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LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate

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sean pollaro
LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Nov 19, 2012 at 11:56:41 pm

I hope, no, I pray someone can help me address this issue as I'm running out of time. Ive had a hell of a time trying to get my color corrected footage to translate to an HDTV properly. I'm currently shooting on RED and editing and coloring the raw files in premiere pro cs 5.5. on a Mac Pro. my final outputs are bounced from premiere via media encoder usually for either internet (vimeo) blu ray or to mpeg 2 for broadcast. The ongoing issue is that my perfectly color corrected (on an LM 2140w) footage looks great when played back on a computer monitor with quicktime or VLC but it looks way over exposed, contrasted and sharp when it plays back on an HDTV. I posted on this a while back and everyone told me that the solution to my problem was to buy this FS-LM2140W monitor for broadcast accuracy. So far this monitor hasnt helped this specific problem in any way. yesterday I went and bought a 42" samsung LCD HDTV just for reference. I plugged it into my mac via DVI-HDMI from my invidia quadro as a 2nd monitor to see how some of my CC work was translating and was shocked. the difference is like night and day! where the image is nicely balanced on the LM 2140, when played back on the HDTV the reds are badly over saturated, its very contrasted and overexposed as well. With my HDTV hooked directly in as my 2nd monitor, I decided togo ahead and tweak the footage with colorista using the HDTV as my reference. I pretty much had to turn the contrast way down, lift the shadows and bring down the mids and saturation significantly to get it looking right on the HDTV. but now on the lm 2140 it looks very flat. no color, no pop and underexposed. when i export this video and burn it to a blu ray then play that blu ray back on the same HDTV the result looks good (accurate). Its a little less saturated but the exposure and contrast are pretty close. so the file I color corrected on the HDTV looks the same when bounced to a blu ray and played back on the same HDTV. So my question is this, should I start doing 2 corrections for everything? one for internet output and another for broadcast? Should there be such a drastic difference between the 2? let me give you an idea of how drastic, on the HDTV going above 60 IRE is overexposing the image. That same image on the LM 2140W starts visually over exposing around 90 to 100 IRE. how do the pros get consistency across both platforms? I can plug in a hollywood dvd to my computer and it will look the same as on the HDTV. How do I achieve this? Everything I've read says to trust the monitor but that almost got me fired last week when a spot looked trashed out on the air. I thought it was right because it looked great on the lm 2140W but unfortunately its a different story on HDTVs and unfortunately people at home are watching it on HDTV'S not computer screens. I hope someone can help me sort this out as I have a huge deadline coming fast and I have to get this one right..


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Bram Desmet
Re: LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Nov 20, 2012 at 12:40:04 am

If things look over exposed on the HDTV at just 60 IRE then it is certainly not setup correctly. Consumer TVs usually have a bunch of over cranked defaults for showroom display. Start by turning those off and if you really want the consumer TV setup correctly consider hiring a professional calibrator to at least get it the ballpark. Consumer TVs are all over the map calibration-wise and trying to grade based off of an off the shelf consumer TV is not a good idea. If an end user complains that properly graded footage looks bad on their consumer TV then they should consider checking those settings. Grading so that 60 IRE is your max exposure tolerance range is going to make the footage look pretty terrible on any properly calibrated consumer or professional display.

Bram Desmet
FSI (Flanders Scientific, Inc.)
http://www.FlandersScientific.com


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Paul Provost
Re: LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Nov 23, 2012 at 6:36:20 pm

You are feeding an HDTV a computer signal which totally defeats the purpose of grading on the fsi through a video io card like decklink or kona (that IS how you are feeding the fsi right? )
After the grade you either need to feed your consumer HDTV through the same decklink or kona, or better yet make a bluray and play it back on your HDTV.

http://www.4Kfinish.com | owner-colorist | Hollywood, CA
http://www.facebook.com/4kFinish


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sean pollaro
Re: LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Feb 20, 2013 at 9:14:17 pm

Paul,

..Sorry I just now saw this.. Are you saying that burning my graded content onto a blu-ray and playing it back on my Samsung will show me a true rec 709 signal on my hdtv? If so Is there a way to apply a lut or something to my samsung so I can see the rec 709 colorspace realtime as I grade without having to burn up all my blu-rays? Is there a way to send a rec 709 signal directly to a consumer HDTV?


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Paul Provost
Re: LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Feb 21, 2013 at 1:58:51 am

How are you feeding the fsi

http://www.4Kfinish.com | owner-colorist | Hollywood, CA
http://www.facebook.com/4kFinish


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sean pollaro
Re: LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Feb 21, 2013 at 3:09:51 am

Flanders- SDI from a kona lhi. The HDTV is fed via the kona hdmi port.


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Paul Provost
Re: LM2140W Color Correction not HDTV accurate
on Feb 21, 2013 at 4:09:13 am

Ok so now you are feeding everything correctly. I said to burn a bluray to take any weird source issue out of the equation. If you fsi is fairly new, less than a year, it's likely very close to spec. Otherwise send it to factory for calibration. The consumer monitor is another issue. A local home theater calibration guy will be able to get it ballpark close to 709. But don't expect it to match the fsi perfectly. And many people don't like how their tv looks in 709, kinda dull compared to the factory "dynamic" setting.
next is to send a good signal out of your kona. Try your red files out of the free resolve 9.1.1 lite. Set your prefs to video range, 1080 23.98 or whatever, rawcsettings to redcolor3 redgamma3 and grade away. Point is your fsi and tv should be fairly close unless your tv is just bad, which is possible. Make sure your fsi is set to 709 video range as well. Not rgb or full.
After all this burn a bluray and play it somewhere else and see how it looks.

http://www.4Kfinish.com | owner-colorist | Hollywood, CA
http://www.facebook.com/4kFinish


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