FORUMS: list search recent posts

Colorsync

COW Forums : Apple Final Cut Pro X Debates

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
Geoff Dills
Colorsync
on Jul 20, 2011 at 12:14:05 pm

A lot was made of this feature in the sneak peek and I haven't seen much discussion about what this really means for X. I have noticed anything I upload for web viewing now matches what I'm seeing on my edit machine, something which was NOT happening with FCP7. From what I can discern from some googgling is color info is embedded in the file which can be used by the display device to replicate colors precisely. My questions are what are it's limitations and potential? Could broadcast tools use this info? Or is this strictly for web?

Best,
Geoff


Return to posts index

Andrew Richards
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 20, 2011 at 2:45:23 pm

There's a post on Philip Hodgett's blog about it with several comments.

Best,
Andy


Return to posts index

Tangier Clarke
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 20, 2011 at 3:18:49 pm

I am curious about this too. I posted not too long after FCPX's release that the one glaring thing I noticed right away when running FCPX was that the colors and image quality of my video content were significantly richer and cleaner; on my MacBook Pro and Mac Pro. This same content did not look as good in FCP 7. Someone did point out to me that there is in fact a difference and someone else also noticed the difference (I have to find the post). I thought it was all in my head and just me perceiving this, but something is clearly going on.

Tangier


Return to posts index


Geoff Dills
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 20, 2011 at 4:04:56 pm

Thanks Andrew. And after reading all the comments I'm more confused. Some seem to think you can calibrate to video color space and you should get accurate 8 bit color rendering, another said leave it rgb and let ColorSync take care of things.

Best,
Geoff


Return to posts index

Steve Grimes
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 21, 2011 at 4:46:25 am

I have an honest question. I keep reading all the time that people are obsessed with having a properly calibrated broadcast monitor for their edit station because using anything else is so inaccurate it borderlines on crap. My question is, especially in regards to content for broadcast, do people realize what 95% of everyone is watching this content on? TVs so poorly calibrated not any discernible original color presentation is still relavent. Almost every home I have ever walked into has a big screen TV locked into Vivid mode, set to "Very Cool" coloring, with frame interpolation active no less because "the colors are awesome and everything is so smooth!" I know there are a small minority of home theater buffs in the world with properly calibrated TVs, but for nearly your entire audience, this couldn't be further from the truth. In fact, most computer monitors I encounter have a much more accurate color calibration as people don't generally have a horrid Vivid mode to activate, and generally additive frame interpolation isn't an option.

I have friends that do independent fx and coloring work for TNT shows that only ever use two 30" apple cinema displays. Granted they went through the effort of calibrating them well, but if it looks good on their displays they are generally very satisfied. In my earlier points I am not trying to say quality is irrelevant, but rather a decently calibrated computer monitor with attention to detail when grading will yield something so close results wise that 99% of those watching the content will never notice the difference.

The one point that gets made that I have respect for is with regards to interlaced footage and how it ultimately ends up, but for the large amount of content now captured in full progressive modes, why is the concept of a $5000 broadcast monitor still regarded as so damn necesary. I just can't wrap my mind around given nearly everyone watching the content absolutely destroys their display settings anyways.


Return to posts index

Andrae Palmer
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 21, 2011 at 6:21:34 am

Mr. Grimes,

Have you seen a monitor that is not properly calibrated? If so you will know that the colors can be completely off. A blue can appear as grey. So imagine you are thinking your grey wall is too dull and you make a correction to turn it into blue. Well what color is that blue now that you see? Ok so that's the case for proper calibration. My 5k monitor is a 10 bit monitor than can show more colors... 1.07 billion to be exact. It can prevent 8 bit banding in shades of a color (sky for example) .it can work in DCI-P3 mode which closely matches theatrical environments. It can show a 444 RGB signal which is the highest quality to monitor in. you can do your own testing of 422 vs 444 footage to see the difference. Now for web edit in your underwear on a Mac mini people these features may not matter... But different strokes for different folks.

Davinci Resolve Mac 7.1:
Mac Pro 12-Core
24GB (six 4GB) memory
ATI Radeon HD 5770 and NVIDIA Quadro 4000
Blackmagic Decklink Extreme 3D+


Return to posts index


Geoff Dills
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 21, 2011 at 11:18:43 am

If proper broadcast monitoring is necessary for proper color grading, and most pros seem to think the grading tools in FCP are inferior, and we know some form of XML support is coming, why the pressing need to have broadcast monitor output in FCP? Do your grading in Resolve on a broadcast monitor. Or will pros want to do color grading using FCPX?

Best,
Geoff


Return to posts index

Geoff Dills
Re: Colorsync
on Sep 2, 2011 at 12:00:15 pm

Philip Hodgetts has written an excellent analysis of ColorSync here:

http://www.philiphodgetts.com/2011/09/fcp-x-color-management-secret/

"Conclusion
While it’s a significant change from traditional workflows, the approach taken by Apple with Final Cut Pro X is a better fit for what happens in edit bays outside the big studios, where the problem with early Final Cut Pro users wasn’t that they weren’t monitoring on calibrated broadcast monitors but that they were monitoring only on the computer display. How many times did I, and the other Final Cut Pro 1 pioneers have to remind people that the computer display is not an accurate representation of the video!

Well, 2.2 gamma on OS X (since Snow Leopard) and ColorSync have made that advice not only null and void, but downright wrong. With a ColorSync workflow, the view on the computer monitor, particularly in full screen mode, will be more accurate than using a consumer television as a display, with the sole exception of interlaced video output. If you’re delivering for web, for LCD or plasma screen (i.e. all currently available displays) the display is progressive. Produce and edit accordingly.

I don’t think we have broadcast video output from Final Cut Pro X, because we have something better that accommodates todays colorspaces and will expand to accommodate whatever the future holds as well."

Best,
Geoff


Return to posts index

Steve Grimes
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 21, 2011 at 3:40:39 pm

Andrea, you didn't seem to actually answer my question though. You stated all of the very high end perks of owning a $5k monitor. That I already understand. What I am honestly wondering is why do you need all of those perks including perfect 10 bit color reproduction when virtually every person that watches your content will see it in 8-bit, and furthermore on insanely crappy color / contrast settings. Does a well calibrated computer monitor really not offer you any chance whatsoever to grade decently well? Do you honestly think no affordable computer monitor is capable of being calibrated so that blue is in fact blue and not grey? And if not, won't everyone watching have their calibration of blue be largely imperfect anyways? I am just trying to understand the large vocal majority that states without a $5k monitor, you cant possibly have any sort of accurate grade.


Return to posts index


Mitch Ives
Re: Colorsync
on Jul 22, 2011 at 3:44:24 pm

[Steve Grimes] "I am not trying to say quality is irrelevant, but rather a decently calibrated computer monitor with attention to detail when grading will yield something so close results wise that 99% of those watching the content will never notice the difference."

Ahhh... no. Not true at all. I see a lot of people who are trying to rationalize not having made the appropriate investment.

[Steve Grimes] " I just can't wrap my mind around given nearly everyone watching the content absolutely destroys their display settings anyways."

Because our job, as a professional, is to do it right... not try to make the unilateral decision that "good is good enough". Perhaps this is why so many people just use a high school student to do their video for $400, because we aren't pointing out all the things they get with a properly trained and knowledgeable professional? I'm just saying... maybe we're bringing this on ourselves...

Mitch Ives
Insight Productions Corp.
mitch@insightproductions.com
http://www.insightproductions.com


Return to posts index

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
© 2017 CreativeCOW.net All Rights Reserved
[TOP]