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Tell me if this is a bad idea

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Josh Williams
Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 9:40:35 pm

I recently completed a 5 day 4 camera shoot and now have 1.5 TB (88 hours) of H.264 footage I need to edit. I was initially planning on using FCP 7 and multi cam to get the job done but since I can't work with H.264 in FCP7 I will have to convert everything to ProRes. Now if I do that I will have to buy probably 5TB more of storage just for my ProRes files. Or I could convert to ProRes Proxy and everything will only be about 1.3TB and then I can use multi clip and edit the Proxy files and then reconnect them to the H.264 files when I am done.

OR

I can use FCP X and edit the H.264 files right in there. True I won't have multi clip but there are some workarounds I can use. They won't be as efficient as multi clip but the will work. Also I like the color correction tools in FCP X and the Keyword categorizing features but I don't have some of the Plugins I have for FCP7 mainly, Magic Bullet Denoiser.

So. Would it be stupid to use FCP X. Should I just convert, suck up the extra storage and money. Or should I just use FCP X?


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Gary Huff
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 9:49:13 pm

Frankly, I think this would backfire tremendously on you to go that route.


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Josh Williams
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 9:54:03 pm

Why? Can you elaborate a little. I know FCP X has a stigma on it of not being pro ready and I agree for to a certain extent. I just think on this job it might be the best option


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Steve Connor
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 10:11:11 pm

Nothing to do with stigma, it's the fact that using Multicam on a large project like that is better than not using it, on ANY software.

Steve Connor
Adrenalin Television

Have you tried "Search Posts"? Enlightenment may be there.


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Josh Williams
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 10:16:36 pm

Yeah that is a good point. Ok FCP 7 it is. I'll just bite the bullet and get some more storage, storage is cheaper than dirt nowadays anyway. Maybe I'll spring for a G-Raid thunderbolt setup. Thanks for the advice all


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Steve Connor
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 9:52:40 pm

Use FCP 7 and suck up the storage if you can. Not using multicam on a project that large would be a nightmare. I've done some short 15 minute multicam sequences in FCPX and the workround is OK, but at that level of rushes I would use 7

Steve Connor
Adrenalin Television

Have you tried "Search Posts"? Enlightenment may be there.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 19, 2011 at 9:55:27 pm

I have no idea what you should do. From the puzzler you put out, though, I WILL tell you what I would do. Plan A all the way. Buy storage. Convert. Multicam. Of course, I don't know what the cost of storage means to you. Remember, though, that you can reuse the storage. I personally like to have tons of storage. I'm fond of G RAIDs because they are quiet, but I'd also recommend Mac Universe RAIDs, as well.


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Neil Goodman
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 12:41:40 am

plan A. theres too many bugs to commit to something like that, and i dont know but 4 cams using that workaround for multiclip sounds like a nightmare to me uysing anymore than 2 cameras.

Neil Goodman: Editor of New Media Production - NBC/Universal


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Scott Sheriff
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 2:52:42 am

Why not just wait until FCP X has multi-cam capability?
According to the glee club, Apple has been intending to have all the pro features up and running in six months. So that means a mere 4 months to go.

Scott Sheriff
Director
http://www.sstdigitalmedia.com


"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." ---Red Adair

Where were you on 6/21?


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Josh Williams
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 3:12:31 am

Cant afford to wait for FCP X to be usable. Gotta get paid


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Chris Jacek
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 3:17:05 am

Is full-sized resolution absolutely necessary for your offline multi-cam edit? You could always recompress to an even smaller proxy codec (even if it isn't one of the ProRes codecs), as long as it is iFrame. This might save you some space, and maybe even give you a little faster performance.

Professor, Producer, Editor
and former Apple Employee


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Steve Connor
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 6:51:42 am

More helpful posts from the haters to a genuine question, seriously guys why are you bothering?

Steve Connor
Adrenalin Television

Have you tried "Search Posts"? Enlightenment may be there.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 8:22:46 am

Pretty much, Steve, I see all serious answers, here. In fact, most of them concur with your own advice. It seems to me they are indeed helpful. I fail to understand your grievance.


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Steve Connor
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 9:00:15 am

Sorry I don't believe Scott and Joshs answer were very helpful or appropriate.

Steve Connor
Adrenalin Television

Have you tried "Search Posts"? Enlightenment may be there.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 9:16:07 am

I do understand your sensitivity, but--if I may--I'd like to point out that it was Josh who posed the topic question. I do believe he was in earnest, and that he was simply responding to the suggestion--however insincere that suggestion was--that he wait.


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Josh Williams
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 9:17:37 am

Steve,
Sorry to hear you thought my comment on my own post was inappropriate and not helpful. I was really only trying to say that although I would love to use FCP X , I can't wait 4 or 6 months as was suggested for it to have multicam. Wasn't trying to be a hater on my own thread. I do appreciate your advice though. Thanks


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Glen Hurd
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 8:23:33 am

4 Sata Docks from China (thru ebay) at $19 each = $80 Docks
They're reliable, portable, and great for swapping out drives.
4 2TB drives from PriceWatch at $90 each = $360

That's 8 TB storage for $440 if you already have 4 sata ports. That's just a little more than the price of the FCP X "suite"!

If you need a 4 channel Sata card - $200 on ebay right now Sonnet Tech Sata Controller
or $132 at TapeResources CalDigit 4-Port Sata

And I highly recommend purchasing SoftRaid at $125. Not for it's raid capabilities.

SoftRaid uses some sort of algorithm developed by Google that predicts hard drive failures using SMART data - but does it far, far better than Disk Utility or other "typical" SMART status programs.

I've had it warn me a "perfectly good" drive was about to fail 2 weeks in advance of it going down - Disk Utility's SMART status saw nothing.

When you're working low budget and don't want to invest in extra storage for back up (or client doesn't want to pay for it), it's great having a piece of software that will actually throw a pop-up at you, telling you it's detecting a failure long before it happens.

Good luck on your edit, and as you may have already guessed, I'd vote for the transcode.

Transcoding doesn't involve hair-pulling and teeth gnashing. In fact, it's such a peaceful experience, many people choose to eat or simply sleep while it happens.

It's not like humans run 24/7.

We'll spend 6-8 hours every day completely unconscious and then complain that a planned project with mp4 footage slowed the edit down because it could only be ingested between 8 and 5! ;)

(Us "haters" also have a sly sense of efficiency. We're old-fashioned like that.)


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Gary Huff
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 5:12:37 pm

[Steve Connor]More helpful posts from the haters to a genuine question, seriously guys why are you bothering?

Perhaps you wouldn't care much if he plunged full-steam ahead into FCPX and got himself into a quandary, but some of us here actually provide helpful advice when someone is considering such a move.


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Chris Harlan
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 5:15:35 pm

The sad thing is, he goes on to confuse one of the original poster's responses, then accuses him of being a hater, too.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 7:21:34 pm

Cut it on Premiere Pro. Handles H.264 natively, has Multi-Cam, easier for FCP7 user to learn than FCPX, cheaper than buying new raid storage.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions


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Robert Brown
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 7:41:48 pm

Use Premiere Pro and have it all. But I haven't died it's multi-cam yet. But if you decide to transcode everything, watch out for the gamma shift Compressor adds and you may want to do some tests to see of Q-Master speeds things up. It can make a huge difference in some cases. That's built into OSX if you haven't heard of it, you set it up in OSX preferences.

Also I found Adobe Media Encoder does a better job for H264 to Pro Res. No gamma shift and the multi-threading is very good. I would definitely do a few tests before jumping. The Adobe suite can be downloaded and used free for 30 days and the learning curve is minimal coming from FCP.

Editor/VFX - FCP, Smoke, After Effects, 3DS MAX, Premiere Pro

http://vimeo.com/user3987510/videos


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Josh Williams
Re: Tell me if this is a bad idea
on Aug 20, 2011 at 8:48:39 pm

I think I'll stick with FCP 7. I've used premiere on A couple of jobs and like it just fine but I really like FCP multicam.
I tried using compressor 4 and Qmaster running 4 instances, one for each core on my quad core but it still would have taken an interminable amount of time. So I went back tithe raw MTS files and am now using clipwrap to convert to prores proxy. It does an hour of footage in about 55 min so much better than compressing the h.264 files.

I'll cut it with the proxy files and then reconnect to the h.264 files at the end


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