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eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4

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Steve Connor
eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 30, 2018 at 6:57:55 pm

Looking forward to reading how this might work with FCPX

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208544

"Traditional NLEs have timelines. FCPX has storylines" W.Soyka


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Bob Zelin
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 30, 2018 at 7:30:38 pm

I don't want to seem ungrateful. I am very happy that this is happening, and that Sonnet and Akitio products will work wonderfully with this. I am very unhappy that Apple is NOT cooperating with Nvidia, and that the NVidia
GTX-1080ti and Nvidia Titan X are not directly supported, and require lots of "song and dance" (terminal commands) to get them to work. I would like to know EXACTLY why Apple is giving Nvidia (and anyone else ) a hard time
except for AMD cards.

I would like to know that if Apple intends to release a new Mac Pro (an expandable Mac) that we will not be at the mercy of the companies that are in "financial ties" with Apple. I would like to see Apple cooperate with anyone, and not block their drivers from running on any Apple product that is to be released. I am very unhappy with
Apple System Integrity Protection, and the current nightmare it is to install any third party product that is running under macOS 10.13.3. And anyone here that says "well, why don't you just buy Apple only" - well, that person needs to be beaten. The reason our industry exists is because of open architecture, and preventing that from happening - well, that is cause for an uprising.

With that said - again, I am grateful for the support of external eGPU with 10.13.4, even if it's only with the selected AMD GPU cards right now.

Bob Zelin

Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com


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Steve Connor
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 30, 2018 at 7:41:51 pm

It would be interesting to find out exactly why Apple doesn't work with Nvidia, is it financial, is it a problem with reliable integration into OSX or could it be the Nvidia don't want to work with Apple? It certainly looks like there will be no Nvidia options in the new Mac Pro

"Traditional NLEs have timelines. FCPX has storylines" W.Soyka


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Bob Zelin
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 1:26:18 am

all that really matters here is Adobe C C, and Davinci Resolve (and this forum replies with "well, just use Apple software). If Adobe and Resolve continue to push the use of GPU acceleration with Nvidia GTX-1080ti cards, and show only PC's at NAB 2018, because of this - well, then this is a big deal. At least to me.

Bob Zelin

Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com


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greg janza
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 6:38:14 pm

I look forward to Bill's positive spin on this that will inevitably include a statement that Apple is re-inventing the vendor relationship and that part of the forward thinking that Apple possesses is the complete abandonment of partnerships with industry leaders like Nvidia.

What will be the breaking point for Apple customers?

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Oliver Peters
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 7:01:41 pm

These first 2 points in the document's notes section seem to be relevant.

1. If you're using a 13-inch MacBook Pro from 2016 or later, always plug eGPUs and other high-performance devices into the left-hand ports for maximum data throughput.

2. For optimal performance, eGPUs should be connected directly to your Mac and not daisy-chained through another Thunderbolt device or hub.

Point one makes you won't how much of the TB3 bandwidth is sapped off by adding an eGPU chassis.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Bill Davis
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 7:22:11 pm

[Oliver Peters] "1. If you're using a 13-inch MacBook Pro from 2016 or later, always plug eGPUs and other high-performance devices into the left-hand ports for maximum data throughput."

For more detailed information:

https://www.macrumors.com/2016/10/28/macbook-pro-tb3-reduced-pci-express-ba...

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Oliver Peters
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 9:26:51 pm

[Bill Davis] "For more detailed information:"

Unfortunately what that doesn't answer is whether or not these ports are actually from a common bus internally. For example, on the 2013 Mac Pro, you have 6 TB2 ports, but only 3 buses. So If I have two TB3 devices plugged into the left side of a 13" MBP - and they both draw on the full TB3 bandwidth each - is that going to work?

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Bill Davis
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 7:14:20 pm

I certainly get that the ability to re-use an editors existing fast GPU Cards in a new eGPU box would have protected early adopters investments better.

MTBO (Mean Time Before Obsolescence?) is an increasingly lousy metric across all technology these days. And if I had a boatload of Nvidia cards sitting around my office, I'd be pissed too.

But this is once again, IMO about IP. AMD and Nvidia and the other card folk are playing, at least in part, a proprietary technology game. The bean counters will allow nothing less. Spending all that money on R&D then allowing everybody open access to work with it, whether or not they license that tech, just isn't going to fly anymore. It would certainly be EXCELLENT if modern business didn't so much work that way - but it does.

I totally get that you folks who need to operate in the cross-platform - cross software support space need to be concerned with this stuff. And I really feel for you.

But honestly, I've spent a good part of my morning reading about the back end of how Apples new Business Chat support system is being designed to function.

If I understand it correctly, if I'm on the phone with my vendor in order to solve a tech issue, everything OUTSIDE that narrow issue is "default walled off" from access to whomever I just gave permission to access my account. Basically, my non-related data (i.e. my Credit Card info) is security veiled to ANYONE pulling up "my account." unless I agree to let them access THAT pile of personal info.

THAT seems a ton more important to me right now than which cards can go into a future eGPU unit.

I'm remembering all the times I've dealt with Banking, Telco, even the freeking Cable TV provider - and have been specifically asked "do I have permission to access your account data?" and and now with all the latest news, I'm wondering just what sort of window into my personal data history that 20-something employee in a cubicle farm actually had into my life.

If Apple slow walks enabling my access to multiple card vendors on one hand - at least at launch - but keeps me financially safer on the other - at least for TODAY - I'm totally OK with that.

I'm not trying to move the goalposts on this threads discussion, and I'm glad you guys are talking about this - because getting back to the convenience of cross-platform, cross-vendor compatibility is a noble goal.

I'm just saying that this game seems barely worthy of my time when there's a far more critical game being currently played out that affects me much more directly.

YMMV.

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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greg janza
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 7:59:54 pm

[Bill Davis] "If Apple slow walks enabling my access to multiple card vendors on one hand - at least at launch - but keeps me financially safer on the other - at least for TODAY - I'm totally OK with that."

So do I understand that you're more interested in walled off access to your account info than getting the most for your money on your technology investments?

Bottom line is that Apple is limiting access not to account info but instead to the best component technology available in the marketplace and I would think that that would be a deal breaker for those looking to create the best possible computer systems for professional use.

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Steve Connor
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 8:42:37 pm

[greg janza] "Bottom line is that Apple is limiting access not to account info but instead to the best component technology available in the marketplace and I would think that that would be a deal breaker for those looking to create the best possible computer systems for professional use.
"


But they ARE doing a great job of optimising FCPX for ATi cards and if you're an FCPX user then that's a great thing. Resolve also seems to be working well with ATi cards as well, so it's not a deal breaker for people like me who want to stay on the Mac platform.

If I was working in 3D or using only Premiere Pro then I might think differently as they both benefit much more from faster GPU cards

"Traditional NLEs have timelines. FCPX has storylines" W.Soyka


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Bill Davis
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Mar 31, 2018 at 8:49:07 pm

[greg janza] "So do I understand that you're more interested in walled off access to your account info than getting the most for your money on your technology investments? "

Absolutely.

If I fail to save $1500 by needing to buy a new GPU card with a different interface - I won't like that, but I can easily weather it. It's a short term investment for a long term gain.

If some data access breach lets some asshat access my digital content repository and rip off ALL my content and start to peddle it cheaply in overseas - that's a MUCH bigger financial vulnerability in the long run.

One messes up a business day, or week, or maybe even month. The other can bring a whole business down.

I'm thinking of Frame.io right now. When they secured that big financing round last summer, I recall them noting that a BIG chunk of it was going into Data Security.

Apple is apparently doing EXACTLY the same with its Business Chat System. Plumbing in extra data security by default in ways that require the user to do nothing further to achieve the gains.

It's kind of the overall Apple product strategy, after all. Charge once, iterate thereafter without additional burden to the user.

The digital content universe is increasingly the primary global economic playing field - and it's ALL big data networks now.

And data safety and security will likely win out over time.

That would be my bet anyway.

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Misha Aranyshev
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Apr 2, 2018 at 8:54:00 am

If Resolve is one of the only couple of thing that matters then you probably know well that it could use an Nvidia GPU in a Thunderbolt expansion box before this system update. It is things like hot plug and internal screen acceleration that didn't work.


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Oliver Peters
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Apr 2, 2018 at 1:47:34 pm

There are starting to be some issues reported with this update. So far Duet is the only specific one I've seen other than some generalized fan issues on some machines.

https://help.duetdisplay.com/faq/305404-macos-10-13-4-support

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Oliver Peters
Re: eGPU support in OSX 10.13.4
on Apr 2, 2018 at 3:21:45 pm

Also FYI - it appears that with this update, eGPU support has been removed for TB1 and TB2 devices. If that's you, DON'T update past 10.13.3. Whether or not any of the Apple apps gain an advantage is questionable. Seems like there's acceleration in playback but not exports. This isn't official news, but rather what other users have surmised, tested and posted elsewhere.

Also, Bare Feats:
http://barefeats.com/rmbp_node_pro.html

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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