinforces mine.

He SAID he was optimistic (I think it was something along the lines of "I'm optimistic about this" starting at around 11m20s) when he talked about Apple simplifying the UI and building the base application, and said something to the effect of "hopefully it will be usable for people who make feature films" earlier in the interview.

Are we watching the same video?

After he talks about ripping off the band-aid, he says he's optimistic (again) at around 16 minutes.

I can't use FCPX at my job everyday either, that doesn't prevent me from learning it, thinking about it and discussing it. I can only infer Murch feels the same way, otherwise why would he sit down for this interview? He's questioning it just as most of us who like it are. His mind is open to it. I feel that's obvious. As a lot of these conversations on the Cow here end, we will see and time will tell if it's worth it or not.


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 9:14:04 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] " Because he's a well respected professional and he's optimistic, rather than destitute of all possibilities."

I'm not sure how that answers the question...nor is indicative to his whole summation. Maybe parts. He remains optimistic, but he can't use it...that's a pretty solid condemnation on it's current state and many here have vocalized that as well. Because he is well respected may give his "optimism" more weight to you, but then, his objections and refusal to use it by that reasoning must also carry more weight


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 9:58:40 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "Maybe parts. He remains optimistic, but he can't use it...that's a pretty solid condemnation on it's current state and many here have vocalized that as well."

Yes, including me, almost daily.

[Jamie Franklin] "Because he is well respected may give his "optimism" more weight to you, but then, his objections and refusal to use it by that reasoning must also carry more weight"

All of his objections are things that are solvable, except for the viewer/canvas which doesn't seem to fit the new UI. Interchange, audio output, all of that, in my mind, will be solved once the application is further ready (or FCPXML grows up a bit).

I do think with multicam, they are going to need something else besides a single viewer. How else are you going to be able to watch 9 angles at once, and the program?

I guess we will see. I'm optimistic. And I know you love emoticons so, :-D

If this stuff never shows up, then it will have been a good ride and it will be on the next thing. We've done it before, we'll do it again.

Jeremy


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 10:15:59 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "All of his objections are things that are solvable"

Does that include a multi-track?

Roles, compound clips do not solve this. And he expressly said in the context of consumer users this might be useful, but not to him.

The dna might not like that mutation...


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 10:20:00 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "Does that include a multi-track?"

It could. Instead of tracks, you have Roles, and a Role can get assigned to a channel, kind of like they do now on Multi Channel audio QT Exports from FCPX.


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 5:43:07 pm

Roles won't replace tracks.

[Jeremy Garchow] " It could. Instead of tracks, you have Roles, and a Role can get assigned to a channel, kind of like they do now on Multi Channel audio QT Exports from FCPX."

I'll say it again, roles won't replace tracks. It's a band aid.

If you've spent a decade using a multi-track and like roles, I won't understand it, but there it is. You do...I think roles are not an acceptable replacement in my opinion. Maybe for projects that are exceedingly simple. But even still, meh...


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 5:52:14 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "I'll say it again, roles won't replace tracks. It's a band aid. "

For you.

[Jamie Franklin] "If you've spent a decade using a multi-track and like roles, I won't understand it, but there it is. You do...I think roles are not an acceptable replacement in my opinion. Maybe for projects that are exceedingly simple. But even still, meh..."

That's fine. I've spent more time than that with tracks, but whatever, that doesn't mean anything to anyone.

I do accept a metadata centric workflow, I have been wanting it for a long time. I have been working with metadata for while now and I needed third party tools to get the most of out it, and Roles, I think, is a pretty cool idea. It needs to be expanded from it's current iteration, but so does FCPX as a whole.

I can understand if people won't like it. There's plenty of options out there to choose from.

Jeremy


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 5:57:28 pm

There is nothing wrong with expanding on what works or adding a new feature. Just don't throw out how other people *prefer* to work trying to appear innovative...it's forcing stuff like this that really is FCX's undoing...


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 6:12:46 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "it's forcing stuff like this that really is FCX's undoing..."

For you.


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 6:18:39 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "For you"

And an industry that won't embrace it for this and a litany of other shortcomings...


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 6:21:13 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "And an industry that won't embrace it for this and a litany of other shortcomings..."

Yep, we are all going to die.


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 6:28:39 pm

When the leading editor of the Final Cut legacy says ick and adobe crew are posting in the Final Cut X forums with a smirk...yes, somethings dying all right...

Some of us are in denial of course ;)


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 6:29:37 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "When the leading editor of the Final Cut legacy says ick and adobe crew are posting in the Final Cut X forums with a smirk...yes, somethings dying all right...

Some of us are in denial of course ;)"


Indeed.


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Steve Connor
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 6:34:05 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "Some of us are in denial of course ;)"

True

"My Name is Steve and I'm an FCPX user"


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Thomas Frank
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 9:08:34 pm

[Jamie Franklin] "If you've spent a decade using a multi-track and like roles, I won't understand it, but there it is. You do...I think roles are not an acceptable replacement in my opinion. Maybe for projects that are exceedingly simple. But even still, meh..."

Or you don't want to adjust, I use to hear this from many After Effect users how horrible Shake was with it's Node editor. Yeah...

[Jamie Franklin] "When the leading editor of the Final Cut legacy says ick and adobe crew are posting in the Final Cut X forums with a smirk...yes, somethings dying all right...

Some of us are in denial of course ;)"


Your right but again this has happened before with Final Cut Pro 3... and wash't there a Editor called... Walter Murch... oh yeah.

Here is quote back in the day when I decided to go with FCP3 instead with Avid. "It's for hobbyist and wedding-grapher. Now look at it.

I will stay optimistic with FCPX and in fact we are seeing a increase of use in our shop. The only problem we have it it is the option to send a signal out to a broadcast monitor. But we went with the old paradigm and let the colorist do his job after the edit was done in FCPX. ;)



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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 9, 2011 at 3:19:57 am

[Thomas Frank] "Or you don't want to adjust"

You're right. I don't. I want to stick with a *better* way of control, sharing, fades, handles and placing it where I want without an annoying number of forced shenanigans...

I will keep repeating this as it never gets tired for those not tired of passing judgement on the whole "you don't want to adjust" snark. There is nothing wrong with *adding* a feature or improving one. Wiping away a standard that works is not an improvement, doesn't help bridge a laundry list of issues when dramatically restructuring a toolset.

This canard of early final cut versions being a comparison is a terrible waste of grey matter. And re-treading another tired old argument. Build on a decade of standards, truths and expressions. Don't throw them out and defend their iMovie legacy import ability sillyness....



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David Scott
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 7:32:38 pm

Superb riposte!!!


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Walter Soyka
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 9:23:39 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "He is missing the viewer/canvas, as am I the more I test FCPX."

Murch says he "can't yet quite see how I'm not going to use the old paradigm -- the existing paradigm, let's say -- of viewer and canvas," and asks, "Why not? Why can't we have that as an option?"


[Jeremy Garchow] "Magnetic timelines, may be good, tracklessness may be good, his words."

Followed immediately by "but there are times when I want to not have that, because I don't need my hand held."

Murch's closing line: "I'm not able at the moment to use FCPX and play music on it [like a concert pianist], which is to say to make motion pictures on it. I hope that I can in the future, but we'll see."

Didn't many of the first posts express this sentiment? I can't work with FCPX professionally today, and I don't know what the future for FCPX holds, so it's no for now, and maybe time to look elsewhere.

Since then, we've gone in-depth on a lot of FCPX's features and concepts as well as Apple's strategic decisions, dissecting them, analyzing them, and philosophizing about them in far greater depth than Rich Young and Walter Murch cover in this brief interview. Looking forward, these conversations have given some of us hope and some of us concern. I think both positions are defensible, though I think most of us our biased according to our workflows and our prior history.

I didn't really take away much on the future of FCPX from this interview. The main point I took away was one that's been discussed over and over here: FCPX is great for the specific workflows for which it was designed, but still totally unsuited for other current, more complex workflows, and we just don't know if, when, or to what degree FCPX will support them in the future.


[Jeremy Garchow] "... he's a well respected professional and he's optimistic, rather than destitute of all possibilities."

Very few of us here were using FCP 1.0 professionally, but many of us here were using FCP 3 professionally before Murch legitimized it with Cold Mountain, because it worked well for our needs. I certainly respect Murch's thoughts on editorial, but I'm not going to judge an NLE based on its ability to satisfy his workflow. We must all make our decisions according to our own needs.

On optimism versus pessimism -- does it matter? Optimism doesn't help me get my work done. My clients want delivery, not possibility. "Real artists ship" and all.

I can't predict what Apple will do next, and we have no way of knowing unless they ship. They don't seem fond of actually listening to user input, which is scary, but they have a good track record for delivering amazing products, which is promising. Maybe that's hoping for the best and planning for the worst?

FCPX isn't ready -- but it's important. It's one of the many huge changes swirling through our industry. If I thought FCPX had no possibility whatsoever, or if I thought these changes wouldn't impact my business, I wouldn't be here.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 9:47:33 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Followed immediately by "but there are times when I want to not have that, because I don't need my hand held.""

Followed by "There's the position tool". We just need a transcript of this thing so we can all highlight what we like and didn't like.

He really did use the words optimistic, though. I promise. More than once.

[Walter Soyka] "On optimism versus pessimism -- does it matter? "

I think a balanced approach does matter, yes. If he wouldn't have been so thoughtful, the interview would have had a completely different tone and fired around the internet, kind of like his first presentation in which he was grossly misquoted. To me, state of mind does matter, but maybe it doesn't to other people.


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Walter Soyka
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 10:25:57 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Followed by "There's the position tool". "

Followed by a section on how we need to adjust to a new way of working, which somewhat contradicted his original point about how he liked working the way he was used to. I thought his addition about the Position tool was more to show he understood that positioning could be done in the magnetic paradigm than to suggest it was the better way to work.

But yes, using selective quotation myself was probably a bad rhetorical strategy to point out that you were selectively quoting. Let's call that one a draw.


[Jeremy Garchow] "He really did use the words optimistic, though. I promise. More than once."

Yes, he said he was optimistic, but given the rest of his interview, I'd have to describe it as cautiously so. I got an almost clinical and detached sense from him on FCPX, not committing to it in the short term and neither acclaiming nor condemning FCPX in the long term. That seems just plain reasonable, but not particularly newsworthy. What would the headline be? "Murch won't use FCPX now, but might someday?"

He also didn't sound like he had a lot of hands-on time with FCPX yet. And why would he? He has specific needs that FCPX couldn't fill at launch. (I suspect that 10.0.1 update addressed some, though not all, of his concerns.)


[Jeremy Garchow] "I think a balanced approach does matter, yes. If he wouldn't have been so thoughtful, the interview would have had a completely different tone and fired around the internet, kind of like his first presentation in which he was grossly misquoted. To me, state of mind does matter, but maybe it doesn't to other people."

Optimism and balance are not the same.

I have tried to give credit where it is due with FCPX, because there really are some things it gets totally right -- just as you have conceded points where it doesn't quite measure up. That's balance.

I'd like FCPX to improve quickly to the point where it's a viable option for me, but I'm not seeing much from Apple that suggests they are interested in the same things I am. You seem to think they will more likely than not get FCPX where you need it to be in a short timeframe. That's optimism.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 10:57:48 pm

[Walter Soyka] "What would the headline be? "Murch won't use FCPX now, but might someday?""

Why not?

[Walter Soyka] "You seem to think they will more likely than not get FCPX where you need it to be in a short timeframe. That's optimism."

Yeah, I guess I have both balance and optimism. I guess I see things that can be changes, or a foundation that will support important workflow choices. It certainly can't do everything now, but I don't have to use it every day quite yet.


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Bill Davis
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 11:21:35 pm

David,

Look back over all you've posted here. Unlike Mr. Murch, who divided his time and words nearly equally demonstrating not just what he felt was unfinished or lacking, but what he felt was a solid indication of the FCP-X potential relevance to a new future - most of what you, and others in your "spin class" have proferred, has been relentlessly targeted to a single, monolithic view. That of the disappointed professional who could ONLY see what FCP-X was not, and had to be brought, kicking and screaming, to acknowledge what it might represent for the future.

That is my interpretation of what I've seen here the past 4 months of daily reading. Perhaps you never saw your contributions that way - exactly in the same way I never saw mine as relentlessly "pollyanna-ish" (something I've been accused of time and time again here) but that makes sense since anyone with a point of view is prone to bristle when they say the world is BLUE and someone steps up relentlessly to attack that view with "NOT BLUE - GREEN!!!) over and over and over again.

I've come to understand that this "disconnect" makes the most sense when you take into consideration that you and others here could well be stuck behind YELLOW LENSES of a particular professional orientation that make them see ALL blue as green. (I also freely acknowledge that I may have been wearing my own sunglasses that may be too dark to see the entire landscape clearly.) But so what?

It simply makes each of us flawed in our perceptions and that the reality that wins will be decided by the larger group of those who can see more clearly than either of us.

Mr. Murch, unlike you and others here - started out acknowledging that knowing whether or not you have colored lenses in place as you judge a picture is pretty smart.

It's what I saw in this clip from him - and have yet to see from you and select others in the discussion here.

That clear enough for you?

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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David Roth Weiss
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 3:17:37 am

[Bill Davis] "That is my interpretation of what I've seen here the past 4 months of daily reading."

Yes, I know what your interpretation is Bill, but the important thing here is just how closely your interpretation and your recollection are to the reality of what I've actually written. I've asked you several times to go back into the Cow archives to retrieve the mountain of stuff from the last four months that you consistently try to attribute to me, but you haven't delivered, because most of it exists entirely in your mind.

The fact is Bill, you've consistently confused what I earlier wrote about you, constantly trying to chase fellow Cows off this forum who disagreed with you, with what I've actually written about FCPX. They are two entirely different subjects, which you are unable to separate.

My message about FCPX has actually been consistently very close to Mr. Murch's point of view. I have consistently stated that X does not work for me and those I work with, because of the "ecosystem" I work in, here in Hollywood. And, I have also said, just like Mr. Murch, that "we'll just have to wait to see" if Apple can ever make it work. Are either of those statements inconsistent with Walter Murch's statements? They sure sound the same to me.

In any case, all of my posts are archived on the Cow, and they are open for all to see. I've also produced a three part audio podcast on the subject of FXPX with my guest David Lawrence, which you might also want to check. So please, I welcome you to research the record; rather than continuing to project all of your misplaced feelings and emotions onto me, just show us what you've got. This is after all a business of show.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

Don't miss my new Creative Cow Podcast: Bringing "The Whale" to the Big Screen:
http://library.creativecow.net/weiss_roth_david/Podcast-Series-2-MikeParfit...

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums.


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Bill Davis
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 7:54:19 pm

I don't have to "research" much at all.

Here's an example in your own text from the top of this thread above.

[Bill Davis] "

What has Walter Murch said in this video that many here, myself included, haven't been telling you all along right here?

Please, just name one thing?

However, if you can hear the words better, because they come from Murch's mouth, then so much the better."


You took a post of mine, and instead of concentrating on WHAT I said, you spun it toward WHO said it. You took ME personally to task for it, trying your best to paint me as someone to dense to "get it." about Walter's opinions (in this specific case)

You (and everyone else here) can clearly see the personal pronoun "you" (referring to me as an individual) appearing twice in the exchange above.

At issue here is that YOU clearly tend to focus your wrath (Roth wrath?) on individuals who annoy you rather than their ideas.

When *I* do that (and I've certainly been guilty of it, at times, myself) I do my best to step back and apologize when I realize that I'm dismissing the PERSON rather than arguing their ideas.

You probably don't even realize that you consistently do what you did above.

Simple as that.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 6:16:21 pm

[Bill Davis] "Unlike any amateur, if you ask him "why" about any part of his craft, you'll instantly grasp not only that he has a solid answer, but that he's come to his answer after measured reflection and openness to the entire scope of possibilities."

Like when he said as a professional the future is irrelevant, despite his optimism, it has to work now...

Unlike an amateur, where they don't know what they want until Apple tells them...


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Bill Davis
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 11:52:30 pm

And if he's the most accurate prognosticator, then the real "take away" is that he seems to acknowledge that it matters VERY little what 1500 "professional movie editors" think, as he defines the group with the biggest problems with the state of FCP-X.

I'd bet EVERY SINGLE one of them has had the opportunity to read, discuss and even USE FCP-X (provided they have the time to fiddle) and if EVERY SINGLE ONE of them ditches it, it won't make a discernible blip in the fortunes of AVID or Premier, OR Apple.

That revenue stream is simply gnat-like in a world of elephants.

History is LITTERED with the carcases of high-end professional toolsets that were ideal for the highest level users but because they didn't attract a broad enough base, they faltered and died under their own weight.

There's no way to predict if or when Adobe or AVID might go the way of, say, Silicon Graphics - (and I pray none of them EVER do - because I truly believe that competition drives the whole industry forward) but it's likely going to be touch and go.

The biggest threat to the old "big iron running big software" model is probably the "touchscreenification" of Windows 8 right now. If they do to their development pipeline what Apple did to theirs - re-tool and re-focus on personal devices over "big iron" — then that's going to put MASSIVE pressure on software and hardware development that doesn't view massive, fast computers chock full of slip in cards and big assed monitors as the path to profits over the next 3-5 years.

Who would be left to do the OS development that would support that traditional work mode? Anyone?

Will Adobe or AVID need to morph (again for AVID) to being combo hardware/software vendors just to keep boxes around that run their stuff "properly?"

I keep reading about supply chain issues where other hardware vendors are pissed because Apple keeps buying out the total delivery capacity of everything from NAND chips to the drilling machines capable of putting the micro holes in the aluminum that let's the "camera on" light shine through the skin of the MacBook Pros.

It's a world where everyday people keep saying "I personally don't need something with a big massive power supply." Which means that the company that manufacturers those has to worry about survival in a shrinking market.

Scary, a little.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Jamie Franklin
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 5:36:57 pm

Well, whatever. I think the biggest take away is that the most prolific and high profile Final Cut editor can't use it and has finally come forward and vocalized why. But nothing he said was surprising or insightful if you were to read this forum.

Maybe because it was "measured" it allows more of the same banality to seep through so we can spend the next month psycho analyzing what "he really meant". But it all boils down to, he can't use it, now! That says it all.

Yes, he was measured...but what did anyone expect from an insider? Him to start ripping off his clothes and start a Begbie inspired bar fight over it....that's probably what Aindreas would do...


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Eduardo Serrano
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 6:29:52 pm

He seems a lot more optimistic than he was at the boston supermeet when he described the exchange of letters between him and Apple. He even questioned the reliability of apple as a pro plataform. So, there you go, did he asked to be interviewed to mend things with apple? hahaha.

But yeah... seriously... maybe in 4 years Fcpx will be good enough but it doesn't pay my bills the way it is now.
And someone has to tell Mr. Murch that real video monitoring was not fixed on the last patch. He made the mistake twice now.


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Robert Brown
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 8:06:17 pm

Mr Murch may have been back peddling to some degree, who knows what his relationship is to Apple and how much if any he needs that. But to me the point that stood out the most was whether one app would ever work for everyone or not. Apple seems to be suggesting that but I think it's a bad idea to even attempt that. Competition is good for everybody and niches will always exist it's just the way people are. The idea of a universal editing app will never fly IMO.

Robert Brown
Editor/VFX/Colorist - FCP, Smoke, Quantel Pablo, After Effects, 3DS MAX, Premiere Pro

http://vimeo.com/user3987510/videos


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Daniel Frome
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 7, 2011 at 9:27:24 pm

Agreed. He is tip toeing very lightly, making sure he expresses his dislike in a way that wouldn't harm him from staying in the apple inner circle.

Personally the main message I get from this interview is that he openly questions Apple and their relationship to professionals: "Do they still want us?"

He's using the interview to call out to Apple and get them talking again.


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Herb Sevush
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 2:29:01 am

The only thing i got out of this interview is that Rick Young shouldn't be allowed to shoot an interview. We've got this whole big room to work with so lets put the subject flat up against a wall and lets put his dark shirt on a dark couch so it looks like his disembodied head is floating in space and then we'll act like we never heard of a fill light. In a way this was the perfect comment on the software made for the Utube generation. Nothing like attention to craft.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Alex Hawkins
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 3:02:02 am

When's Part 2 coming out . . . ?

Alex Hawkins
Canberra, Australia


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Rafael Amador
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 9:26:02 am

Yes people interpret things as they want.
All the words against Mr Murch because he "actually had never used FCPX" becomes now smiles just because he sounds more "diplomatic".
The example or the gas/electricity doesn't work. Then was about to change something that worked for something that worked better. Now is about changing something that works for something that might work (Is like if they cut your gas and they put a solar panel that so far can heat your water just enough to wash your face, but no cafe, no lights and not TV at home).

I notice is that Mr Murch is a genius of film editing, but hi is very short on technical matters. The only thing he praise a couple of times is the new "64bits" architecture. Not sure if he understand how that will help him on his editing or how that will make a difference with FCP.
Sounded like any other politician close to the polls.
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


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Gary Huff
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 2:07:31 pm

[Rafael Amador] I notice is that Mr Murch is a genius of film editing, but hi is very short on technical matters. The only thing he praise a couple of times is the new "64bits" architecture. Not sure if he understand how that will help him on his editing or how that will make a difference with FCP.

Murch is quite the Apple fanboy actually, and it's amazing how much esteem he held for the company even after his experiences in dealing with them on Cold Mountain. I was literally astounded at how the company dealt with Murch and his team on that film and yet Murch still maintained quite the enthusiasm for them. I would say that even now a lot of that remains.


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Scott Sheriff
Re: New Walter Murch FCPX interview (from macvideo)
on Nov 8, 2011 at 7:57:26 pm

I watched theis a couple of times, and I have to agree with DRW, in that Walter Murch really just said what many of us have been saying all along. I wonder if the 'occupyfinalcut' crowd will pull out their bullhorns and shout him (Murch) down with talking points for not liking it. Or if he will draw a bunch of criticism for repeatedly using terms like "pro" and "professional" in the interview.

I also agree with those that thought there was a large amount of skepticism, with hints of sarcasm in his thoughts of the future of FCP and apple for professional use, as well as some of the features and 'workarounds' like using the pointing tool to lock audio clips. You would have to expect a guy in his position to be a bit more PC then some of us, but it was still clear he had a lot of disdain for X in it's current form for professional use.

The one thing that really struck me is that Murch was so underwhelmed with X that he didn't even bother (so far) to personally try it out. Here is a guy that has always been interested in new techniques and edits really big projects. But all the background rendering, 64 bit and all the metadata on the planet doesn't seem to make up for the lack of tracks and traditional two screen setup. He had people explain it to him, and observed demo's, and obviously was up to speed on the latest versions new features. But yet he wasn't interested enough to pick up the mouse and try it out for himself on even a small project. I think that has 'it sucks' written all over it.

Scott Sheriff
Director
http://www.sstdigitalmedia.com


"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." ---Red Adair

Where were you on 6/21?


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