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White Rectangle T2i

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ronn kilby
White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 18, 2010 at 9:09:38 pm

I am shooting a 90 minute feature film in January IN ONE CONTINUOUS SHOT, all hand-geld in tight spaces (yes I am crazy). I was originally going to shoot it on the Sony EX-1 but my new T2i would be MUCH better if I can just get past the record time limit. So I'm looking at recording the live signal over HDMI to a Nanoflash (or Ninja if it's out in time). I can also rent a 7D for shoot day and use the T2i for rehearsals. However, I can't get rid of the white rectangle. The only time it goes away is when the camera is recording. I want to record externally for obvious reasons. Anyone found a hack for this? OR are there any Nikon D3s or D300s folks who can verify this would be possible on the Nikons?

http://www.kilby.tv


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Shane Ross
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 18, 2010 at 9:24:32 pm

[ronn kilby] " So I'm looking at recording the live signal over HDMI to a Nanoflash (or Ninja if it's out in time)."

Not gonna work. The signal sent out via that connection just sends the VIEWFINDER screen. It will have all the info, those two grey bars...unsuable. And if you press RECORD on the camera? That signal switches and becomes an SD signal. Not to mention that once you connect HDMI to that port, you lose your LCD screen. SO you'd be shooting blind, and only capture what you see on the LCD. I think it was only meant to be used to attach an external monitor to. But then it makes the signal SD when you press record...so...

Shane



GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Steve Crow
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 2:59:26 am

Besides the HDMI issue, the first problem you are going to have is overheating - I don't think there is any way you could record even 35 or 40 minutes at one stretch on a T2i...

Also you are going to have swap out SDHC cards every 40 minutes or so.

You could get 2 or even more T2i's and stagger the recording start times but even then I think you won't have success. Try seeing if you can film a static scene for 90 minutes with 2 or 3 T2i's...I have a feeling it can't be done in a practical sense.

If you don't mind me asking, what's the point of this exercise, because I don't get it? Bottom line, the audience can't tell if it's one continuous 90 minute shot or not. If it's just for bragging rights, it wouldn't be worth it for me but maybe it is for you.

To me the quality of the production is far more important than if the entire movie is one long shot or not.


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ronn kilby
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 3:31:29 am

Guess you didn't get what I'm trying to do, Steve. I assume there would be no overheating or swapping because there would be no recording to sdhc cards - that is the whole point of going to an outboard recorder via HDMI. And yes the point is to solve the challenge presented me. Every other DP said, "that can't be done." I said in my original post that I am crazy. See "The Russian Ark" etc. The audience will notice there is no edit but then forget, then wonder how it was done. I plan to shoot a film that still has "quality of production" in spight of the challenge. Thanks for chiming in.

http://www.kilby.tv


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ronn kilby
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 3:37:07 am

Actually I've managed to turn all that stuff off while recording except the rectangle. And can't use it in record mode anyway, defeats the purpose. Looking at the GH2 - it may work for my purpose.

Two kinds of people: Those who do. And those who know it couldn't be done - or how it should have been done.

http://www.kilby.tv


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Michael Sacci
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 5:24:57 am

But you are receiving a SD feed not HD.

But if you get the 7D and you don't hit record, push that white box all the way up and record to your device. Then in post zoom in just a bit to crop out the box. If you hit record in 12 minutes you will get the stop recording message in your video.

You will need a HDMI splitter and an external monitor.

So I think you have a chance to pull off what you need with a little extra work in post. You can do the cropping in Compressor the same time you convert to ProRes if you like.

BTW, love the Russian Ark, Wish they would overdub it in english so you could just watch the video without having to read the subtitles.


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Nevin Styre
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 9:01:37 am

The T2i and all other DSLRs for that matter can't output full resolution over HDMI for live view/recording, it says it's 1080i when you are not recording but the resolution is really lower. All of them downres to a certain extent and add black bars to the image. On the T2i and 5d when you press record it switches the HDMI signal to 480p with black bars, so you are essentially getting less than standard Definition. The only way to do any proper full resolution recording is with the internal H264 recording built into the cameras, that's one of the bullets you just have to bite when you use DSLRs for video.


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Nevin Styre
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 9:02:55 am

Also all the DSLRs have a 12 minute record limit so you will need to look elsewhere if you actually plan to do a 90 minute continuos shot.


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ronn kilby
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 3:00:28 pm

Nevin: re 12 minute limit - that's why I want to record externally.

http://www.kilby.tv


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ronn kilby
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 3:05:46 pm

It would appear that the GH2 is capable of "clean" 1080i output over the HDMI while not recording. At least according to Bloom:
http://philipbloom.net/2010/09/30/my-first-look-at-the-gh2-clean-hdmi-out/

http://www.kilby.tv


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John Frey
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 4:56:18 pm

I shoot with (2)Panasonic GH1 units with hacked software. These cameras are far more video friendly than the Canons, and the GH2 is even better. No overheating, no record-time limits,the ability to adapt a multitude of prime lenses, articulating viewfinder, etc. I hope to have my GH2 before Christmas!

John D. Frey
25 Year owner/operator of two California-based production studios.

Digital West Video Productions of San Luis Obispo and Inland Images of Lake Elsinore


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Michael Sacci
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 19, 2010 at 6:31:25 pm

if you are going to use a canon you cannot hit record, but I laid out a way that it can be done.


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Theo Dubeux
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 20, 2010 at 2:43:19 am

Even if you manage to output full hd from an HDSLR, you can't have long shots. The overheating issue is caused by the sensor being exposed, it has nothing to do with the video being recorded to the card. So, if you're watching the image on the lcd (or HDMI, or elsewhere) it is heating up.


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Michael Sacci
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 20, 2010 at 5:09:10 am

What causes the overheating is all over the place but with the LCD being off the overheating is less of an issue but this is definitely an uphill battle. Maybe you build a box out of a cooler with just the lens and the wires coming out a sealed opening and you use ice packs to keep the camera cool. Put this rig on a steadicam and bam you good to go :-)


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ronn kilby
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Nov 21, 2010 at 3:19:40 pm

Did a test. The T2i times out after an hour even with the LCD off. Hopefully the GH2 will not.

http://www.kilby.tv


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James Donnelly
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Feb 2, 2011 at 11:01:21 pm

I am also looking to achieve clean output on the HDMI port.

I am running Magic Lantern, which seems to be able to get rid of the white box, but I can only seem to get 480p from the camera:

Also worth mentioning, there is an option to disable power save altogether so that live view never turns off. Could be dangerous though, as the ML manual says it might cause problems with the sensor.


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John Frey
Re: White Rectangle T2i
on Feb 3, 2011 at 1:26:43 am

Mike Figgis produced "Timecode" back in 2000 using (4)video cameras shooting in sync for a 90 minute continuous film. I saw it back then and thought it was pretty cool. Of course, Mike didn't use DSLRs! Let us know how things go.

Here's the link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timecode_(film)

John D. Frey
25 Year owner/operator of two California-based production studios.

Digital West Video Productions of San Luis Obispo and Inland Images of Lake Elsinore


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