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Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D

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Mike Jackson
Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 15, 2011 at 9:02:37 am

I am about do do a series around the world on a 5Dmk2 and a 7D and I was interested if anyone has any opinions on frame rates and shutter speeds.The series is to be delivered in PAL and therefore I was going to shoot it at 25p -1/50.While this will work fine for Britain and other PAL countries I know I will run into problems in Time Square for example with Flicker from flouro and neon.Has any one had experience with the 5d in this situation, where on a video camera I could always correct it with Clear scan or simply change shutter speed.I have heard changing the shutter to a 1/60 in 25p does not completely eliminate flicker.In which case the alternative would be to shoot it at 30p or 60p and convert when we go back to post.Not having a post background, I am not sure how difficult this is. I can shoot interviews with DC lighting so I can still shoot 25p to avoid pitch adjustment.Am I making this too complicated by switching between the frame rates for post or should I shoot every thing in the USA in 30p 60p and just convert the whole lot.
I am sure some editors out there will have some good advice for me.
Thanks
Mike


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Peter Burger
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 15, 2011 at 9:27:58 am

IMHO the least thing I would do is use footage with different framerates in one project. Especially with 25 and 30 fps...

Had to do this a couple of times and results where... well... time- and work-intensive and not really stunning.

So, what I would do is try to maintain a constant framerate troughout the whole production whenever possible.

Just my two cents.

------------------------------------------
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot." - Buster Keaton


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Mike Jackson
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 15, 2011 at 9:36:30 am

Thanks Peter
Unfortunately if the 1/60 shutter at 25p doesn't fix it ,I dont see what choice I have other than to shoot 30p or 60p.Some say 60 p is better for converting ,Is that right?
Mike


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Peter Burger
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 15, 2011 at 10:08:33 am

Can't say anything about "non-PAL flicker-issues", since I was around in Europe quite a lot but haven't worked in the US or any other NTSC country. Sorry.

But: Conversion of 60fps to 25fps is just as problematic as 30fps to 25fps... AND you'll have to shoot 720p with the Canons if you want to use 60fps. No FullHD with 60fps.

------------------------------------------
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot." - Buster Keaton


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Mike Jackson
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 15, 2011 at 10:12:40 am

Quite right
Thanks again for taking the time.
Cheers
Mike


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Peter Burger
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 17, 2011 at 9:47:36 am

[Mike Jackson] "Unfortunately if the 1/60 shutter at 25p doesn't fix it ,I dont see what choice I have other than to shoot 30p or 60p."

Maybe I don't see all consequences in framerate/shutterspeed selections, but IMHO, if you choose a shutterspeed of 60 flickering issues will be the same either with 25p or 30p, since the exposure time of each frame is the same (1/60th of a second).

Can anyone confim that? Or am I totally wrong?

------------------------------------------
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot." - Buster Keaton


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Mike Jackson
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 17, 2011 at 10:04:39 am

What you say Peter sounds right but I don't know. As you say maybe some one can chime In and let us know.24 p is sounding like a good starting point as it is available as a PAL setting and experiment with shutter . Who do I know with a 5D that happens to be near time square or similar American cacophony of neon , flouro and LEDs ?


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Peter Burger
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 15, 2011 at 9:34:08 am

What came to my mind right now:

Or you could shoot 24p. Should be usable any in country. If in doubt do a PAL upspeed of 4% (which is common) in post for PAL countries and a pulldown to 30p (which is common as well) for NTSC countries.

Shutterspeeds between 50 and 60 to eliminate flickering...

------------------------------------------
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot." - Buster Keaton


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Brent Dunn
Re: Frame Rates for Global Doco on 5D2 and 7D
on Jul 16, 2011 at 4:50:45 am

There is a preset for Flourescent in the white balance that helps with banding.

Brent Dunn
Owner / Director / Editor
DunnRight Films
DunnRight Video.com
Video Marketing Toolbox.net

Sony EX-1,
Canon 5D Mark II
Canon 7D
Mac Pro Tower, Quad Core,
with Final Cut Studio

HP i7 Quad laptop
Adobe CS-5 Production Suite





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