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Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?

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Michael Tiemann
Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 2:55:09 pm

Because Adobe killed the garbage matte and is not bringing it back, I need a better solution to creating mattes whose size and location I can animate. I don't want to learn AE. My idea was to create a large circular matte that almost, but does not quite, fill the my largest frame size, then scale it up to make the matte "disappear" (as it expands to being larger than the frame size) or scale it down to focus on a specific region of the image. The problem is, when I scale it down, the matte no longer fills the frame and what is visible around it should not be visible. Indeed, it should precisely follow the behavior or whatever the matte's border is doing (being opaque, semi-transparent, red, blue, etc).

In some programs, shrinking an image causes edge pixels to be used to fill in what's missing, rather than leaving things transparent. Any way to do that in PPro?

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Alex Udell
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 3:42:23 pm

What resolution are you working at?

I'd suggest making the matte oversized...with a ton of border....


when using it in your timeline I'd suggest then using "Scale to frame size" in the clip context menu in the timeline.

this would give you the ability to repo/scale you are looking for I think...

Alex Udell
Editing, Motion Graphics, and Visual FX
Let's Connect on Linkedin
Examples: Retail Automotive Motion Graphics Spots
Example: Customer Facing Explainer Video
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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 4:43:17 pm

For now I've made an 8192x8192 matte. When I scale to 30% size it gives me the right sized porthold and when I scale it to 360% size (a 12x total zoom) the porthole expands to reveal the underlying image. But...God help me when I want to render UHD-sized images with clean matte edges after scaling up, instead of down!

The beauty of the garbage matte was that one could simply animate the locations of the handles and it would shrink, expand, or move however was needed. What an amazing new world we live in where such basic functionality disappears with an "upgrade".

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Alex Udell
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 4:58:59 pm

Are you track matting?

What exactly are you trying to do?

Alex Udell
Editing, Motion Graphics, and Visual FX
Let's Connect on Linkedin
Examples: Retail Automotive Motion Graphics Spots
Example: Customer Facing Explainer Video
Example: Infotainment & Package editorial


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 3:48:43 pm

I'll guess your requirements for animated garbage mattes are pretty loose. Whew.

Dave LaRonde
Promotion Producer
KGAN (CBS) & KFXA (Fox) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Daniel Waldron
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 7:16:23 pm

Do you have a screenshot of what you're trying to achieve? It's a bit unclear for me. The garbage matte has been replaced by masks and in most cases you can just keyframe a mask on the opacity parameter to achieve the previous effect.


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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 18, 2017 at 9:23:33 pm

Here's a YouTube video showing my attempts to use an 8K x 8K mask. The first two examples work, and the third fails. But really, they all fail, because it should be possible to animate the shape of a mask in PPro, as was the case with the garbage matte.







Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 19, 2017 at 11:07:38 am

I am unhappy to report that Adobe Premiere Pro CC 2017 seems to run completely out of gas when I increase the mask size to 12K x 12K. The time it takes to render the video preview jumps from next-to-nothing to 30 minutes for a 20 second video clip. And the alpha computation changes tremendously (probably because software and hardware render are that different, and I've really never noticed because the idea of using software-only render for RED media is such a ridiculous proposition.

More and more it looks to me like the answer is "Use AE. Premiere Pro is not designed to support features like resolution-independent, animatable masks."

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Blaise Douros
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 21, 2017 at 12:36:25 am

Try animating the mask shape keyframes, rather than the Scale property. Or the Mask Expansion property. It looks like you're trying to use a Color Matte with partial transparency, and animating the Scale property of the Matte rather than the mask itself?


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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 21, 2017 at 1:02:49 am

Please tell me how to access mask shape keyframes! Thatxs really what I want. I don't see how mask expansion does what i want. Its for featering, not actual scaling.

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 21, 2017 at 3:05:12 am

I take it back...mask expansion is a great answer, but only in the case that the mask is relatively near the center of the frame. With a mask expansion of -220, I can shrink the mask down to the size I want, and with an expansion of 900 I can get it to expand past the edges of the frame. But if the mask is near the edge, not near the center, the 1000 max value of mask expansion is not enough to expand past the far edge of the frame. (It barely expands past the center, to be honest.)

If I could animate the center point of the mask, that would solve my problem. But I don't see any way to do that.

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Blaise Douros
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 23, 2017 at 4:52:32 pm

Just enable Mask Shape keyframes. Then drag the center point to where you want. Mask Shape encompasses size, shape, and position.

You need to read up on how masks work in Premiere. The documentation has basically everything you need to know.

https://helpx.adobe.com/premiere-pro/using/masking-tracking.html


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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 23, 2017 at 4:57:56 pm

Thanks for the response, but your answer makes no sense to me. There's nothing moving in the image for Premiere Pro to track. I want to be the one to say "first, go here, then go there". If I can create some kind of default track and then force it to track from one location to another, I'm happy. But if masks cannot move but for the magic of the tracker finding something to track, then that's not a solution for me.

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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Blaise Douros
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 23, 2017 at 6:25:20 pm

Sigh. Read very carefully.

Position your mask, and set a Mask Path keyframe. Then move your transport a few frames, or seconds, or however long you want the movement to last. Then grab the mask, resize, reposition, whatever. A second keyframe will be automatically set to reflect the changes. Now scrub along the timeline. The mask will animate between those two keyframes. That's how you animate a mask. You don't need to track anything.

You need to spend some serious time with the Premiere documentation. I'm not saying that to be mean, or to troll you--it's just evident that there are very basic concepts that you don't understand, and it's going to hurt you in the long run. Better to learn with the manual than to rely on the kindness of Internet Strangers.


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Michael Tiemann
Re: Scaling image: can PPro fill empty pixels from edge color rather than transparency?
on Jan 23, 2017 at 7:37:49 pm

Ah! Now I see!! That's the trick I needed.

What messed me up was that when I set the Path Mask, all the handles of the mask disappeared. Which confused me, because most times you set a keyframe, all the handles, objects, etc., remain visible. It is true that the effect of the mask does remain when setting a Mask Path. But again, I was fooled by the fact that the mask outline and handles all disappeared. I did find that when I moved the transport and re-selected the overall mask, the handles reappeared, allowing me to move the mask, and set a new keyframe, whereupon all the handles and the mask outline disappeared. But the effect of the mask, now moved, gave me the effect I wanted.

THANK YOU!

Manifold Recording
Pittsboro, NC
http://manifoldrecording.com/


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