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issues with plural-eyes and proxy workflow, when working with different frame rates

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Yulal Lapira
issues with plural-eyes and proxy workflow, when working with different frame rates
on Feb 17, 2019 at 10:05:43 pm

Dear community,

I am working on a documentary project with about 200 hours. The entire project was meant to be shot 24fps (with a very little amount of 60fps drone shot), however, unintentionally, about %30 of the footage was shot in 23.976, and about 5% 29.97. The footage was shot in different resolutions: 4k, UHD, HD. This ungodly mix is sometime during the same shot, using two cams with different specs

Additionally, a lot of the external sound was recorded 44.1 HZ while the camera sound is almost always 48 HZ.

My desired workflow — which currently fails me — was:

1. ingest all original footage as is (I did use Adobe Bridge to organize my folders and file structure)
2. interperate all 23.976 as 24 - leave the 29.97 as is
3. create proxies via the premiere proxy workflow (with media encoder): creating 24 fps proxies for all footage but the 29.97.
- working all with 24fps sequences.
4. Going on for syncing using plural eyes.

And now things starting to get funky :/
When Plural eyes correct the auto drift, the proxy gets disconnected from the newly synced files, and it says I can't reconnect because the sound files of the proxy have different sound files.
So I switched it up, and synced with pluraleyes and only then creating the proxies, but it doesn't solve the main problem:

Pluraleyes can't deal with re-interpretation of frame rate. If you try to use the in-premiere extension and synchronize the re-interpreted 23.976 (now 24) it just creates new files which are 23.976.

I was thinking going back and conforming all of my 23.976 to 24 fps, however I was worried about what this would mean for the online stage... would I need to go back to the original pre-conformed files? Or I just need to conform all full res and from now on treat the new conformed file as my raw footage? These options sounded to me unwise.

So my question is -- how could I successfully work with premiere proxy system, sync with pluraleyes, and deal with all different frame rates.


I am sure I wasn't clear enough, so please ask anything that can help me explain my issue better. I have been looking for days for a solution but couldn't find one, but this can't be — no way I am the first editor running into this mess.

Thank you, everyone!!


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Bouke Vahl
Re: issues with plural-eyes and proxy workflow, when working with different frame rates
on Feb 18, 2019 at 6:18:22 am

First of all, what do you have to deliver? Why would you want to work in 24?
If it is broadcast, 23.976 would be the logical option.
(Not that it matters, you need to convert anyways at a certain stage...)
Getting from 29.97 to 24 will be ugly, from 24 to 29.97 interlaced will be good.

Why not conform the sound and do NOT relink for online? Your offline 48Khz sound will be good enough.
Upsample the 44.1 material if you must. (Wait a bit with that untill you're done reading ☺

I can't really help you with Plural Eyes, I truely hate it. And I think it was a stupid mistake to rely on that in the first place. (But as you stated yourself, the whole shebang is a mess, and no, you're not the first one getting a plate like this served.)
Don't you have any other methods of syncing? (TC being the most obvious choice.)
Clapperboard?
If you have access to the original sound files, and they have the original file creation time, that could be a start to get you at least close.

Bouke
http://www.videotoolshed.com


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Yulal Lapira
Re: issues with plural-eyes and proxy workflow, when working with different frame rates
on Feb 20, 2019 at 3:17:17 am

I will deliver 24fps, for the big screen.

My main question is what do I do with the relationship between my 23.976 to 24 footage. Do I need to conform or could I just work with proxies with different frame rates on the same sequence and just render, if my computer gets tired from playbacking different rates?

Also what kind of surprises I might have when I end up exporting my sequences and have some of the 23.976 exported to 24 fps. What should I expect at that stage?

If anybody can help me figure out what it means to edit both 23.976 and 24 on the same timeline, and if I need to give any special treatment to proxies in that regard, please let me know ☺


Pluraleyes is annoying, I can't agree more. But I don't really have any other option. Most of my clips were recorded with an external sound device which has no indication to connect with the camera footage (both sometimes don't have correct time/date data). I need to relay heavily on Plural eyes :/ (which btw is completely crap when it comes to working with proxies.)


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Yulal Lapira
Re: issues with plural-eyes and proxy workflow, when working with different frame rates
on Feb 22, 2019 at 4:44:16 pm

still can't find an answer -- trying my luck here one more time :)


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