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Jeffery Wood
Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 12, 2011 at 4:51:53 pm

We have an ensemle consisting of 3 Altos, 3 sophranos, and 3 tenors it has been hard for me to mix them to gert the sound blended doe anyone have any ideas or techniques that would help me with mixing them!!


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Ty Ford
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 12, 2011 at 10:18:15 pm

Hello Jeffrey and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum.

Is this for on camera?

Regards,

Ty Ford

Cow Audio Forum Leader
Want better production audio?: Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide


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Jeffery Wood
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 1:42:35 pm

No we are not on camera just live Audience in Church!!


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Jordan Wolf
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 2:18:03 am

If there is any way to record each instrument individually, that would be best for maintaining control over the mix; if you can't do that, try recording the 3 groups of mics (that is, submixes of each of the 3 groups).

My main question to the OP is: how are the antennas for all those systems being combined? You might be okay, but if the transmitters get too far from the receivers, there may be more hash and interference because of the interaction of the RF between receiver units.

Wolf
<><


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Jeffery Wood
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 1:39:33 pm

ALl our Mics run through a Senheizer Antenna Distrubution system with Two omni directional Antennas. The ensemle sings for a live Audience with 9 singers and we are currently not recording the group..


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Ty Ford
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 5:37:40 pm

Jeffrey,

Thanks for the intel. Are you using handheld or lav mics?

Regards,

Ty Ford

Cow Audio Forum Leader
Want better production audio?: Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide


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Jeffery Wood
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 6:07:09 pm

Handhelds G3's


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Ty Ford
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 6:44:09 pm

OK, got it.

So what do you want to know about mixing? What's the problem?

Do they usually use 9 mics when they perform?

Regards,

Ty Ford

Cow Audio Forum Leader
Want better production audio?: Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide


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Jeffery Wood
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 7:11:15 pm

Yes they sing with 9 mics if all the members of the ensemlbe is present. Whwt I am having a probelm with is mixing the audio so everyone sounds Blended together with Soloist I try to Blend them so they are just above the rest of the group. What need help with are they any Techniques or mixing procedures that are available that can help me with mixing them!!


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Eric Toline
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 8:03:39 pm

I hate to be blunt but experience and your ears are your best teachers. Live mixing is the best teacher, there is no take 2.


Eric


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Ty Ford
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 13, 2011 at 10:12:45 pm

Jeffrey,

There's no plug and play solution to mixing audio well. You sort of have to have a head for it.

I would suggest you route everyone but the soloist to a sub group fader and use that to change their combined level with one fader.

BTW, if they aren't hearing themselves properly, they will strain and over or under perform. Do they use stage monitors?

Why the aversion to compressors?

Regards,

Ty Ford

Cow Audio Forum Leader
Want better production audio?: Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide


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Jeffery Wood
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 14, 2011 at 11:58:19 am

Yes they use stage monitors and the reason of compressors is that they would set the limit of how much output each mic has so they will not go above the set level!!


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Ty Ford
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 14, 2011 at 1:42:08 pm

Jeffrey,

Actually limiters keep a signal from going over a set level. Compressors reduce dynamic range.

Is their performance so erratic that you need something like that?

First find out if they are each hearing themselves enough in the monitors to blend. Help them do that by tweeking the monitor mix. Then once they have a blend, mix each mic to the main PA.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Cow Audio Forum Leader
Want better production audio?: Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide


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Steve Kownacki
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 14, 2011 at 12:50:48 pm

Also consider asking the talent to work with you. Treat them as professionals and they in turn should help you by keeping the mic at a proper distance and deliver a consistent performance, this will help minimize variables in levels from the source. And like Ty pointed out, make sure they can hear themselves so they feel themselves in the mix - it's not a competition.

Steve






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Ty Ford
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 14, 2011 at 12:55:02 pm

Once you have a proper monitor mix that accurately reflect what's going on, they will be able to blend a lot better on their own and your job will be exponentially easier.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Cow Audio Forum Leader
Want better production audio?: Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide


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Jordan Wolf
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 15, 2011 at 3:17:11 am

"[What] I am having a probelm with is mixing the audio so everyone sounds Blended together with Soloist I try to Blend them so they are just above the rest of the group. What need help with are they any Techniques or mixing procedures that are available that can help me with mixing them!!"

Okay, well let's see...

My first question is: what is the purpose behind you mixing this group? Do they want an accurate representation of their sound to the audience, or are they wanting a "CD quality" type of performance?

I have always felt that sound reinforcement was just that - a way to reproduce what is coming in and getting that same experience to every seat.

My recommendation is to have the group do a run through of one of their songs while you sit back in the audience. Listen for what is lacking...probably the basses and tenors and maybe even some low altos, if there are any. Those are what you need to reinforce simply because they do not carry well.

I enjoy using compression, but in small amounts. What you may want to look into is using buss compression. If you are able to, route each voice section (bass, tenor, alto, soprano) to it own subgroup. Compress each subgroup separately so that the relation of the voices is maintained. I wouldn't go for more than a 3:1 ratio and would keep the attack fairly fast and the release slower, to prevent pumping on fast movements.

When there's a solo, you can do a quick switch on their channel by taking it out of the subgroup and putting it into the main buss so it isn't affected by the compression.

One other thing to try is to boost the high mids (i.e. intelligibility) on the solo channel. That could make them "pop" a bit more from the background.

I hope these ideas get you thinking. Don't be afraid to try stuff, but do your best to make it during rehearsals and not soundcheck.

Keep us posted!

Wolf
<><


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Steve Kownacki
Re: Blending 9 Senheizer G3 mics at one time with no compressors
on Sep 26, 2011 at 11:37:18 am

This may also be of interest. Richard Crowley posted in a recent thread about classroom recording. http://www.homestudiocorner.com/the-31-rule/
Or the whole thread http://mobi.creativecow.net/thread/30/867182

Steve






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