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Sachin Desai
is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 24, 2010 at 3:34:41 pm

Hello!

I'm planing to buy a new mac pro with following configuration

Two 2.26GHz Quad-Core(8 core) Intel Xeon "Nehalem" processors
6GB (six 1GB) memory
640GB hard drive1
18x double-layer SuperDrive
ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB DDR5
DeckLink HD Extreme 3D as edit card
2TB x 3 HDD = 6TB with mac pro raid card

now I want to edit 10bit uncompressed HD 24P 1920x1080

is this mac pro raid card is capable of editing the 10bit uncompressed hd footage

i read the mac pro raid card data streams and with sata raid 5 is giving 206 mbps.

I believe if I make Striped RAID 0 it will give me much faster if i'm, not wrong.

please advice should i proceed with this configuration??

thanks

sachin

Sachin Desai


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Fred Jodry
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 24, 2010 at 9:38:30 pm

If you fire your DeckLink HD Extreme 3D up to full tilt 3D (stereo pictures) input and editing, then 206 MB per second Raid 5 will crash and probably corrupt from low data horsepower. Unfortunately if you try to run your 6 GB of data real estate without growing a single Dandelion (that`s Raid 0) in between all those Raw Audio Video takes and Raw Audio Video Edits asparagus, you`ll be in for a bad surprise of weeds really soon. You can use your 2 TB each hard drives as Raid 1 backup projects amongst other possibilities but you`re in for a surprise just how many hard drives you`ll need running Raid "0 + 1" or Raid 5 that you`ll need next to a deluxe controller card that tells the rest of the computer that here`s a good place to go taking and editing, even rendering. Raid 0 is sensible for small hard drives and economy (redo-able later) takes, not main load professional uses. I`d might as well let the other Engineers chime in on general recommendations but at least what (array) you`ll next buy can be seen on your right or left. Are you making regular flat one eye HD tv, or 3D 2 eyes HD tv?

is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
by Sachin Desai on Apr 24, 2010 at 10:34:41 am

Hello!

I'm planing to buy a new mac pro with following configuration

Two 2.26GHz Quad-Core(8 core) Intel Xeon "Nehalem" processors
6GB (six 1GB) memory
640GB hard drive1
18x double-layer SuperDrive
ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB DDR5
DeckLink HD Extreme 3D as edit card
2TB x 3 HDD = 6TB with mac pro raid card

now I want to edit 10bit uncompressed HD 24P 1920x1080

is this mac pro raid card is capable of editing the 10bit uncompressed hd footage

i read the mac pro raid card data streams and with sata raid 5 is giving 206 mbps.

I believe if I make Striped RAID 0 it will give me much faster if i'm, not wrong.

please advice should i proceed with this configuration??

thanks

sachin

Sachin Desai


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Sachin Desai
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 25, 2010 at 1:21:37 am

thanks fred for your comments...

i want to edit just flat HD Uncompressed 10bit data, it will be simple cut edit, color grading in color and from color i'll export to dpx file sequence and than final output through cinevator to print.

my original footage will come from jvc GY HMJ 700, as this camera records on SDHC cards in native fcp format but it is xdcam format and xdcam is 4:2:0 which is not good for chroma or color grading. so i've plan to capture through HD-SDi from camera itself which provides uncompressed 10bit 4:2:2 through HD-SDI output.

now suggest me, i've found out on decklink site that the data rate of uncompressed 10 bit 24P HD footage is 127 MBPS

please advice me what work flow should i follow.. i'm not in condition to afford high end raid arrays.

thanks anyways
sachin

Sachin Desai


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Bob Zelin
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 25, 2010 at 6:22:39 pm

this is so insane -
your JVC camera records at native ProRes422 or ProRes422HQ, you do NOT need to work at uncompressed HD. Your camera is not a Sony F23, Arri, or RED - ProRes422HQ is more than good enough for your camera's abilities. You can use a single SATA drive to do ProRes422HQ editing.

Bob Zelin




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Fred Jodry
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 25, 2010 at 6:45:39 pm

Sachin, Bob`s advice esentially trumps mine in that he`s already done the stuff and knows much more about the data horsepower. However I`d still recommend that you use a Raid 1 setup. Fortunately it doesn`t need 3 or 4 equal "editing workspace" hard drives, only 2 of them because it`s Raid 1 not Raid 5. Buy a small nice (deluxe) Hitachi or similar hard drive for the non-Raid operating system hard drive and you`ll have one of the 2 TB hard drives around as a spare "workspace" drive. Save some wallet`s money for what goes out of tweak someday.


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Bob Zelin
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 25, 2010 at 8:54:50 pm

what is up with your demand for an internal RAID? Get ANY external RAID with a bunch of drives, and you can do exactly what you want.
And like I said before, if you are working with the JVC camera, you are only getting ProRes422HQ images, so if you have no money, you can use a single cheap internal SATA drive for your work.

If you are doing uncompressed HD, this must be for a HI PAYING CLIENT who will give you a lot of money. Most people, including broadcast networks, fully accept ProRes422HQ without issue. Now, even AVID and Adobe support ProRes422HQ. IF you were working on an AVID, you would be editing with compressed HD (DNxHD). So what is up with your demand for uncompressed HD with your JVC camera, yet you claim that you have no money, and want to edit with uncompressed formats? All of this makes no sense to me.

Bob Zelin




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John Heagy
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 25, 2010 at 11:06:43 pm

[Bob Zelin] "with the JVC camera, you are only getting ProRes422HQ images,"

This camera records XDCam MPEG2 .mov not ProRes. No camera records internally to ProRes, that is until the Alexa ships.

10bit uncomp is overkill, thats 1200Mb/sec... HD broadcasts are only 19Mb/sec. Believe it or not Digital Cinema is only 250Mb/sec. Get yourself a KiPro and record the HDSDI output directly to ProRes(HQ) at 220Mb/sec... more than enough IMHO.



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Sachin Desai
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 26, 2010 at 10:41:20 am

Thanks for the advice.

I think you both are very right, i am not going to get better than what is recorded by the camera...

JVC Records on XDCAM 4:2:0 which they call ProHD, and i want to do a chroma work also. and after a lot of reading i found chroma keying and color grading is done better if the footage is 4:2:2.

so if I take output from SDI it would be 422 and i can capture it with prores 422 HQ and do the work easily

thats the only reason why I needed advice from pros like you...

thanks for the help...




Sachin Desai


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Bob Zelin
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 28, 2010 at 3:12:31 am

http://www.dulcesystems.com/html/video_space.html

uncompressed 10 bit HD is 157Mb/sec.



from the JVC site -
http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL101851

Professional recording with selectable data rates up to 35Mbps
1920 x 1080 (1080p24/p25/p30, 1080i60/i50)
1280 x 720P (p60/p50/p30/p25/p24)
Native file recording—world's fastest shoot-to-edit workflow.
Native Final Cut Pro format
Edit immediately without conversion or transcoding
.MP4 file format
Available with or without the optional SxS Media Recorder (eff. Oct. 09)

An out-of-the-box GY-HM700 can record to inexpensive SDHC cards (class 6 or faster) as Quicktime .MOV using the XDCAM EX codec at selectable bitrates of 19, 25 or 35Mbps. The Mpeg-2 encoder is JVC’s, the XDCAM EX codec is licensed from Sony, and the Quicktime wrapper is licensed from Apple.

Bob Zelin




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John Heagy
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 28, 2010 at 1:58:50 pm

[Bob Zelin] "uncompressed 10 bit HD is 157Mb/sec. "

No... it's 1200Mb/sec... you mean 157MB/sec. Little "b" for bits, Big "B" for Bytes.

Most codecs specs, even the names, refer to the data rate in Mega bits/sec. DV25, DNx145, DV100 (DVCProHD), AVC-I 100, ProRes, XDCam etc... The only one that uses Mega Bytes is Redcode36 which means 36MB/sec.

The devil is in the details, we don't what any spacecrafts crashing into Mars.

Anybody get that reference?

John Heagy



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Bob Zelin
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 29, 2010 at 1:44:27 am

you are correct - I am always typing to fast, and not look at what I am doing. I must be the guy that crashed into Mars.

boB Zelin




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Fred Jodry
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Apr 29, 2010 at 4:45:02 pm

By the way, Satchin originally stated he wants to make HD video at a refresh rate of "HD 24P 1920x1080", both 24 frames and fields as progressive, and as 127 MBytes per second. The listing Bob picked is probably for HD 30 P 1920 x 1080 as 157.7 MBytes per second. Sachin should determine if he`s better off with which of the two according to which out of 24P or 30P is his primary programming market and which is his secondary. Some Cameramen shoot at 60P to make least picture artifacts in both markets. (And there`s the 29.97 matter).


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Bert Sierra
Re: is Mac Pro RAID Card really capable for video
on Nov 22, 2010 at 11:11:37 pm

Definitely off topic, but I believe you’re referring to the Mars Climate Orbiter which "crashed" into Mars as a result of Lockheed Martin using one set of metric units, whereas everyone else was using SI units in their specs and calculations.

However, to give you a more detailed answer:

1) I don‘t know if you can say it truly crashed, per se, into Mars, since really it was shredded by atmospheric friction some 57km from the surface. However, it did certainly crash into Mars' atmosphere.

2) I would also argue that *every* mars surface probe has 'crashed' into Mars in some form or another. To varying degrees, most survived.


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