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New Blackmagic eGPU

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Steve Connor
New Blackmagic eGPU
on Oct 31, 2018 at 4:01:52 pm

I don't want to distract people from the endless discussion about what the forum should be called but this looks interesting. BMD have released another eGPU.

https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/blackmagicegpu/

I wonder how well it works with the new MacBook Air?

https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/10/30/hands-on-with-the-new-2018-macbo...


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Bob Zelin
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Oct 31, 2018 at 8:03:42 pm

you can get the Sonnet eGFX with the Vega 64 for the same money. So why go with the Vega 56 ?

https://www.sonnetstore.com/collections/egpu-expansion-systems/products/egf...

Bob Zelin

Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com


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Michael Hancock
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Oct 31, 2018 at 8:21:49 pm

Plus, you can swap out the card in the Sonnet unit. You can't swap the card in the Blackmagic unit.

----------------
Michael Hancock
Editor


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Bob Zelin
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 1:10:53 pm

you bring up the MOST important point, Michael.
You purchase an iMac Pro and it can come with either a Vega 56 or Vega 64.
But we are in the video and electronics industry - and what happens - everything becomes obsolete very quickly.
And is the case with the AMD Vega 64. New AMD card? Sure - the WX9100 - and will there be an even faster one very soon - THERE SURE WILL ! So with the Sonnet Box (or Akitio Node) - you simply open the box, swap out your card, and you have the new latest and greatest.

THIS very fact is my #1 concern about the pending "new Mac Pro". Will Apple let us mere mortals open up the new Mac Pro and stick anything we want into it - without having to go to an "Apple Genius Bar" to do it - and without having to get only "Apple flashed hardware" where nothing else will work ?

Of course - I can counter my own argument here. The "fan boys" will come back and say "well - if you simply got Apple Care, and something when wrong, Apple would fix this for you for free, and when a NEW model comes out with a better graphics card, Apple will have a trade in incentive program". I know I will never win that battle.

Bob Zelin

Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com


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Steve Connor
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 2:03:10 pm

[Bob Zelin] " The "fan boys" will come back and say "well - if y"

Bob, would you mind NOT calling people "fan boys" it's that sort of comment that keeps people off this forum


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Bouke Vahl
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 2:30:17 pm

[Steve Connor] "it's that sort of comment that keeps people off this forum"

Well, it's that sort of comments that keeps (some) people ON this forum.
Bob gives away free advice that normally should cost people a lot of money if he was hired as a consultant.
(You still hire him anyways if you are stupid like me and want to have your setup working, even if he lives at the other side at the world.)
In return he asks for nothing more than a place to vent his ideas, frustrations and adoration of hardware. And he's right most of the time. (I disagree on hardware getting obsolete that fast, but that's another discussion.)
I think that is a fair deal.
(To be honest, his tone is way less aggressive than it used to be, probably due to moderation here, but it has never bothered me, the opposite being more true.)

Bouke
http://www.videotoolshed.com


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Bob Zelin
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 4:53:28 pm

Hi Steve -
I would like to address your comment. I will try to be as civil as possible.
I do not like Apple's new philosophy of "Apple only - you don't need anything else" - be it from a hardware purchase or labor purchase (service, support, etc.).

I have been using Apple products since the early days of AVID. I installed THIRD PARTY Digital Voodoo 64 AV cards in a Mac computer long before Blackmagic and AJA ever existed. And when the THIRD PARTY AJA I/O Box came out that was for use with Mac computers, that changed everything. All of a sudden, the Mac was a powerhouse for professional editing. And of course, AJA, Matrox, Blackmagic, MOTU and others took off, and created an industry.
All of a sudden, linear was totally out, and Mac based edit systems like AVID and FCP took over everything. And it was great. And it was all Apple based.

And other companies emerged - Other World Computing, Sonnet, Promise, Cal Digit, and countless others - all basing their product line on Apple products. And it was great.

And then something happened. Apple decided that they didn't like all this third party hardware. They wanted to keep all the money for themselves. They did like not third party repairs, or third party expansion. Everything became closed products in a very short period of time. Soon, you could not upgrade anything. And you could not repair anything. And soon (10.13.3) - Apple didn't even want third party products that would plug into thunderbolt ports to work, making it very difficult to install drivers for third party products (without going into recovery mode to disable System Integrity Protection). And now - most recently - Apple wants their "partner companies" like Blackmagic to sell things like their eGPU boxes directly thru the Apple store, and not thru the free market, like Amazon, B&H Photo, Span, Newegg, and value added resellers.

WELL - I don't like this. And I think that people who embrace the ENTIRE video industry, and the DIVERSITY of wonderful companies that have existed since the beginning of time in the video industry, want to keep this diversity. And when they see a threat to that diversity - and see a central company trying to create a monopoly, that if you want to exist using Apple products - you will hand over your money directly to them, and not be allowed to go anywhere else. Well - I don't like this. And that's where my "bad attitude" comes from. I don't like the fact that companies like Western Digital and Seagate have become the ONLY place to go if you want storage. I don't like the fact that companies like Spectrum and AT&T are buying up all the competition so there is no other place to go. I don't like monopolies - I like diversity. That's what our industry has always been (audio, video, graphics, production, post production, etc.).

Some people (I won't use the term) don't have a problem with this. I should be allowed to disagree with them, without being "shut down".

Bob Zelin

Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com


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Steve Connor
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 4:58:12 pm

[Bob Zelin] "Some people (I won't use the term) don't have a problem with this. I should be allowed to disagree with them, without being "shut down". "

Oh good grief Bob, I only asked you not to use the name NOT the argument! Have whatever opinion you want, just don't be insulting about it!


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Mark Raudonis
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 3, 2018 at 11:56:17 pm

Come on now, Steve. Do you really want to be the stick in the mud taking the fun out this forum?

Let me go on record as saying I welcome, appreciate, and LOVE the honesty, frankness, and truthfulness
of Bob Z's posts. 99.9 per cent of what he has to say is on point, relevant, and may NOT be what you want to hear... but it's always heartfelt and honest. The other .01 per cent may be the wine talking'... I'm not sure!

Keep it up, Bob.

Mark "Big Fan Boy of Bob Z" Raudonis



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Steve Connor
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 4, 2018 at 1:06:25 pm

[Mark Raudonis] "Come on now, Steve. Do you really want to be the stick in the mud taking the fun out this forum?
"


Oh good grief, read the post I'm ONLY saying don't use the F**boy word, nothing else, there's a reason that if you use the word (without spaces) it gets referred to COW admin. It's deliberately inflammatory and absolutely nothing to do with someones point of view or opinion.

Sadly I don't think we have a hope in hell of getting a broader reach for this forum whatever it's called


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Andrew Kimery
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 5, 2018 at 4:52:58 pm

[Bob Zelin] "THIS very fact is my #1 concern about the pending "new Mac Pro". Will Apple let us mere mortals open up the new Mac Pro and stick anything we want into it - without having to go to an "Apple Genius Bar" to do it - and without having to get only "Apple flashed hardware" where nothing else will work ? "

My guess is no they won't. The Mac Pro will come with beefy GPU options but will be on a multi-year upgrade cycle. If you want to upgrade your GPU mid cycle your only option will be an eGPU.

On one hand the Mac Pro won't have a user upgradable GPU, on the other hand the eGPU allows you to boost performance on any computer you use that has ThB 3.


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Oliver Peters
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 5, 2018 at 5:43:55 pm

[Andrew Kimery] "My guess is no they won't."

My guess is that RAM would be the exception. Maybe, also the addition of more internal SSDs, but I think that's slimmer.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Andrew Kimery
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 5, 2018 at 6:54:03 pm

[Oliver Peters] "My guess is that RAM would be the exception. Maybe, also the addition of more internal SSDs, but I think that's slimmer."

I agree about the RAM and possibly the storage. My previous comment was just about the GPU.


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Winston A. Cely
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 7:39:16 pm

All the courses at our school that use Macs are on a 3-year rotation, which means we get the best we can afford usually very close to maxed out iMacs every three years. As an instructor, I love this!

But isn't this a common practice in some high-end facilities? Upgrading hardware and computers on some sort of x-year schedule? I seem to remember reading on this forum that some people do this. I guess my point is that if you have a schedule, do you really need the upgrade on any specific internal components option?

Winston A. Cely
Editor/Owner | Della St. Media, LLC

17" MacBook Pro | 2.3 GHz Intel Core i7
4 GB RAM | Final Cut Studio 3 | FCPX | Motion 5 | Compressor 4

"If you can talk brilliantly enough about a subject, you can create the consoling illusion it has been mastered." - Stanley Kubrick


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Michael Hancock
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 8:13:36 pm

[Winston A. Cely] "if you have a schedule, do you really need the upgrade on any specific internal components option?"

If you can upgrade individual components your total hardware replacement schedule gets longer, so each machine makes more money over the course of its life.

----------------
Michael Hancock
Editor


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Winston A. Cely
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 10:07:13 pm

Gotcha. I hadn't thought about that. My only comeback would be to sell the system you're replacing, but that would also mean money loss due to hours spent trying to sell the old hardware.

Winston A. Cely
Editor/Owner | Della St. Media, LLC

17" MacBook Pro | 2.3 GHz Intel Core i7
4 GB RAM | Final Cut Studio 3 | FCPX | Motion 5 | Compressor 4

"If you can talk brilliantly enough about a subject, you can create the consoling illusion it has been mastered." - Stanley Kubrick


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Bob Zelin
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 1, 2018 at 11:29:11 pm

you know -
Steve Connor started off this thread very respectfully, just mentioning a new hardware product from Apple.
And then some jerk named "Bob Zelin" started trouble ! The trouble that seems to (according to Steve) drive people away from forums like this, because in 2018, editors need their "safe space" where everyone is nice to them.

The ONLY reason a generic forum exists (as opposed to a company sponsored forum, that will frown upon criticism) is to COMPLAIN and WHINE about problems. For me, that is what draws me to open forums, like Creative Cow - to find out about PROBLEMS when the company forum (or the company phone call) says "gee - this is a great product - and we never heard anyone ever mention this problem before - we are sorry that you are having these issues".

My first memory of this on Creative Cow was with Walter Biscardi on the AJA forum. BOTH of us were having problems with Panasonic AJ-HD1200A 720P VTR's with AJA cards - and both of us wound up calling AJA (a company I love) - and AJA tech support told BOTH of us (almost at the same time) that "they were not aware of any issues with 720P and the AJA cards". It was because of Creative Cow that both of us were COMPLAINING and I was able to use Walter's information to confront AJA about the issue - and the technical issue was identified quickly, because THE COMPANY was not able to "B.S" us, because we were on a public forum, and we knew there was a problem.

Since this is an FCP X forum (and will soon not be a "debate" forum) - I will take this opportunity to complain about what many people dislike on this forum - Adobe Premiere. Adobe Premiere has this incredibly horrible "feature" called Media Cache - which after a few months, fills up, and I don't care if you have the software set to delete the cache after a certain number of days. IT FILLS UP, and if you don't go into the /Library/Applications Support/Adobe/Common folder, and DELETE the damn files in the Media Cache and Media Cache Files folders, your system will soon start to crawl, and stutter, and you won't be able to play anything back, and you will blame your computer, and your storage array, but the PROBLEM is Adobe Premiere Media Cache.

So if this was a "politically correct" Adobe Premiere forum (and I know that most people here hate Adobe Premiere) - then you would say "stop saying such back things about Adobe Premiere - it's a great program used by thousands
of professionals, without issue" - But that is the POINT. The public forum is to expose problems that the companies don't have the time or the capacity to deal with.

When FCP X first came out, and Apple refused (probably intentionally) to allow for a library to be stored on a network drive, I complained very vocally about this right away, and many people got offended. I eventually discovered about the use of Sparse Disk Images, and then thanks to a young lady at Florida Atlantic University, that the use of NFS network protocol would allow for the ability to write a FCP X Library to a network volume. And then Apple finally gave in, after all the complaints, and as of FCP X 10.3, we could all use SMB to write to network volumes, and things were back to normal. Why is complaining about this, and saying how horrible Apple is because of this - a bad thing?

But this relates to ALL the manufacturers - every damn manufacturer in the world is guilty - and is the point of public forums like this to be "nice"- or to expose all these companies ? My beloved QNAP - which I make my living with these days - they make mistakes ALL THE TIME - and I am on THEIR FORUMS, saying "why isn't this working - why does this bug exist" - and I am aggressive, and not polite, because people pay their hard earned money to purchase these products, and if these products have problems that prevent these users from making a living with these products, then these companies MUST ANSWER in a timely manner. And if they do not - well, there is hell to pay.

As I often say in social circles when I am not in a business situation - "I am not prejudice - I hate everyone".

Bob Zelin

Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com


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David Mathis
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 2, 2018 at 12:24:34 am

Bob, your post was brilliant and made my day!


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greg janza
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 2, 2018 at 2:03:15 pm

Bob, thanks as always for writing the most concise and clear minded posts on this site.

Windows 10 Pro | i7-5820k CPU | 64 gigs RAM | NvidiaGeForceGTX970 | Blackmagic Decklink 4k Mini Monitor |
Adobe CC 2019 13.0 | Renders/cache: Samsung SSD 950 Pro x2 in Raid 0 | Media: Samsung SSD 960 PRO PCIe NVMe M.2 2280 x 2 | Media: OWC Thunderbay 4 x 2 Raid 0 mirrored with Resilio


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Neil Goodman
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 2, 2018 at 2:51:14 am

[Winston A. Cely] "But isn't this a common practice in some high-end facilities? "

Not in my experience - I work at rather large A/V agency and we are on 2010 cheesegraters..time's probably 50 or so. No plans on ugrading according to IT.

Lot of other places still on cheesegraters and back when i was at NBC we were on 10 year old hps.

Seems like the smaller boutique places stay more up to date - most places have Imacs now.


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Mark Smith
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 2, 2018 at 12:22:39 pm

I was just going to ask How many people are still using the old mac cheese graters. There is a computer that is like the Mars rover of computers. It had a certain anticipated life span and 14 years later its still ticking.....


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Winston A. Cely
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 2, 2018 at 1:06:02 pm

[Neil Goodman] "Seems like the smaller boutique places stay more up to date - most places have Imacs now."

I had a feeling that was what it might be in real-world practice. It does make sense to some extent, too. Easier to replace a few than an entire building.

I also see not wanting to upgrade for all the problems that seem to happen every time there is a software or hardware update. If the system is operating the way you need it to, why upgrade if there's a better than a small chance you're going to encounter some kind of problem, right?

Winston A. Cely
Editor/Owner | Della St. Media, LLC

17" MacBook Pro | 2.3 GHz Intel Core i7
4 GB RAM | Final Cut Studio 3 | FCPX | Motion 5 | Compressor 4

"If you can talk brilliantly enough about a subject, you can create the consoling illusion it has been mastered." - Stanley Kubrick


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Erik Lindahl
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 2, 2018 at 9:27:01 pm

The new eGPU should replace the original one with the original price. It’s what the original one should have been. Not a 2 year old GPU.

This new one now is waaaaaaaaay too overpriced and inflexible in terms of upgrades.


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Neil Goodman
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 3, 2018 at 2:38:10 pm

[Winston A. Cely] "I also see not wanting to upgrade for all the problems that seem to happen every time there is a software or hardware update. If the system is operating the way you need it to, why upgrade if there's a better than a small chance you're going to encounter some kind of problem, right?
"


Yea, we recently went from ppro 2017 to 2018. It almost brought the whole building down. AE's couldnt get reliable AAF's out to the mixers.

Would be nice to have blazing fast new computers but at the end of the day we're doing offline editing with low res media and dont really need the extra juice.


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Oliver Peters
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 3, 2018 at 10:29:32 pm

[Winston A. Cely] "But isn't this a common practice in some high-end facilities? Upgrading hardware and computers on some sort of x-year schedule?"

I'm with the rest here. Most facilities try to get a lot out of their gear for as long as possible. Up until the past few years, people had been running on Avid Media Composer, Vegas, Edius, or Final Cut Pro "legacy". Those software products seemed to be less dependent on hardware changes, except for I/O. And then that was largely only for the jump from SD to HD. You could run gear longer without a refresh.

More recent software, like FCPX, newer versions of Premiere Pro CC, etc., has become more tied to hardware changes especially on the Mac platform. That's mainly because of the need to tie in more closely with the OS, because of how it integrates with the hardware. So if you were running mainly Avid MC, you could still be quite comfortable on older machines with Apple or PC hardware.

OTOH, some of us are running trash can Macs, which are old, too, by this same standard ☺

[Mark Smith] "I was just going to ask How many people are still using the old mac cheese graters."

The real question is how many are running cheese graters with their original hardware ☺ If you have a Mac Pro that's mid-2009 or newer, then you can still get up to High Sierra. A lot of us have upgraded internal drives to SSDs, upgraded GPUs, upped the RAM and so on. These changes are simple plug-and-play. The more adventurous have even upgraded the Xeons. All of this is possible in these "ancient" machines and gets them pretty close to modern performance. For most editing tasks - especially Media Composer - you still have a current, viable machine.

But the question is, if you tally the cost of all of those upgrades plus your time, have you really saved that much money?

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Dom Silverio
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 7, 2018 at 1:49:07 pm

I would not be surprised that the new T2 chip in the new Macs will eventually shutdown Hackintosh.

The eGPU from BM/Apple is really subpar considering you are getting a low to mid-level GPU. At the price of the Pro version, you can get a PCIe 2080Ti. Even the 1080Ti is superior for $700.

And regarding "fanboy" I agree it can be inflammatory but so I think sarcastic and dismissive comments do more damage. "Fanboy" is just easier to moderate.


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Scott Thomas
Re: New Blackmagic eGPU
on Nov 10, 2018 at 3:23:21 am

The Sonnet has a 650W power supply compared to the Blackmagic's 400W. That probably limits which GPUs they can throw in there. I found a teardown of the eGPU online...

Blackmagic eGPU Radeon Pro 580 Thunderbolt 3 Enclosure


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