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put your money where your mouth is

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Allen Cordell
put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 7:23:12 pm

show me something sick edited in fcpx. it's the only thing that'll convince me.


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Paul Jay
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:16:16 pm

So much crap is edited on FCP 7 & Media Composer.
Just go watch a 2011 Hollywood movie or MTV music video.
Yeah, i like blaming tools for all the crap on TV :)


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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:20:14 pm

but i didn't ask for crappy stuff edited in fcp7 or mc.


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Jacob Kerns
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:23:43 pm

http://www.vimeo.com/25512336 - David Battistella posted this on here he used and made it work.

I hate and switched to Premiere Pro.

NIADA
Technical Director


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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:27:37 pm

meh. that doesn't convince me. just makes me wanna jump ship too.


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Jacob Kerns
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:41:10 pm

Makes me want a RED cam though!

NIADA
Technical Director


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Noah Kadner
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:48:03 pm

And what would you consider sick? Good acting? Aggressive color correction? Great sound design etc.

I'd suggest that anyone who took the time to learn FCP X could pretty much do anything they could imagine. Well inasmuch as they could do the same in any other editing app. It's just a question of getting from point a to b and how much you enjoyed the journey (or didn't).

Noah

Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Panasonic GH2 and GoPro HD Hero.


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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:51:09 pm

i just mean something that shows off some impressive editing


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Forrest Burger
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 9:23:34 pm

[Allen Cordell] " just mean something that shows off some impressive editing"

Please...so I guess you don't think "Citizen Kane" was a very good movie because it wasn't edited on FCP7, PPro or Avid?



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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 10:44:40 pm

i never said that


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David Battistella
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 7:53:30 am

The most impressive editing I have ever seen is the editing I never noticed.

David.

______________________________
The shortest answer is doing.
Lord Herbert



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Chris Stevens
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:59:45 pm

The original question is the perfect illustration of the unfounded fear surrounding FCPX.

Did film editors in the 30s argue over what brand of razor-blade they used to splice the celluloid? Did 18th century playwrights argue over what animal quill they wrote with?

Did Shakespeare ask: "Show me something sick that's been written with an Ostrich quill. Because until you do, I'm only writing this stuff with duck quills."

Haters keep hatin'. Lovers get creating. Hug the X and it'll hug you right back. Let's edit.


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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 9:03:42 pm

and when you're done editing it, please, i'd love to see it!


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Scott Sheriff
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 11:02:22 pm

[Chris Stevens] "Did film editors in the 30s argue over what brand of razor-blade they used to splice the celluloid?"

I don't know about the 30's.
But in the 70's & 80's they did argue over their favorite splice block. Tape vs cement. And then, what brand of tape, or cement is best. What filmstock is best. Blah, blah, blah.
And I'll tell you a little secret, if you'll promise not to tell anyone else. Some of the editors based their opinion of the other editors work on which supplies and tools they preferred to work with. They also had an opinion on your worth as an editor based on what formats you had previously edited with.

Scott Sheriff
Director
http://www.sstdigitalmedia.com


"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." ---Red Adair

Where were you on 6/21?


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Chris Conlee
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 12:08:26 am

Upright Moviola vs. flatbed debates still rage to this day in some circles. And if you cut with an upright, heaven help you, in some company, if you dared to use takeup reels.

Chris


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Tim Kolb
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 10:19:54 pm

[Jacob Kerns] "Makes me want a RED cam though!"

Or anything...that was any color at all.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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David Battistella
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 18, 2011 at 7:57:50 pm

HA ha,

That was a funny one...
:)


David

______________________________
The shortest answer is doing.
Lord Herbert



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Tim Kolb
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 18, 2011 at 11:29:00 pm

[David Battistella] "HA ha,

That was a funny one...
:)"


Sorry, a bit too cute I suppose.

It was meant to be humorous (corny...but humorous)...not degrading.

:-)

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Adobe Certified Instructor


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Greg Burke
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 8:54:23 pm

[Allen Cordell] "show me something sick edited in fcpx. it's the only thing that'll convince me."

Well I mean this really isn't a good argument....I mean you mostly can't tell what anything is edited in unless is your using AVID only plug ins or FCP Fonts and such, I have a hard time telling anyway. But Your taking 2 cars....A pinto and a Corvette and asking witch will get to B from A better, they both do the job but one is nicer and more upscale. I personally wont cut in FCP-X freelance wise because it is iMovie Pro and I dont care what anyone else says it is. at it core its a 64 bit iMovie, and Ill treat is as such.

I wear many hats.
http://www.gregburkepost.com


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Marvin Holdman
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 9:12:38 pm

Here you go....







Marvin Holdman
Production Manager
Tourist Network
8317 Front Beach Rd, Suite 23
Panama City Beach, Fl
phone 850-234-2773 ext. 128
cell 850-585-9667
skype username - vidmarv


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Craig Seeman
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 9:41:31 pm

Probably edited on Avid.



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Errol Lazare
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 10:24:18 pm

And for everyone who wants to switch from imovie to FCPX I would most highly recommend you read this tantalizing apple article because "As an iMovie user, you’re already familiar with some features in Final Cut Pro X — such as skimming and the Magnetic Timeline — so you can start working right away!" YAY!

http://www.apple.com/finalcutpro/imovie-to-finalcutpro/

I might just save my money and edit my $2,000,000 feature with imovie. Seems like a good call.

Errol X. Lazare
EXL Films
http://www.exlfilms.com


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Greg Burke
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 10:26:52 pm

[Errol Lazare] "I might just save my money and edit my $2,000,000 feature with imovie. Seems like a good call."

I have nothing against iMovie if you use and it gets the job done, why not? I have a problem with apple Discontinuing FCS/Macpros/Pro Apps for iMovie X.

I wear many hats.
http://www.gregburkepost.com


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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 14, 2011 at 11:08:15 pm

it's not an argument. no one is arguing about anything.


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Bobby Mosca
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 5:22:50 am

Maybe Allen's original request missed the mark a bit, but I'll take a stab at what he was getting at:

Don't show me something sick, show me something big. Show me a major film or broadcast production editor or team use this for something intended to be seen by tens of thousands, if not millions, of people. Because if nobody in that realm can make it work, and work well, is there anything else to say?

They make a good point, Allen. I can make something 'sick'-ish with iMovie. But you can't pay me to assemble one of my shows with it.


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Allen Cordell
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 12:21:25 pm

[Bobby Mosca] "
Maybe Allen's original request missed the mark a bit, but I'll take a stab at what he was getting at:"


what mark did i miss? i just wanted to see cool stuff edited with fcpx. pretty simple. instead this thread spiraled into some weird philosophical territory.

but anyway, thanks for sending those links, really appreciate it!


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Chris Kenny
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 1:23:30 pm

[Bobby Mosca] "Don't show me something sick, show me something big. Show me a major film or broadcast production editor or team use this for something intended to be seen by tens of thousands, if not millions, of people. Because if nobody in that realm can make it work, and work well, is there anything else to say?"

Surely people realize this is not a reasonable standard to be applying to an application released three weeks ago. Even incremental updates to established NLEs aren't generally pressed into service for high-end work that quickly.

With respect to adoption for different levels of production, FCP X is likely to follow a pattern similar to the original FCP, but probably a little faster. That is to say, it will be adopted bottom-up. My guess is someone will get some attention for editing an indie feature in it within the next 12 months.

--
Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.

You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.


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Rafael Amador
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 9:57:25 am

[Chris Stevens] "Did film editors in the 30s argue over what brand of razor-blade they used to splice the celluloid? Did 18th century playwrights argue over what animal quill they wrote with?

Did Shakespeare ask: "Show me something sick that's been written with an Ostrich quill. Because until you do, I'm only writing this stuff with duck quills.""

Sure, editors argued about cutters, solvents, glues and moviolas.

Lets forget about Shakespeare and Steven Spilberg.
I´m tired of big words (art, talent, creative freedom..)
I´m not an artist. I´m a video editor, and half of my job and skills are about fixing crap, recovering old stuff and mending cameramen mistakes.
Creative freedom in my job?
Yes, I have it when I edit something for my self.
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


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Bobby Mosca
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 15, 2011 at 6:33:53 pm

Rafa: I feel your pain. (Although sometimes it's my mistakes I'm fixing, but whatever.)

Allen: Maybe I just found the term 'sick' too limiting. Bygones.

Chris: I'm supposed to wait how long? The bottom line for me is that Apple has shaken my confidence in their commitment to broadcast capable editing. From Helmut Kobler's article "A Final Cutter Tries Out Premeire Pro" here at CC, Apple's recent history looks like this:


"Apple took nearly 2.5 years to upgrade Final Cut Studio from version 2 to 3 (and v.3 was only a moderate upgrade at that). Until then, updates had come at a much more aggressive pace.

Apple cancelled the popular Shake, promising to replace it with a new tool that never came. (my addition: not really. Many of Shake's features have found their way into the other suite programs, including FCX.)

Apple got lazy with its Logic Pro app as well, letting development creep along with an upgrade about every two years.

Apple stopped updating the Pro page on its web site long ago. There hasn't been a new item posted in almost two years: http://www.apple.com/pro/

Apple took more than a year to fix a glaring Final Cut 7 bug that made its Close Gap command unreliable. To break a core Timeline feature like Close Gap and not fix it for 14 months was offensive and inexcusable.

Apple cancelled its Xserve RAID then its Xserve hardware.

Apple started taking longer and longer to release Mac Pro workstations, and absolutely phoned in the latest upgrade last July. 511 days in the making, the newest Mac Pro was one of the most un-inspired hardware upgrades I've ever seen from Apple.

Apple pulled out of industry trade events like NAB.

Multiple rumors (and confirmation of rumors) of significant layoffs in the Pro Apps division.

Multiple rumors that Apple was trying to sell off its Pro Apps division."

Then Apple gives us X, which has gaping holes in it and some kinda weird features (CNN?), promotes it as a pro product which they knew wasn't pro enough for an important segment of the industry, and now they're saying "Trust Me! :D!"

Maybe Larry Jordan is right and we'll all be using FCX in 18 months. Maybe you're right and it will be a generation ahead of AVID and Premeire 12 months from now. But maybe not. Given the above and what has happened this past month, I just don't have the confidence you do right now. So Apple is getting ahead of the game and looking to the world of editing in the next 10 years. I have to look to my future, too, and I have to decide if FC is worth the risk sooner rather than later.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: put your money where your mouth is
on Jul 16, 2011 at 4:00:41 pm

[Bobby Mosca] "Maybe Larry Jordan is right and we'll all be using FCX in 18 months... So Apple is getting ahead of the game and looking to the world of editing in the next 10 years. I have to look to my future, too, and I have to decide if FC is worth the risk sooner rather than later."

Correct: who knows? Nobody's saying.

But if you need to begin an edit RIGHT NOW and you know you'll need multiple versions for various countries, delivered on videotape,using more than one editor to get the job done, your choices currently are:
  • Stick with FCP 7
  • Use some other NLE

That's pretty much it.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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